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Author Topic: Possible #2s  (Read 6117 times)

Alkie

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Possible #2s
« on: December 08, 2006, 06:42:07 pm »
Some longshots, some easily-doable:

Josh Beckett
AJ Burnett
Chris Capuano
Jon Garland
Jon Leiber
Kevin Millwood
Mark Mulder
Jake Peavy
Ben Sheets
Jeff Suppan

Feel free to add or subtract.  For Halladay and Wells, you think we need to give up Roy, Lance, and the Crawford Boxes?
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BizidyDizidy

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2006, 06:44:06 pm »
Brad Penny?
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Alkie

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2006, 06:45:28 pm »
I had him on the list, but took him off because the Dodgers said they wanted a MLB superstar bat in return.  We have two, but I have a feeling they ain't goin' nowheres.
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BizidyDizidy

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2006, 06:46:27 pm »
I wouldn't mind Mulder, not one bit. Has he had any traction anywhere?
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Froback

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2006, 06:47:40 pm »
I like the idea of Mulder.  I think he could be had for some incentive type deal, knowing he won't pitch a full year this year.  Do some deal like 3 Mil that can be as much as 12 if he pitches 200IP, something like 1 Mil if you pitch at all and 2 Mil for each 50IP you pitch, with a team option for $13 Mil the next season that vests if you hit 150IP.

How would that sound?
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Alkie

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2006, 06:50:50 pm »
My feeling on that is: if he wanted a deal like that, he'd be a Royal already.

Or a Yankee.
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Froback

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2006, 06:52:27 pm »
Yeah, you are probably right.  But I still like his potential more than anyone else.

I did notice Zito was not on your list... Not sure he is worth what he wants, but if Peavy is there, I think there is as good a chance at getting Zito as there is in getting Peavy (like 0.1%).
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Alkie

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2006, 06:53:42 pm »
Zito ain't on my list because we ain't on his.
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No? in Austin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2006, 06:55:55 pm »
Add Jason Jennings to the list.  That deal ain't dead yet.
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Alkie

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2006, 06:56:55 pm »
You know something or just "sayin'?"
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Froback

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2006, 06:57:42 pm »
Quote:

Add Jason Jennings to the list.  That deal ain't dead yet.


That's true... Where is Zipp?
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hostros7

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2006, 06:58:42 pm »
What about Hudson?  I thought I have read in some--probably very reputable *cough*- newsprint that he might be available.
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Froback

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2006, 06:59:41 pm »
I thought the only reason Hudson was to be moved was to make salary room for Glavine... now that is a moot point.
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Alkie

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2006, 07:00:17 pm »
If that's true, put his ass on the list.
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hostros7

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2006, 07:00:53 pm »
Same goes for Blanton and Haren of the A's.
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Froback

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2006, 07:02:54 pm »
How bad would it be if the Astros go into ST with a rotation of:

Oswalt
Williams
Hirsh
Albers
Buchholz

Just ask'n?  Maybe see if you can pry Baldelli from TB.
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Arky Vaughan

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2006, 07:04:17 pm »
Quote:

Just ask'n?  Maybe see if you can pry Baldelli from TB.



I can't see Baldelli pitching 200 innings next season.
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hostros7

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2006, 07:06:10 pm »
Pulling Baldelli from the Rays won't happen without the Astros trading Albers, Bucholz, or Hirsh, however much an Astros rotation with all three of them had an "out of the playoffs" ring to it to begin with.

sorry.
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BizidyDizidy

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2006, 07:07:09 pm »
Quote:

Pulling Baldelli at from the Rays ain't gonna probably to let the Astros have Albers, Bucholz, and Hirsh as the rotation, however much of an "out of the playoffs" ring it may have had to it to begin with.



A new standard of incomprehensbility. Bravo!
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Jose Cruz III

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2006, 07:12:52 pm »
Quote:

Pulling Baldelli at from the Rays ain't gonna probably to let the Astros have Albers, Bucholz, and Hirsh as the rotation, however much of an "out of the playoffs" ring it may have had to it to begin with.

Huh??
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OldBlevins

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2006, 07:13:09 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Pulling Baldelli at from the Rays ain't gonna probably to let the Astros have Albers, Bucholz, and Hirsh as the rotation, however much of an "out of the playoffs" ring it may have had to it to begin with.



A new standard of incomprehensbility. Bravo!



Sounds like someone used Babelfish again.
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No? in Austin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2006, 07:16:14 pm »
Quote:

You know something or just "sayin'?"



Just know he should be on the list.  He ain't dead yet!
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BizidyDizidy

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2006, 07:19:55 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

You know something or just "sayin'?"



Just know he should be on the list.  He ain't dead yet!



 He's just pinin' for the fjords
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JaneDoe

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2006, 07:23:33 pm »
What does Zito want?  Or should I ask---What does Boras want?
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schlumburger04

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2006, 07:23:35 pm »
millood and burnett just signed 5 year deals last year and are on teams needing SP bad, theyre not going anywhere

penny is more of an option
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No? in Austin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #25 on: December 08, 2006, 07:26:53 pm »
Quote:

What does Zito want?  Or should I ask---What does Boras want?



To wait until the Mets are pinned into a corner and need to cough up a ton of money.  Zito won't be signing anything until late January, early February and it will be the Mets bidding against themselves.

Same ol' Boras, same ol' Mets.
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No? in Austin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2006, 07:36:05 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

You know something or just "sayin'?"



Just know he should be on the list.  He ain't dead yet!



Oh, and don't leave out Jake Westbrook, although I think he's a longer shot than Garland.  Also Javier Vazquez may wind up on the blocks now that the ChiSox think longer and harder about Garland's value.

But they won't get Houston to offer (or even consider) a three for one like they may have with Garland.
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DVauthrin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2006, 07:52:58 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

You know something or just "sayin'?"



Just know he should be on the list.  He ain't dead yet!



Oh, and don't leave out Jake Westbrook, although I think he's a longer shot than Garland.  Also Javier Vazquez may wind up on the blocks now that the ChiSox think longer and harder about Garland's value.

But they won't get Houston to offer (or even consider) a three for one like they may have with Garland.



I don't think it will take long for the Astros to make a deal.   The garland speculation tells me they have options ready to pounce on now.   As far as Andy, this pisses me off.  Because he was dishonest from the start.    And the hendricks brothers are right next to Boras in terms of scum.   They pulled this crap when Roger was in toronto and the team had a trade worked out for him.
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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2006, 07:57:44 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

You know something or just "sayin'?"



Just know he should be on the list.  He ain't dead yet!



Oh, and don't leave out Jake Westbrook, although I think he's a longer shot than Garland.  Also Javier Vazquez may wind up on the blocks now that the ChiSox think longer and harder about Garland's value.

But they won't get Houston to offer (or even consider) a three for one like they may have with Garland.



I don't think it will take long for the Astros to make a deal.   The garland speculation tells me they have options ready to pounce on now.   As far as Andy, this pisses me off.



I don't think anyone associated with the Houston Astros or even Andy's teammates last year were surprised to hear today's news that he's headed back east.

Lance Berkman told anyone who would listen two days ago that Andy (and Roger) were going back to New York.  Houston has been working on the parameters of deals because of it, but held on to the idea that Pettitte just might want to come back.

But the Astros also wanted him back under their terms not Andy's.  It was about money plain and simple and the Yankees can outbid anyone when they target a guy.  Houston wasn't going to get into a bidding war with another New York team.

No frickin' way.  Time to move on!
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DVauthrin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2006, 08:00:51 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

You know something or just "sayin'?"



Just know he should be on the list.  He ain't dead yet!



Oh, and don't leave out Jake Westbrook, although I think he's a longer shot than Garland.  Also Javier Vazquez may wind up on the blocks now that the ChiSox think longer and harder about Garland's value.

But they won't get Houston to offer (or even consider) a three for one like they may have with Garland.



I don't think it will take long for the Astros to make a deal.   The garland speculation tells me they have options ready to pounce on now.   As far as Andy, this pisses me off.



I don't think anyone associated with the Houston Astros or even Andy's teammates last year were surprised to hear today's news that he's headed back east.

Lance Berkman told anyone who would listen two days ago that Andy (and Roger) were going back to New York.  Houston has been working on the parameters of deals because of it, but held on to the idea that Pettitte just might want to come back.

But the Astros also wanted him back under their terms not Andy's.  It was about money plain and simple and the Yankees can outbid anyone when they target a guy.  Houston wasn't going to get into a bidding war with another New York team.

No frickin' way.  Time to move on!



I agree.   However, I don't think it takes more than a few days for the astros to announce a signing or trade of a number 2 caliber starting pitcher.   Who that is I don't know?

It also could open money for Huff, depending on the price of the pitcher acquired.
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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #30 on: December 08, 2006, 08:05:35 pm »
Quote:

It also could open money for Huff, depending on the price of the pitcher acquired.



Yes.  Yes it does. (Especially if Ensberg is one of the trading chips, which saves you even more money).
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DVauthrin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #31 on: December 08, 2006, 10:35:09 pm »
I want huff to be back myself.   A 3-4-5 of Lance-Lee-Huff would be the best 3-4-5 since Kent/Beltran left, and on par with the lance-kent-bagwell 3-4-5 we had a few years prior.

Huff and a SP(garland, peavy, jennings, suppan, willis, westbrook, whomever) sounds good to me.
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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #32 on: December 08, 2006, 11:10:41 pm »
Quote:

I want huff to be back myself.   A 3-4-5 of Lance-Lee-Huff would be the best 3-4-5 since Kent/Beltran left, and on par with the lance-kent-bagwell 3-4-5 we had a few years prior.



Yeah.  Get this: Lance-Lee-Huff-Scott-Gimenez.  If Scott and Gimenez perform, that is a pretty damn good middle to bottom of the lineup.  All left handed hitters sans Lee, who can hit right handed pitchers like he's a lefty!  You put Burke and Biggio at the top and Everett at the #8.

Then at mid-season, if Clemens says he wants to pitch elsewhere even if the Astros have a killer offense going for them, then good ridince.  Find another lame duck free agent starter you can turn into the 2007 Jeff Weaver that helps you in the post season.  A Lane/Scott platoon in right will work and Burke and a late inning replacement of Mike Rodriquez makes for a very good top of the lineup combo and a darn good offense/defense combo for centerfield.  The bullpen can stay strong too.

Houston has a very good chance to put together a fine competitive team to start the season and then adjust by mid-season if they need a bat or an arm, all depending on how either Scott or Lane do or any of the young starters do.

One of the cornerstones of the team would be the return of the Bagwell-Berkman-Kent middle of the order with Berkman-Lee-Huff if it works out that way.
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DVauthrin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #33 on: December 08, 2006, 11:35:19 pm »
What kind of hitter is Gimenez?   I haven't really seen a good scouting report on him.

But for years the Astros never had good lefty sticks.   And next year I hope/expect to see at least 3 of them in the opening day lineup in scott, lance and huff.  

In my ideal world you trade Ensberg for pitching, preferably the starter package, and resign huff at 8-9 mil over 3/4 years.   You platoon biggio/burke home/away, and you have lamb as the insurance policy if scott doesn't perform.

I just don't think it takes long now for a pitcher to be acquired and hopefully for the resigning of Huff.
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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #34 on: December 08, 2006, 11:52:13 pm »
Quote:

What kind of hitter is Gimenez?   I haven't really seen a good scouting report on him.



He did really well as a #6 hitter in the Round Rock lineup.  That was hitting behind guys having great seasons (Scott and House).  His best side (he's a switch hitter) is batting lefty.  He hits really well left handed, has a ways to go hitting right handed.  If Houston uses two young starters next year, having Gimenez as a catcher for either one and then possibly for Williams (a veteran who can call his own game), then you have the potential of grooming a really good defensive catcher into an very good game caller and #7 hitter in this lineup.  By season's end, you may have a find on your hands.  The heir apparent for Brad Ausmus for sure in that case.  I like seeing a lineup of that many leftys hitting in the middle against tough right handed pitchers.  Helps win your fair share (and more) of the games.  At least gives you a good advantage on your side.

Quote:

But for years the Astros never had good lefty sticks.   And next year I hope/expect to see at least 3 of them in the opening day lineup in scott, lance and huff.



Mike Rodriquez hits left handed as well and is very good at waiting on the pitch.  He lets the ball get deep into the zone before he swings.  So he gets a lot of his hits to left and left center.  He's a very capable leadoff hitter.  So on some days you can really stack your lineup with left handed bats.  Rodriquez reminds me of the days Scott Podsednick would terrorize the Astros.  He can be a very serviceable #5 outfielder and occasional starter next year.  So that is potentially five lefty hitters of eight slots in the lineup.

Nice!  

Quote:

In my ideal world you trade Ensberg for pitching, preferably the starter package, and resign huff at 8-9 mil over 3/4 years.



Mine too.  You make Ensberg a part of the deal to keep the other team away from Lidge (who I wouldn't trade) and Wheeler (definitely won't trade).  Add Taveras and then a lower rung prospect (not Estrada, but it may come to that) or a Buchholz, you could get a pretty darn good #2.

Quote:

You platoon biggio/burke home/away, and you have lamb as the insurance policy if scott doesn't perform.



I'd start Burke in center, bring in Rodriquez as a late inning defensive replacement and move Burke to second.  Then on occasion I start Rodriquez and Burke and sit Biggio.  Platoon Lane/Scott.  Bring in Palmeiro as a late inning defensive replacement in left.  Make Ausmus a defensive replacement in the games Gimenez starts (who also has a cannon of an arm... better than Quintero or anybody else Houston has tried recently).

Quote:

I just don't think it takes long now for a pitcher to be acquired and hopefully for the resigning of Huff.



You still may need one more solid utility guy for defense in case you want to move Huff out late in the game.  Someone who can occasionally start a few games at third as well.  I mentioned Billy Hall sometime ago, but he's not on the blocks.  I think if the Astros can find that guy, they'll have a darn good team next year.

And they'll have to spend the cayshe on Huff and a #2 to make it work.
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DVauthrin

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #35 on: December 09, 2006, 12:03:55 am »
How does the organization feel about Burke in CF?   Mainly talking range/routes on balls in the outfield.  We all know his arm is a work in progress at best.

And if you had to take your best guess, which pitcher do you think the team ends up with?  My best guess would be either jennings or suppan or garland.
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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #36 on: December 09, 2006, 12:22:25 am »
Quote:

How does the organization feel about Burke in CF?



Serviceable.  Jason Lane has the best arm next to Willy Taveras, so that is why the experiment to put him in center is viable as well.

Quote:

Mainly talking range/routes on balls in the outfield.  We all know his arm is a work in progress at best.



Well, they tried both Lance Berkman and Craig Biggio in the same centerfield at MMPUS.  Berkman actually did well while Biggio made the pitchers cry.  I think Burke can play adequately enough to keep most pitchers happy.  Not all, but most.  I'm of the opinion that Willy Taveras is just being asked for more in trade scenarios than Burke is.  I'm sure Houston would trade Burke and keep Taveras if they had too, but if it means getting a good #2, you don't let Taveras be the hang up for the deal.

Quote:

And if you had to take your best guess, which pitcher do you think the team ends up with?  My best guess would be either jennings or suppan or garland.



I think Jason Jennings.  No particular reason other than I've heard his name more than once and it just seems they can work something out if Houston can make a package work for Colorado.  The Rockies just need to get off Dan Wheeler and possibly settle for Jason Hirsh instead.  Don't really have inside information on this, just that I think they can make it happen.

Jennings is a one year rental though, but that may work to Houston's advantage in terms of price tag.
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jaklewein

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #37 on: December 09, 2006, 12:45:59 am »
 Jennings is a one year rental though, but that may work to Houston's advantage in terms of price tag.

As long as we're willing to deal for a one year rental...how's about taking a shot on a bounce back year from Mark Buehrle?  At the bare minimum the guy should be good for 200 innings...

My guess is that the ChiSox would love to deal him...and as you said with Jennings, a one year rental might lower the asking price.
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Tralfaz

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Re: Possible #2s
« Reply #38 on: December 09, 2006, 02:45:04 am »
It is only fair that we now sign Suppan.
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