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astrox

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The Reds Making Moves
« on: July 13, 2006, 05:16:39 pm »
 link

It seems that Kearns has been an Astro Killah of late.  It's good to get him out of the division.
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pravata

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2006, 05:27:18 pm »
Quote:

link

It seems that Kearns has been an Astro Killah of late.  It's good to get him out of the division.



Kearns and Lopez for a couple relievers?  Relievers?  Hopefully this doesn't set the market.
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MusicMan

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2006, 05:28:44 pm »
It's good to see that Krivsky has finally eaten the Skyline Chili.

What an unbelievably bad deal for the Reds.
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jasonact

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2006, 05:30:47 pm »
Wow. Big trade, but I'm not sure how much it helps the Reds. Gary Majewski is a good pick up, but I struggle to see how the rest of the deal helps. Clayton is a downgrade from Lopez.
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HurricaneDavid

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2006, 05:30:49 pm »
Another GM dealing with his former club.
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S.P. Rodriguez

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2006, 05:35:15 pm »
For what it's worth, I saw that trade and wondered what Krivsky was up to.  Although, he has to know something we don't (duh???) because I will never suspect Bowden of making a good trade.
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Bench

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2006, 05:36:26 pm »
Majewski is very solid, but tossing in Lopez is the shocker.

It seems that the Reds finally gave up on Kearns, but I figured him, Wagner and another of the players would be enough to get Majewski (who, if I recall correctly is only in his second or third year, thus being cheap and keepable for a long time).
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Twoniner

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2006, 10:17:43 pm »
  What would you be willing to give the Nats to get Felipe Lopez for the Stros?
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Zan

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2006, 10:27:18 pm »
Quote:

link

It seems that Kearns has been an Astro Killah of late.  It's good to get him out of the division.



Reds are trying to experience as many Houstonians as possible.
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JimR

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2006, 11:20:22 pm »
why???????????????????????????
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Dobro

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2006, 11:49:15 pm »
Quote:

 What would you be willing to give the Nats to get Felipe Lopez for the Stros?


Not a damn thing.
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No? in Austin

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2006, 12:57:50 am »
Quote:

For what it's worth, I saw that trade and wondered what Krivsky was up to.  Although, he has to know something we don't (duh???) because I will never suspect Bowden of making a good trade.



The Reds have a kid in AAA who is ready for the show.  Hot shot centerfielder, who probably will play RF.  Plus gives Ryan Freel a permanent position as well.

Royce Clayton baffles me though.  He's a backup on most contending teams.
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JimR

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2006, 10:24:14 am »
i'm more than a little nervous about what this means for Belisle. he was pitching great before he went on the DL, but he had a couple of mediocre outings after coming off of it.
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strosrays

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2006, 10:33:52 am »
Generally, I am trying to figure out a scenario where it makes sense to essentially trade away a starting OF who can hit (not to mention along with a young SS) for a middle reliever.

Specifically, what happens now if Griffey, Jr. goes down?

And I guess this means Soriano will be looking at DC in his rear-view sooner rather than later?
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Dobro

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2006, 10:41:42 am »
Quote:

And I guess this means Soriano will be looking at DC in his rear-view sooner rather than later?


I just pray that he goes to the AL.
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Jacksonian

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2006, 11:08:37 am »
Quote:

It's good to see that Krivsky has finally eaten the Skyline Chili.

What an unbelievably bad deal for the Reds.



I don't know.  They definitely improved their bullpen for this year.  And, Bray could be a starter down the line.  If Denorfia can hit in the majors anywhere close to what he was doing in AAA then the Reds won't lose anything offensively.  Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  But, they could still deal for a better shortstop if necessary.

<edited to add> It's most likely their starting pitching that will keep them down. It's hard to see Arroyo being as good in the second half as he was in the first.  If he falters that bullpen will get taxed very heavily down the stretch because the rest of their starters are just mediocre.
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MusicMan

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2006, 11:09:47 am »
Quote:

 What would you be willing to give the Nats to get Felipe Lopez for the Stros?



A time machine, to locate the 2005 versions of him (and Ensberg, while we're at it)?
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MikeyBoy

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2006, 11:18:34 am »
Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.
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Jacksonian

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2006, 11:37:23 am »
Quote:

Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.



Does Clayton still have any range at all?
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JimR

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #19 on: July 14, 2006, 11:47:27 am »
which is what JD said
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MikeyBoy

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #20 on: July 14, 2006, 11:54:55 am »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.



Does Clayton still have any range at all?



Clayton may have lost a little range, but he is still smooth and understands how to play the position. Lopez is prone to mental lapses and has skillets for hands.
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Jacksonian

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #21 on: July 14, 2006, 12:00:08 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.



Does Clayton still have any range at all?



Clayton may have lost a little range, but he is still smooth and understands how to play the position. Lopez is prone to mental lapses and has skillets for hands.



So, if they improved defensively on the infield, the trade is a + for the Reds at least in the short term if Denorfia can hit well.

The Reds will hope to get 5 or 6 quality innings out of their starters and turn it over to a very improved bullpen.  I'm not sure they have anything left to deal for a starter that is better than what they have now.  Looks like they may have a legit shot right now if they can get just enough out of their starting pitching.

The Reds having been listening to Noe.  Strong bullpen and defense to win.
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pravata

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2006, 12:01:15 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.



Does Clayton still have any range at all?



Clayton may have lost a little range, but he is still smooth and understands how to play the position. Lopez is prone to mental lapses and has skillets for hands.



So, if they improved defensively on the infield, the trade is a + for the Reds at least in the short term if Denorfia can hit well.

The Reds will hope to get 5 or 6 quality innings out of their starters and turn it over to a very improved bullpen.  I'm not sure they have anything left to deal for a starter that is better than what they have now.  Looks like they may have a legit shot right now if they can get just enough out of their starting pitching.

The Reds having been listening to Noe.  Strong bullpen and defense to win.



Nice going Noe.
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Bench

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2006, 12:04:47 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.



Does Clayton still have any range at all?



Lopez has good range, but makes a lot of simple errors. Clayton is much better at turning two and making the routine plays.

I figure it's either a slight downgrade or a wash defensively. Basically trading range for consistency.
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JimR

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2006, 12:10:13 pm »
then you disagree w/JD. he said the Reds upgraded at SS.
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Jacksonian

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2006, 12:16:49 pm »
Quote:

Lopez has good range, but makes a lot of simple errors. Clayton is much better at turning two and making the routine plays.



If you are correct on this part, then...


Quote:

I figure it's either a slight downgrade or a wash defensively. Basically trading range for consistency.



I disagree on this part.  I'll take solid consistency over range any day if I have a choice.  You have to get to the ball, but you've also got to make the play.  Looks like Clayton is better at it than Lopez.  It sounds like I was wrong on the ss deal.  I was under the impression Lopez was better than he is.
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Bench

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #26 on: July 14, 2006, 12:19:19 pm »
Quote:

then you disagree w/JD. he said the Reds upgraded at SS.



He certainly is more familiar with the players than I am. In the games that I've seen, anecdotally, I've seen Lopez get to some balls that the current Royce Clayton would never get to. Likewise, I've seen Lopez boot several balls right at him, and make some unnecessarily wild throws while turning two.

Consistency is probably more valuable than the few extra plays Lopez can make.
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Bench

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2006, 12:22:32 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Lopez has good range, but makes a lot of simple errors. Clayton is much better at turning two and making the routine plays.



If you are correct on this part, then...


Quote:

I figure it's either a slight downgrade or a wash defensively. Basically trading range for consistency.



I disagree on this part.  I'll take solid consistency over range any day if I have a choice.  You have to get to the ball, but you've also got to make the play.  Looks like Clayton is better at it than Lopez.  It sounds like I was wrong on the ss deal.  I was under the impression Lopez was better than he is.



You're right.
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pravata

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #28 on: July 14, 2006, 01:20:32 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.



Does Clayton still have any range at all?



Clayton may have lost a little range, but he is still smooth and understands how to play the position. Lopez is prone to mental lapses and has skillets for hands.



So, if they improved defensively on the infield, the trade is a + for the Reds at least in the short term if Denorfia can hit well.

The Reds will hope to get 5 or 6 quality innings out of their starters and turn it over to a very improved bullpen.  I'm not sure they have anything left to deal for a starter that is better than what they have now.  Looks like they may have a legit shot right now if they can get just enough out of their starting pitching.

The Reds having been listening to Noe.  Strong bullpen and defense to win.



Nice going Noe.



"It's impossible to win if you can't pitch," (Reds Manager Jerry) Narron said in the trade's dizzying aftermath. "To go into Milwaukee like we did last week and take a lead in extra innings and give it up and take a lead (again) and give it up, it's tough. It takes a lot out of you. You've just got to pitch better."

"In baseball, you cannot outslug people. You've got to pitch and you've got to play defense."
The Link

I hope you're happy now.  It wasn't enough that the Brewers were getting smart?  Now the Reds have to find a clue?  Thankfully there's still the Cubs and Pirates.
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Jacksonian

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #29 on: July 14, 2006, 01:39:24 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Defensively they definitely took a step down on the infield.  



I think they actually upgraded their defense at SS, Lopez can be brutal.



Does Clayton still have any range at all?



Clayton may have lost a little range, but he is still smooth and understands how to play the position. Lopez is prone to mental lapses and has skillets for hands.



So, if they improved defensively on the infield, the trade is a + for the Reds at least in the short term if Denorfia can hit well.

The Reds will hope to get 5 or 6 quality innings out of their starters and turn it over to a very improved bullpen.  I'm not sure they have anything left to deal for a starter that is better than what they have now.  Looks like they may have a legit shot right now if they can get just enough out of their starting pitching.

The Reds having been listening to Noe.  Strong bullpen and defense to win.



Nice going Noe.



"It's impossible to win if you can't pitch," (Reds Manager Jerry) Narron said in the trade's dizzying aftermath. "To go into Milwaukee like we did last week and take a lead in extra innings and give it up and take a lead (again) and give it up, it's tough. It takes a lot out of you. You've just got to pitch better."

"In baseball, you cannot outslug people. You've got to pitch and you've got to play defense."
The Link

I hope you're happy now.  It wasn't enough that the Brewers were getting smart?  Now the Reds have to find a clue?  Thankfully there's still the Cubs and Pirates.



That emphasizes the importance of drafting and developing quality pitching.  Those horrible 2000-2002 drafts haunt the Astros today.
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mihoba

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #30 on: July 15, 2006, 11:14:35 am »
Quote:


The Reds have a kid in AAA who is ready for the show.  Hot shot centerfielder, who probably will play RF.  Plus gives Ryan Freel a permanent position as well.

Royce Clayton baffles me though.  He's a backup on most contending teams.



Ryan Church of the Nats is stuck in Robbie's doghouse, and since they have acquired Kearns and Matos, maybe he is available? Church had a decent rookie year last year in CF, he reminds me of a young JD Drew without the injuries.
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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #31 on: July 15, 2006, 06:49:14 pm »
Quote:


Ryan Church of the Nats is stuck in Robbie's doghouse, and since they have acquired Kearns and Matos, maybe he is available? Church had a decent rookie year last year in CF, he reminds me of a young JD Drew without the injuries.



He ain't exactly tearing it up in AAA for New Orleans.  Zephyer's Stats
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mihoba

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Re: The Reds Making Moves
« Reply #32 on: July 16, 2006, 11:34:59 am »
Quote:

He ain't exactly tearing it up in AAA for New Orleans.  Zephyer's Stats



Looks like he needs a change of scenery!

Of course, since the Astros are apparantly shopping outfielders, my timing, as usual, sucks.
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