NOMAR!!!

[CrawfordBoxes]

Down to 4 teams, us Cleveland, NY and LA. I seriously doubt he would go to Cleveland but I really hope he comes here. He's a big time player especially if he can stay healthy this year! His decision could come as early as tomorrow!

[Greg M]

By your reaction I thought he'd be signed.  Being one of the top four teams for an allstar who can't stay healthy and doesn't have a position sounds intersting.  Common...save the all caps triple exclamation response for actual acquisitions like Randy Johnson and Carlos Beltran.

[jaklewein]

What in thaaa.....

Stark Article on Nomar:

 In Houston, he has been told he would play left field, Tellem said, because the Astros' infield is set. However, an official of one club that has spoken with the Astros said this week there is a possibility they could trade shortstop Adam Everett in the right deal. So potentially, that could create the option of using Garciaparra at shortstop. But that seems unlikely.

The Link


I've been one of the posters advocating the signing of Garciaparra from the beginning, but not as our SS.  I don't like that move at all.  Hopefully he's signed as a LF-er or nothing.  It also looks to me like RWhite is our 2nd choice at this point.  I mean, the guy took a physical and everything...my guess is he'd of been signed by now if he was the Stros first choice.

[DVauthrin]

Quote:
What in thaaa.....

Stark Article on Nomar:

 In Houston, he has been told he would play left field, Tellem said, because the Astros' infield is set. However, an official of one club that has spoken with the Astros said this week there is a possibility they could trade shortstop Adam Everett in the right deal. So potentially, that could create the option of using Garciaparra at shortstop. But that seems unlikely.

The Link


I've been one of the posters advocating the signing of Garciaparra from the beginning, but not as our SS.  I don't like that move at all.  Hopefully he's signed as a LF-er or nothing.  It also looks to me like RWhite is our 2nd choice at this point.  I mean, the guy took a physical and everything...my guess is he'd of been signed by now if he was the Stros first choice.

Again it is just speculation from Stark.  Furthermore, Nomar would have a lot to prove before the team would make such a move imho and it's in his best interest as a player to not play short at the very least in the short term, and probably longterm as well.  The team is looking at him as a LF/super sub, not a SS.

[Twoniner]

  It would be a gamble with his health issues, but if he stayed healthy that would be a nice boost to the lineup and would make for a pretty decent outfield defensively I would think.  I like his bat in our lineup.  He has pretty good pop but just the number of hits he gets would be a nice addition to a more or less swing or miss lineup.  Still a gamble, but we all know that Purpura is a madman.

[cc]

Didn't see this posted elsewhere, but he was on 610's Night Shift last night.  Purpura, that is.  He said he could play short or third for the Astros, and that *Nomar* himself expressed interest in playing left field because he felt like he had the athleticism to excel in the outfield.

[jasonact]

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Didn't see this posted elsewhere, but he was on 610's Night Shift last night.  Purpura, that is.  He said he could play short or third for the Astros, and that *Nomar* himself expressed interest in playing left field because he felt like he had the athleticism to excel in the outfield.

Did he mention anything about his health? That seems to be the main concern with Nomar at this time, but I haven't heard anything about what we can expect health-wise in 2006. I'm sure he'll go through a physical before signing a contract, but is there any word at this time?

[Gulf Coast Playboy]

It's hard for me to imagine that the Astros can truthfully convey to Nomar anything that would make him particularly comfortable with "the baseball situation" in Houston.  That is, unless they somehow "know" that Bagwell will be unable to play, isn't the most they can promise to Nomar that he "might be the starting left fielder, and if he isn't, he'll be a utility man until/unless the team receives a fair trade offer for Lane or Taveras"?

[cc]

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Didn't see this posted elsewhere, but he was on 610's Night Shift last night.  Purpura, that is.  He said he could play short or third for the Astros, and that *Nomar* himself expressed interest in playing left field because he felt like he had the athleticism to excel in the outfield.

Did he mention anything about his health? That seems to be the main concern with Nomar at this time, but I haven't heard anything about what we can expect health-wise in 2006. I'm sure he'll go through a physical before signing a contract, but is there any word at this time?

I just heard the brief comment on replay; I haven't heard the entire interview.  It might be posted in their vault online or something.

[jaklewein]

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It's hard for me to imagine that the Astros can truthfully convey to Nomar anything that would make him particularly comfortable with "the baseball situation" in Houston.  That is, unless they somehow "know" that Bagwell will be unable to play, isn't the most they can promise to Nomar that he "might be the starting left fielder, and if he isn't, he'll be a utility man until/unless the team receives a fair trade offer for Lane or Taveras"?

My guess is that if he's signed, then he will be promised a starting spot (w/ the exception of poor performance of course).  If Bags plays, then I'm guessing Lane will be traded or again placed on the bench.

[Gulf Coast Playboy]

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It's hard for me to imagine that the Astros can truthfully convey to Nomar anything that would make him particularly comfortable with "the baseball situation" in Houston.  That is, unless they somehow "know" that Bagwell will be unable to play, isn't the most they can promise to Nomar that he "might be the starting left fielder, and if he isn't, he'll be a utility man until/unless the team receives a fair trade offer for Lane or Taveras"?

My guess is that if he's signed, then he will be promised a starting spot (w/ the exception of poor performance of course).  If Bags plays, then I'm guessing Lane will be traded or again placed on the bench.

I think that's probably correct, but if Bagwell IS able to play 1B full-time, I don't think Nomar's presence in the starting lineup materially improves the starting lineup* (especially when you factor in Berkman's defense moving from LF to RF, which would presumably happen in the scenario you've described).  Expensive gamble for the team to make -- again, unless they feel reasonably confident that Bagwell WON'T be able to play.  If the best information the team has indicates it's a toss-up whether Bagwell will be able to play, then I think they're reluctant to make such a promise to Nomar (much less pay him $6-8M).  It's been said 1000 times, but this is what makes Purp's job so darn difficult this off-season.

*The bench would obviously be improved, if Lane is your 4th OF, but I doubt the team would consider that improvement to be worth the $6-8M Nomar will apparently command.

[jaklewein]

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It's hard for me to imagine that the Astros can truthfully convey to Nomar anything that would make him particularly comfortable with "the baseball situation" in Houston.  That is, unless they somehow "know" that Bagwell will be unable to play, isn't the most they can promise to Nomar that he "might be the starting left fielder, and if he isn't, he'll be a utility man until/unless the team receives a fair trade offer for Lane or Taveras"?

I don't think it's that big of a risk, as long as its only a one year deal.  Now, signing Nomar to play SS, and trading Everett as part of that would constitute a big risk in my opinion.

My guess is that if he's signed, then he will be promised a starting spot (w/ the exception of poor performance of course).  If Bags plays, then I'm guessing Lane will be traded or again placed on the bench.

I think that's probably correct, but if Bagwell IS able to play 1B full-time, I don't think Nomar's presence in the starting lineup materially improves the starting lineup* (especially when you factor in Berkman's defense moving from LF to RF, which would presumably happen in the scenario you've described).  Expensive gamble for the team to make -- again, unless they feel reasonably confident that Bagwell WON'T be able to play.  If the best information the team has indicates it's a toss-up whether Bagwell will be able to play, then I think they're reluctant to make such a promise to Nomar (much less pay him $6-8M).  It's been said 1000 times, but this is what makes Purp's job so darn difficult this off-season.

*The bench would obviously be improved, if Lane is your 4th OF, but I doubt the team would consider that improvement to be worth the $6-8M Nomar will apparently command.

[DVauthrin]

Like I said earlier, I think this is a clear indication of how Jeff's rehab is going and the fact that the team wants a strong bat in his spot in the order regardless of it is him or someone else.    Plus, as far the baseball situation for nomar goes, he reportedly wants a situation that may turn out to be longterm if he performs as he expects.  Well, after this year, Jeff Bagwell is more than likely retiring, and Lance Berkman moving to 1B.    This is a place where he could have a longterm home if he stays healthy and performs.

[Arky Vaughan]

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Like I said earlier, I think this is a clear indication of how Jeff's rehab is going and the fact that the team wants a strong bat in his spot in the order regardless of it is him or someone else.    Plus, as far the baseball situation for nomar goes, he reportedly wants a situation that may turn out to be longterm if he performs as he expects.  Well, after this year, Jeff Bagwell is more than likely retiring, and Lance Berkman moving to 1B.    This is a place where he could have a longterm home if he stays healthy and performs.

I don't see how it says anything about Jeff Bagwell's situation other than what has been the case for a long time: nobody knows.

Regardless of how Bagwell's shoulder is doing, the Astros must be prepared for the contingency that he cannot play. More importantly, even if he can play, I doubt they expect to run him out there 162 games, or even 150 games.

Even if Bagwell can hit and throw when spring training rolls around, expect Berkman to still see some time at first base next season, and expect somebody else to be starting in left field at least a couple of days each week.

[Twoniner]

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My guess is that if he's signed, then he will be promised a starting spot (w/ the exception of poor performance of course). If Bags plays, then I'm guessing Lane will be traded or again placed on the bench.

sorry for the tangent, but If Bags is outperforming a hopefully somewhat improved Lane at then that would work.  If not Bags can come off the bench and not deal with the wear and tear from throwing, and the small defensive hit of Berkman in the outfield.   I just hope Bags isn't playing 1st because (we are paying him such and such dollars). Bags deserves every single dollar that he has coming but it irritates me when baseball analysts (and football for that matter) use this reasoning.

[DVauthrin]

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Like I said earlier, I think this is a clear indication of how Jeff's rehab is going and the fact that the team wants a strong bat in his spot in the order regardless of it is him or someone else.    Plus, as far the baseball situation for nomar goes, he reportedly wants a situation that may turn out to be longterm if he performs as he expects.  Well, after this year, Jeff Bagwell is more than likely retiring, and Lance Berkman moving to 1B.    This is a place where he could have a longterm home if he stays healthy and performs.

I don't see how it says anything about Jeff Bagwell's situation other than what has been the case for a long time: nobody knows.

Regardless of how Bagwell's shoulder is doing, the Astros must be prepared for the contingency that he cannot play. More importantly, even if he can play, I doubt they expect to run him out there 162 games, or even 150 games.

Even if Bagwell can hit and throw when spring training rolls around, expect Berkman to still see some time at first base next season, and expect somebody else to be starting in left field at least a couple of days each week.

I realize that, and I think it's great that they are going after a good insurance policy at worst.   The point was that if they really thought bagwell is back and will play pretty regularly, I think they would be targeting White moreso over Nomar as he is more likely to possibly accept a bench role if need be.   The truth is like you said, they really aren't sure, but I think that the fact they are going after Nomar hard says something about where bags stands right now in rehab.

[ASTROCREEP]

IF they sign Nomar, he starts over Lane.

IF Bags can't go, Lane starts RF, Nomar/Berkman 1st/Left.

[toddthebod]

Arky.  Why isn't the contingency for Bagwell being injured Lamb?  And if Lamb isn't cutting it, a trade later in the season.

[BizidyDizidy]

What's the bench then?

[Froback]

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Arky.  Why isn't the contingency for Bagwell being injured Lamb?  And if Lamb isn't cutting it, a trade later in the season.

Lamb has proven he is not productive enough to be an everyday player.
And why lose players to fill in for Bagwell when you can get someone to replace him for money only now, and then possibly add players when that player suddenly becomes unneeded.  I mean sign Nomar as a Bagwell back-up plan, and if Bagwell comes back like we all would hope, then trade Nomar and get something back for him.  Seems like a win-win, assuming that money isn't an issue.

[Arky Vaughan]

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Arky.  Why isn't the contingency for Bagwell being injured Lamb?  And if Lamb isn't cutting it, a trade later in the season.

Lamb is a contingency, as are Burke and Palmeiro.  But I think if the Astros have a shot to pick up Nomar at a decent price tied to incentives, that would be an upgrade over any of those contingencies.

While Nomar isn't what he once was and is injury-prone, I think having a hitter of his caliber who can play in a pinch at any position other than catcher and pitcher has considerable value to any team, especially one like the Astros, particularly with Vizcaino gone.

Best-case scenario, in my mind, is Bagwell can play first, Berkman is in left, and the Astros have to figure out where to use Nomar.

Worst-case scenario is Bagwell can't play first, and the Astros put Berkman there, with Nomar in left.

I see his addition as a plus in either case.

[Arky Vaughan]

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And why lose players to fill in for Bagwell when you can get someone to replace him for money only now, and then possibly add players when that player suddenly becomes unneeded.  I mean sign Nomar as a Bagwell back-up plan, and if Bagwell comes back like we all would hope, then trade Nomar and get something back for him.  Seems like a win-win, assuming that money isn't an issue.

I doubt Nomar's contract would allow the Astros to trade him so easily.

[Cheo]

i see (foxsports.com) where giambi plans to call nomar and beg him to play for the yanks.

IMHO...i highly doubt nomar signs with the yanks. the yanks are there just to drive up the contract $$$. he wants to settle down and play SS on occasion and the astros are his best option. it wouldn't surprise me if the astros are actively shopping AE as well. he is due arbitration this year as well....

nomar will sign with us tomorrow...2 year, 3rd year option...loaded with incentives...

[Fredia]

the eternally optomostic.. but i tend to wonder whatyou have been sniffing

[Reuben]

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i see (foxsports.com) where giambi plans to call nomar and beg him to play for the yanks.

IMHO...i highly doubt nomar signs with the yanks. the yanks are there just to drive up the contract $$$. he wants to settle down and play SS on occasion and the astros are his best option. it wouldn't surprise me if the astros are actively shopping AE as well. he is due arbitration this year as well....

nomar will sign with us tomorrow...2 year, 3rd year option...loaded with incentives...

No way will a team go 2 years, unless the base is low, low, low, and the deal is almost ALL incentives, and Nomar would never do that. His plan is, have a great year and sign a new long-term deal for $10+ mil per, I'm sure.

Then again, Julio Franco got a 2 year deal.

[Cheo]

hi fredia....no sniffing....eating too many chocolate dipped cookies though.... ;-D

that "1 yr contract....play hard to get paid later" didn't work out for him last season. i guarantee you he signs at least 2 years with a ton of incentives.

[hostros7]

And then there were two...

The Link

(perhaps)

[jasonact]

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And then there were two...

The Link

(perhaps)

If that report is to be believed, why would Nomar prefer maybe playing LF for the Astros (although at this point I don't think it's clear where he'd play) over playing RF for the Indians? Either there's more to that than what was reported or the Astros are "less optimistic" as well but just not saying so, as is their custom.

[jaklewein]

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And then there were two...

The Link

(perhaps)

If that report is to be believed, why would Nomar prefer maybe playing LF for the Astros (although at this point I don't think it's clear where he'd play) over playing RF for the Indians? Either there's more to that than what was reported or the Astros are "less optimistic" as well but just not saying so, as is their custom.

Because the Astros were a better team last year, and a better team than the Indians on paper (w/ Nomar) again this year.  If the money is equal, then why wouldn't he rather play for the Astros?  I'm actually feeling like there's a decent chance he signs with the good guys.

[geezerdonk]

If Garciaparra signs with the Astros, maybe he will end up at second base. Aren't Biggio's defensive deficiencies mitigated more by playing him in left field?

[Trey]

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If Garciaparra signs with the Astros, maybe he will end up at second base. Aren't Biggio's defensive deficiencies mitigated more by playing him in left field?

Biggio is no longer a great defensive 2B.  However, he is TERRIBLE in LF.  Maybe if he has all of ST to work on it, he'll get better, but my feel is that if you have Garciaparra and Bidge at second and LF, your best defensive option is Garciaparra in left and Bidge at second.

[pravata]

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If Garciaparra signs with the Astros, maybe he will end up at second base. Aren't Biggio's defensive deficiencies mitigated more by playing him in left field?

Biggio is no longer a great defensive 2B.  However, he is TERRIBLE in LF.  Maybe if he has all of ST to work on it, he'll get better, but my feel is that if you have Garciaparra and Bidge at second and LF, your best defensive option is Garciaparra in left and Bidge at second.

Biggio was terrible in left because he'd never played left.  A fly ball is a fly ball, however on the corners it moves differently than in center.  If he looked at a couple thousand banana flies in st, he'd get the hang of it.  Still, I'd rather he not be in LF.  And, San Diego considered Garciaparra for 2nd.  He was not signed by San Diego.

[Froback]

I hesitate in saying this knowing the uproar this is likely to cause, but the reports I am hearing is that the Astros are using the LF position only from a media and a "if Bagwell can't play" perspective.

The real story supposedly is that if they sign Nomar, he will play everyday (or close to it) either as LF if Bagwell cannot go, or as SS if he can (moving Everett to the bench/late inning defensive replacement role).

If they do sign him and this is true, look for Nomar to be the #2 hitter in the line-up too.  From a friend of mine who is a BoSox fan, he thinks Nomar's downfall as a hitter/player occured when the Sox asked him to be a #3/4 hitter for them instead of his table-setter role.  So if asked to be a table-setter again he might flourish again at the plate.

And for those that talk about how poor the offense was, it wasn't because they had a black-hole at the #7 and 8 slots, it was because the #1 and #2 hitters didn't get on-base for the 3/4 hitters in the line-up enough.

[pravata]

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I hesitate in saying this knowing the uproar this is likely to cause, but the reports I am hearing is that the Astros are using the LF position only from a media and a "if Bagwell can't play" perspective.

The real story supposedly is that if they sign Nomar, he will play everyday (or close to it) either as LF if Bagwell cannot go, or as SS if he can (moving Everett to the bench/late inning defensive replacement role).

If they do sign him and this is true, look for Nomar to be the #2 hitter in the line-up too.  From a friend of mine who is a BoSox fan, he thinks Nomar's downfall as a hitter/player occured when the Sox asked him to be a #3/4 hitter for them instead of his table-setter role.  So if asked to be a table-setter again he might flourish again at the plate.

And for those that talk about how poor the offense was, it wasn't because they had a black-hole at the #7 and 8 slots, it was because the #1 and #2 hitters didn't get on-base for the 3/4 hitters in the line-up enough.

I'm reading that Garciaparra's reoccuring injuries are scaring teams off from him at short. I've seen no mention of a team that wants him to play there.  The point about the offense is amusing.  I'm confounded as to how people can blame the poor offense, and postulate its' improvement, concentrating on the bottom of the order.

[Arky Vaughan]

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If they do sign him and this is true, look for Nomar to be the #2 hitter in the line-up too.  From a friend of mine who is a BoSox fan, he thinks Nomar's downfall as a hitter/player occured when the Sox asked him to be a #3/4 hitter for them instead of his table-setter role.  So if asked to be a table-setter again he might flourish again at the plate.

Nomar didn't suffer a downfall as a hitter with the Red Sox. His last three seasons in Boston he batted .310/.352./.528 in 156 games, .301/.345/.524 in 156 games and .321/.367/.500 in 38 games. I think Nomar will continue to hit just fine if he can stay healthy, which is his real "downfall," and I don't think his health has much to do with where he hits in the line-up.

[Arky Vaughan]

As a No. 3 hitter from 2002-2004, Nomar batted .300/.344/.511.

Does he become Babe Ruth if he bats No. 2?

[jasonact]

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As a No. 3 hitter from 2002-2004, Nomar batted .300/.344/.511.

Does he become Babe Ruth if he bats No. 2?

Be that as it may, if he signs with the Astros, No. 2 might not be a bad spot for him in the order. That might be where he is most useful given the other guys in the order. Of course, then where does Biggio go? That's why he'll probably start out hitting 3rd.

[Froback]

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As a No. 3 hitter from 2002-2004, Nomar batted .300/.344/.511.

Does he become Babe Ruth if he bats No. 2?

I don't know how to look up the stats for when he did this, but going on what my friend told me, he batted much better (batting average and OBP) when he was batting in the #2 hole early in his career.

And his "bulking up" to be a #3 hitter is what lead to his injury conditions and the lowering of his non-slugging stats.  Just was observered to be better suited as a #2 hitter than #3.

[cc]

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I'm reading that Garciaparra's reoccuring injuries are scaring teams off from him at short. I've seen no mention of a team that wants him to play there.

Once again, he may have been filling up air time with gobbledygook, but Purpura said on the talk show the other night that he was able to play short, third or outfield.  It may be that they're surely targeting him for left, but the interview sound bite made it sound like he could see him at least filling in at any of those positions.

[Froback]

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As a No. 3 hitter from 2002-2004, Nomar batted .300/.344/.511.

Does he become Babe Ruth if he bats No. 2?

Be that as it may, if he signs with the Astros, No. 2 might not be a bad spot for him in the order. That might be where he is most useful given the other guys in the order. Of course, then where does Biggio go? That's why he'll probably start out hitting 3rd.

IF Bagwell and Garciaparra both played, look for Biggio to move to #6 in the line-up would be my guess. and #7 if Garciaparra plays SS.

Biggio has been great to this organization and is a club house leader and was very good in the 1st half of last year, but really fell off the map in the 2nd half (at least offensively).

[Arky Vaughan]

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I don't know how to look up the stats for when he did this, but going on what my friend told me, he batted much better (batting average and OBP) when he was batting in the #2 hole early in his career.

And his "bulking up" to be a #3 hitter is what lead to his injury conditions and the lowering of his non-slugging stats.  Just was observered to be better suited as a #2 hitter than #3.

And what I'm saying is there is no statistical evidence to support this theory. Here's his early seasons:

Year      AB   Avg   OBP   Slg
------------------------------
1997 #1  683  .306  .342  .534
1998 #1  143  .301  .351  .497
1998 #3  208  .332  .371  .611
1998 #4  249  .329  .363  .618
1999 #3  135  .356  .408  .585
1999 #4  395  .357  .422  .608
2000 #4  438  .379  .442  .610

And here's over his career:

No.   AB   Avg   OBP   Slg
--------------------------
#1   858  .298  .337  .517
#2   151  .219  .292  .377
#3  1794  .316  .362  .537
#4  1224  .352  .407  .600
#5   225  .338  .376  .511
#6    53  .283  .316  .547
#7    19  .474  .500  .842
#8    23  .087  .087  .304
#9    16  .375  .450  .438

Look, I'm not presenting this stuff to advocate where the Astros would bat Nomar, particularly given that they haven't signed him.  (Although I do think the prospect that the Astros will bat Craig Biggio No. 6 or No. 7 is extremely unlikely.)  My point is that the theory doesn't in any way conform to the facts of Nomar's performance over the years.

[Arky Vaughan]

You could even look it up yourself if you want:

The Link