Beltran and McCann

[TerryPuhl21]

I would like to say a huge thank you to these two veterans for what they brought to the club this year. I was critical of Beltran at times because of the lack of on field production, but what he brought to the clubhouse was indeed special and worth every penny of the $16 million he was paid. He wasn’t clear about his future when asked last night, but he did say he wanted to stay in baseball and perhaps coach. He might fit real nicely into the spot being vacated by Cora.

As for McCann, I am so glad we got him and have him back for another year. He doesn’t throw out many runners any more but his knowledge and the way he handles pitchers (and the confidence they have in him) makes him invaluable. I never realized just how good a baseball player he was until this season.

Thanks to both players!!!


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[JimR]

The trade for McCann was unpopular with some here because some did not like him. I hope he won you all over. He is a good player and a better teammate, and one of my favorite memories of last night was him chugging down the line to score on Lance’s chopper.

ETA: I love Beltrán. I hope he stays as bench coach.

[Duke]

having McCann to develop the young guys is invaluable.

[Bench]

The trade for McCann was unpopular with some here because some did not like him. I hope he won you all over. He is a good player and a better teammate, and one of my favorite memories of last night was him chugging down the line to score on Lance’s chopper.

ETA: I love Beltrán. I hope he stays as bench coach.

As one of those people that never liked McCann before he became an Astro he quickly won me over.  Great teammate.  Great mentor.  Great player.

[HudsonHawk]

The trade for McCann was unpopular with some here because some did not like him. I hope he won you all over. He is a good player and a better teammate, and one of my favorite memories of last night was him chugging down the line to score on Lance’s chopper.

ETA: I love Beltrán. I hope he stays as bench coach.

As a former catcher and chugger, I loved that part.  It's every chuggers dream. 

[juliogotay]

The trade for McCann was unpopular with some here because some did not like him. I hope he won you all over. He is a good player and a better teammate, and one of my favorite memories of last night was him chugging down the line to score on Lance’s chopper.

ETA: I love Beltrán. I hope he stays as bench coach.

Did you see Correa mocking McCann's speed as he was headed to the dugout? Hilarious.
The Astros have announced their replacement for Cora and it is not Beltran.

[Navin R Johnson]

Did you see Correa mocking McCann's speed as he was headed to the dugout? Hilarious.
The Astros have announced their replacement for Cora and it is not Beltran.

Joe Espada to replace Alex Cora as Astros bench coach
http://kwese.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/21261681/houston-astros-hire-yankees-third-base-coach-joe-espada-bench-coach

[juliogotay]

Joe Espada to replace Alex Cora as Astros bench coach
http://kwese.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/21261681/houston-astros-hire-yankees-third-base-coach-joe-espada-bench-coach

I wonder what Beltran would like to do now? He was the only Astro last night I noticed had tears streaming down his face. So happy he got his ring in Astros uni.

[doyce7]

I wonder what Beltran would like to do now? He was the only Astro last night I noticed had tears streaming down his face. So happy he got his ring in Astros uni.

After the game he said he would either play or go home for a year

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[Astros Fan in Big D]

Did you see Correa mocking McCann's speed as he was headed to the dugout? Hilarious.
The Astros have announced their replacement for Cora and it is not Beltran.

Saw that and laughed out loud.

[NeilT]

The Kansas City Star did a nice article on Beltran.

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/for-petes-sake/article182245816.html

[Astros Fan in Big D]

McCann definitely deserves to have his praises sung.

Dude was nails with the staff and he had some HUGE hits in the ACLS when production from the bottom of the order was hard to come by.  Came up big in spots kin WS too, especially game 5 with the HR and HBP that turned into the winning run.

But his receiving was the bomb.   He handled the entire staff well,  especially LMJ and Morton.  Fox can complain about mound visits all they want. He took no chances.  Some of these contributions are difficult to quantify (heresy,  I know).  But he's the definition of a glue guy and he came up big.

[Foghorn]

Can't have Beltran around as a player....literally we need to give the ABs and playing time to Fisher/Tucker.  If he'd be willing to be a coach that would be awesome.

His double off of Kimbrel was huge.  Ended up we needed that run after the weird ITBP home run

[mrpink]

Also pushing for playing time next year will be Kemmer, Davis, Moran, White, Reed, Kemp, etc...
Lots of guys that can provide at least league average production. But I trust Luhnow and co. have a plan.

[Astros Fan in Big D]

Can't have Beltran around as a player....literally we need to give the ABs and playing time to Fisher/Tucker.  If he'd be willing to be a coach that would be awesome.

His double off of Kimbrel was huge.  Ended up we needed that run after the weird ITBP home run

That wall ball double will be my last memory of him as a player.   What a great AB, and ultimately the difference  as you pointed out.

His 2004 run meant so much to me as an Astros fan I was never bitter about him choosing the Mets.  For a few weeks in October the Astros won a playoff series and got to game 7 of the NLCS.  And the best player,  by far,  in either league during those playoffs was a Houston Astro.

[LonghornCDR]

 So does Beltrán go into the HoF as a Royal or Astro?  Can't see him as a Met or Yankee. 

[HudsonHawk]

So does Beltrán go into the HoF as a Royal or Astro?  Can't see him as a Met or Yankee.

No question he's a Royal.

[Navin R Johnson]

So does Beltrán go into the HoF as a Royal or Astro?  Can't see him as a Met or Yankee. 

MLB picks now, Im guessing a  Royal.

[HudsonHawk]

MLB picks now, Im guessing a  Royal.

The HOF picks, and has always picked.  I can't imagine it won't be a Royal. 

[doyce7]

So does Beltrán go into the HoF as a Royal or Astro?  Can't see him as a Met or Yankee.

No way does he go in as an Astro. Just doesn't have enough games played. I think he'll end up a met if he makes it in. His best numbers and amount of games

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[subnuclear]

Two of his best seasons, plus 2006 when he was really, really good, were for the Mets.

Is he a lock for the HoF?

[Bench]

Two of his best seasons, plus 2006 when he was really, really good, were for the Mets.

Is he a lock for the HoF?

I would assume if he does go in it would be as a met, which I think is appropriate.

He will be in the discussion and probably will get a bit more deference under the character clause. 

[HudsonHawk]

Two of his best seasons, plus 2006 when he was really, really good, were for the Mets.

Is he a lock for the HoF?

I don't know that he's a lock, but I think he eventually gets in. Will take him a few years, however.  Of course, I've been shocked at how little support guys like Jim Edmonds and Larry Walker got, so I don't know.  Lance Berkman will be an interesting reference. 

[doyce7]

I don't know that he's a lock, but I think he eventually gets in. Will take him a few years, however.  Of course, I've been shocked at how little support guys like Jim Edmonds and Larry Walker got, so I don't know.  Lance Berkman will be an interesting reference.

I love Berkman but I don't think he has a shot at HOF

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[HudsonHawk]

I love Berkman but I don't think he has a shot at HOF

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I don't think he's HOFer either, but the level of support he gets will be telling.  If he's one and done on the ballot, like Edmonds, I think it signals a harder time for Beltran even though Beltran has a much better case. 

[doyce7]

I don't think he's HOFer either, but the level of support he gets will be telling.  If he's one and done on the ballot, like Edmonds, I think it signals a harder time for Beltran even though Beltran has a much better case.

I see what you're saying

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[BUWebguy]

Beltran career:

KC: 7 years, 3,134 AB, .287/.352/.483
NYM: 7 years, 3,133 AB, .280/.369/.500
NYY: 2 years, 1,240 AB, .270/.327/.470
STL: 2 years, 1,101 AB, .282/.343/.493
HOU: 2 years, 800 AB, .243/.320/.456
TEX: 1 year, 193 AB, .280/.325/.451
SFG: 1 year, 167 AB, .323/.369/.551

(I had completely forgotten he spent two years as a Cardinal.)

[Limey]

Beltran career:

KC: 7 years, 3,134 AB, .287/.352/.483
NYM: 7 years, 3,133 AB, .280/.369/.500
NYY: 2 years, 1,240 AB, .270/.327/.470
STL: 2 years, 1,101 AB, .282/.343/.493
HOU: 2 years, 800 AB, .243/.320/.456
TEX: 1 year, 193 AB, .280/.325/.451
SFG: 1 year, 167 AB, .323/.369/.551

(I had completely forgotten he spent two years as a Cardinal.)

Mets, Yankees, Rangers and Jakes?  I wouldn't want him wearing an Astros cap in the Hall* with that much stink on him.

* I don't think he (or Berkman) are worthy.

[Reuben]

Beltran career:

KC: 7 years, 3,134 AB, .287/.352/.483
NYM: 7 years, 3,133 AB, .280/.369/.500
NYY: 2 years, 1,240 AB, .270/.327/.470
STL: 2 years, 1,101 AB, .282/.343/.493
HOU: 2 years, 800 AB, .243/.320/.456
TEX: 1 year, 193 AB, .280/.325/.451
SFG: 1 year, 167 AB, .323/.369/.551

(I had completely forgotten he spent two years as a Cardinal.)

He had more PA and more Games with the Mets, plus his offense was better (129 OPS+ vs. 111 in KC) and he made the playoffs (once) with the Mets, never with KC. If he gets in, I think it would be as a Met.

The HOF picks, and has always picked.  I can't imagine it won't be a Royal. 

I thought the player used to have much more of a say - I thought the HoF took control after Wade Boggs had that contract clause that he would wear a Devil Rays cap on his plaque.

Nolan Ryan sticks out to me as a blatant example of a player wrongly choosing their cap. Clearly should have gone in as an Angel.

[Reuben]

Mets, Yankees, Rangers and Jakes?  I wouldn't want him wearing an Astros cap in the Hall* with that much stink on him.

* I don't think he (or Berkman) are worthy.

I haven't spent a lot of time thinking whether Beltran is worthy, but here's something to consider:

Players with 400+ HR and 300+ SB
Barry Bonds
Willie Mays
A-Rod
Carlos Beltran
Andre Dawson

That's it.

In fact, Beltran's numbers are very similar to Dawson's, except that he was better at getting on base, and probably less of a power hitter. And his SB% is way better - Beltran was 86% for his career, which is incredible.

Throw in the defense, the ROY award, and the amazing postseason numbers, and I think he's got a good shot at the HoF.

[HudsonHawk]

He had more PA and more Games with the Mets, plus his offense was better (129 OPS+ vs. 111 in KC) and he made the playoffs (once) with the Mets, never with KC. If he gets in, I think it would be as a Met.
I thought the player used to have much more of a say - I thought the HoF took control after Wade Boggs had that contract clause that he would wear a Devil Rays cap on his plaque.

Nolan Ryan sticks out to me as a blatant example of a player wrongly choosing their cap. Clearly should have gone in as an Angel.

The HOF always had control. They will certainly consider a player's wish if it's not cut and dried, but they have final say so. After the Biggs incident they had to remind people, including Boggs, that they  are a private history  museum and they must represent history, even if a player is mad at his former club.

[Reuben]

I haven't spent a lot of time thinking whether Beltran is worthy, but here's something to consider:

Players with 400+ HR and 300+ SB
Barry Bonds
Willie Mays
A-Rod
Carlos Beltran
Andre Dawson

That's it.

In fact, Beltran's numbers are very similar to Dawson's, except that he was better at getting on base, and probably less of a power hitter. And his SB% is way better - Beltran was 86% for his career, which is incredible.

Throw in the defense, the ROY award, and the amazing postseason numbers, and I think he's got a good shot at the HoF.

Another Beltran stat:
He had 7 seasons where he had 20+ HR, 20+ SB, and 100+ RBI.

The only other player in history with more than 5 such seasons was Barry Bonds, who had 8.