AL West News

[Nate Colbert]

In foe (as opposed to faux) news from the last several days:

1. Josh Hamilton's shoulder is a bit Bagwellian (with the arthritis and all) and with the surgery he's iffy for opening day.

2. A DMN columnist whines that the Rangers' schedule is too difficult what with all the West Coast trips (8 trips versus I believe 6 trips for the Astros though mitigated somewhat by the good guys' one additional East Coast trip in comparison).

3. Having already signed LHP Miguel Siverio this offseason, the Mariners may be looking to add a few more Cubans.

4. Jay Jaffe of SI grades the offseason of the Oakland A's and, like everyone else, comes away mostly scratching his head:

Even so, this is a very motley crew [Moneyball Posterboy's] assembled for 2015, and between cleaning out his farm system yet again and tying up scarce cash in Butler, he's running a big risk that that playoff streak will come to an end.

[Nate Colbert]

2. A DMN columnist whines that the Rangers' schedule is too difficult what with all the West Coast trips (8 trips versus I believe 6 trips for the Astros though mitigated somewhat by the good guys' one additional East Coast trip in comparison).

Mostly pointless trivia, Part the 1st.

Miles scheduled to be traveled on road trips in 2015:

1. Astros 34497
2. Angels 36568
3. Rangers 37207
4. Athletics 40867
5. Mariners 43281

baseballsavant.com

[juliogotay]

Article in Dallas News this morning about Jeff Bannister, new Rangers skipper, going to have pitchers pitch inside more. Stats show it had good effects in Pittsburgh last year where he was a coach.

[Nate Colbert]

The bug continues in Arlington--Jurickson Profar to go under knife.

[juliogotay]

The bug continues in Arlington--Jurickson Profar to go under knife.

There is some thought that Profar screwed up his shoulder last year when they had him playing some OF. Different throwing obviously them from middle IF positions.

[Reuben]

There is some thought that Profar screwed up his shoulder last year when they had him playing some OF. Different throwing obviously them from middle IF positions.

Do those who think that realize that he's a baseball player?

[Nate Colbert]

1. Josh Hamilton's shoulder is a bit Bagwellian (with the arthritis and all) and with the surgery he's iffy for opening day.

Now they're saying he may not return until sometime in May.

[Nate Colbert]

The Moneyball guys, 12 years later.

Catcher Jeremy Brown is a coal miner? Well he did have a wide bucket...

[Lefty]

The Moneyball guys, 10 years later.

Well, now I know what Tabitha Soren's been up to as well.

[Reuben]

Well, now I know what Tabitha Soren's been up to as well.

Huh. That's funny. She also had a cameo on Portlandia a couple years ago.

I always liked Steve Isaacs, I wonder what he's been up to since his VJ days.

[Nate Colbert]

Is the meeting with MLB officials over a disciplinary issue prelude to a suspension for Josh Hamilton?

Although there's a bit of an unfortunate tone to the article, Evan Grant of the DMN points out there is an upside to the Angels if Hamilton gets suspended in that it will free up additional payroll. That would be on top of Arte Moreno's saying last week that the club could add as much as $17MM in salary if they needed to add players during the season.

ETA:

Apparently confessed to MLB officials he relapsed (used coke). The usual rules would say no suspension as a "first time" offender. But the usual rules may not apply:

Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi  26 minutes ago
#MLB discipline for Josh Hamilton would be at commissioner's discretion. He is outside standard program because of failed tests in minors.

So, if Jon Singleton gets busted for a "drug of abuse" is he also outside the usual sets of rules that would otherwise apply?

[HudsonHawk]

Is the meeting with MLB officials over a disciplinary issue prelude to a suspension for Josh Hamilton?

Although there's a bit of an unfortunate tone to the article, Evan Grant of the DMN points out there is an upside to the Angels if Hamilton gets suspended in that it will free up additional payroll. That would be on top of Arte Moreno's saying last week that the club could add as much as $17MM in salary if they needed to add players during the season.

ETA:

Apparently confessed to MLB officials he relapsed (used coke). The usual rules would say no suspension as a "first time" offender. But the usual rules may not apply:

So, if Jon Singleton gets busted for a "drug of abuse" is he also outside the usual sets of rules that would otherwise apply?

If Hamilton is not banned from baseball permanently, MLB has exactly ZERO credibility on their drug policy.

[Col. Sphinx Drummond]

If Hamilton is not banned from baseball permanently, MLB has exactly ZERO credibility on their drug policy.

Wouldn't bother me if he never picked up a bat again. Except, a confession of a relapse should not be held to the same standard as testing positive for drugs.

[HudsonHawk]

Wouldn't bother me if he never picked up a bat again. Except, a confession of a relapse should not be held to the same standard as testing positive for drugs.

Why not?  This isn't his first time.  Or his second...or third...or fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth or ninth.  At what point do you quit the charade and admit that this guys is simply never going to follow the rules?

Furthermore, he gets tested three times a week.  I find it very hard to believe he went back to the cocaine and didn't fail a test the next day.

[roadrunner]

So, if Jon Singleton gets busted for a "drug of abuse" is he also outside the usual sets of rules that would otherwise apply?

I think Hamilton was reinstated by Selig under the condition that any future punishments would be at the sole discretion of the commissioner, so this is not some standard procedure that Singleton would fall under.

[Fredia]

will be interesting to see how the new regime is not only going to handle this case but others that will come up. will the names be handled different from those that tend to draw less

[MusicMan]

FanGraphs on possible punishment scenarios

[HudsonHawk]

FanGraphs on possible punishment scenarios

I find this idea of trying to classify him as a "first-time offender" to make no sense whatsoever.  He's been suspended multiple times for this.

[Col. Sphinx Drummond]

Why not?  This isn't his first time.  Or his second...or third...or fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth or ninth.  At what point do you quit the charade and admit that this guys is simply never going to follow the rules?

Furthermore, he gets tested three times a week.  I find it very hard to believe he went back to the cocaine and didn't fail a test the next day.

Of course, totally agree, I was speaking to the broader spectrum of just about every other player but Hamilton.

[NeilT]

I find this idea of trying to classify him as a "first-time offender" to make no sense whatsoever.  He's been suspended multiple times for this.

Weren't most of his prior problems in the minor leagues?  Does that even count?

I feel sorry for the guy, and truly hope that better heads than mine will do what needs to be done for him.  At his level of addiction--and Caminiti's--baseball's not the point anymore.

[HudsonHawk]

Weren't most of his prior problems in the minor leagues?  Does that even count?

As the article MM posted points out, they occurred while he was on the 40-man, so MLB's drug policy applies.  This would be his ninth formal violation of his treatment program, and would be his seventh suspension.

I feel sorry for the guy, and truly hope that better heads than mine will do what needs to be done for him.  At his level of addiction--and Caminiti's--baseball's not the point anymore.

I hope he gets his shit together too, but what's the point of a drug policy if it's not enforced?  Why pretend that you care if you don't?

[Mr. Happy]

As a recovering addict, I feel strongly that baseball has to be very tough and harsh. We're talking about his life. Addiction kills people.

[geezerdonk]

Hamilton's level of torment matches his level of talent. The most remarkable part of his story is that he was able to hold his addiction at bay long enough to earn an MVP award and make 5 straight all star teams.

[Lefty]

Lewis Lloyd, Mitchell Wiggins and John Lucas say "hello".

[BizidyDizidy]

What's the point is a great question

[Nate Colbert]

Yu calls bullshit on suggestion he may have "quit" on Rangers last season after being diagnosed with that inflammation in his elbow.

[Nate Colbert]

And it continues:

Darvish has UCL tear that may require TJS.

[jbm]

If someone has to be cursed, it might as well be Rangers.

[NeilT]

If someone has to be cursed, it might as well be Rangers.

I think it's Mr. Pink.

[Fredia]

well stranger danger has always been a thing on this sight

[mrpink]

I think it's Mr. Pink.

Story of my life.

[Nate Colbert]

Apologies if posted elsewhere, the Mariners have now officially announced they are shutting down their Venezuela operations and like the Astros will now field 2 teams in the Dominican Summer League. This comes on the heels on continuing political turmoil in Venezuela and anti-US animosity from the Maduro administration which resulted in the recent imposition of a visa requirement on US citizens.

This leaves only 4 MLB organizations which still field teams in the Venezuelan Summer League.

[ValpoCory]

And it continues:

Darvish has UCL tear that may require TJS.

Tommy John surgery it is.

[Nate Colbert]

Yeah it means absolutely nothing but you know it's causing some queasiness in the stomachs of more than a few Rainjizz fans right now and for that we can all give thanks:

The Rangers finished with a nine-game winless streak and the worst spring-training record in the majors at 10-19. The Rangers won only two of the final 20 games. They also had the highest ERA in the majors at 6.14.

Link

[Ron Brand]

Claws and antlers.

[Nate Colbert]

Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale  43 minutes ago
Barry Zito accepts outright assignment to Triple A after strong spring with #Athletics

[Nate Colbert]

Mention was made in the TZ re Derek Holland leaving the game with shoulder tightness. The diagnosis and ensuing trip to the DL? Sub-scapular strain and out at least until mid-June per Evan Grant of DMN.

Grant separately tweeted that  OF Ryan Rua also headed to DL.

I may have mis-counted but I believe that would make 10 Rangers on the DL. The Injury Fiasco, Part Deux.

[Fredia]

did someone take away the lucky horse shoe

[MRaup]

Mention was made in the TZ re Derek Holland leaving the game with shoulder tightness. The diagnosis and ensuing trip to the DL? Sub-scapular strain and out at least until mid-June per Evan Grant of DMN.

Grant separately tweeted that  OF Ryan Rua also headed to DL.

I may have mis-counted but I believe that would make 10 Rangers on the DL. The Injury Fiasco, Part Deux.

Amazing how easy it is to just word away injuries on a broadcast. Shoulder tightness is going to turn in to 2 months of not playing at least.

[Nate Colbert]

The Arte vs Josh drama in Anaheim is becoming rather entertaining. The Angels are blustering trying to get out of the contract, the union's blustering in response, etc. Angels players, who might (perhaps) have originally been disappointed in Hamilton, now may be getting pissed at management. Player rep C.J. Wilson seems to have his own axe to grind:

"When the Angels first signed me they hired a private detective to follow me around because they were mad that I was riding motorcycles," said Wilson, who signed a five-year, $77.5-million deal before 2012.

GM Jerry Dipoto called that an outright lie (or words to that effect).

[Jacksonian]

One week in and first place.

[Fredia]

i thought the same but this being baseball was afraid to say

[jbm]

Speculation on MLB Network is that Hamilton is going from the Angels to the Rangers. 

[Bench]

Here's an article on the Hamilton to the Rangers speculation.  It says Choo won't be involved, and it appears that the Angels will be on the hook for all of Hamilton's $83 million except the league minimum?

It also has this nugget:

The Rangers have worked through a number of scenarios, including how Hamilton would fit back into the clubhouse. It should be noted that Roy Silver,who was hired as a special assistant in player development over the winter, operated the faith-based baseball academy at which Hamilton was reintroduced to baseball in 2007.

That must be the same place where Jesus Christ finally learned how to hit a curve ball.

[geezerdonk]

Believe me - he could hit a curve before he got the called up to Egypt from Bethlehem.

[Nate Colbert]

Iwakuma goes on DL with "lat strain". However, that seems to be more of a tentative diagnosis until the MRI results come back.

[Navin R Johnson]

Hamilton to the Rangers has been finalized. 

ARLINGTON -- The Rangers completed the acquisition of outfielder Josh Hamilton from the Angels on Monday. Los Angeles will receive either cash considerations or a player to be named later.

[juliogotay]

Hamilton to the Rangers has been finalized. 

ARLINGTON -- The Rangers completed the acquisition of outfielder Josh Hamilton from the Angels on Monday. Los Angeles will receive either cash considerations or a player to be named later.

I think you know you are in a bad place as an organization when re-acquiring this guy is a good move for you.

[Navin R Johnson]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/angels-simply--coldly-stopped-believing-in-josh-hamilton-152034715.html

"In the end, Moreno bought 31 home runs, 123 RBI and zero postseason hits for about $118 million. Twelve years before, he bought the entire team for $184 million"

Ouch.

[jbm]

I think you know you are in a bad place as an organization when re-acquiring this guy is a good move for you.

Yeah, in a short period time, they went from a top shelf franchise to a rather desperate looking one.  A lesson to GMs everywhere that bad shit can happen, so prepare for it.

[MusicMan]

Yeah, in a short period time, they went from a top shelf franchise to a rather desperate looking one.  A lesson to GMs everywhere that bad shit can happen, so prepare for it.

Which one?  This is a better deal for the Rangers, who are paying $2M/yr for an average OF, than for the Angels, who threw a fit and paid him to go away.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Reuben]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/angels-simply--coldly-stopped-believing-in-josh-hamilton-152034715.html

"In the end, Moreno bought 31 home runs, 123 RBI and zero postseason hits for about $118 million. Twelve years before, he bought the entire team for $184 million"

Ouch.

I'm sure there's lots of off-the-field stuff that went on that we can only guess about, but I just don't see the point of this move from the Angels' perspective. They are saving Seven million dollars, over 3 years. That's it. You're already losing $118m on the guy, what's $7m more to see if he can turn it around? Hamilton will have plenty of opportunities to make them regret it over the next few years.

[jbm]

Which one?  This is a better deal for the Rangers, who are paying $2M/yr for an average OF, than for the Angels, who threw a fit and paid him to go away.

Might be better for the Rangers, might not be.  Could be that the addiction resurfaces, and the Angels save some cash.  Either way, better for the Rangers still doesn't mean that they aren't desperate.  Look at it this way, if the Astros were acquiring Hamilton, I doubt there would be much praise around here for the deal. 

[jbm]

And by the way, the tone of that article seems like horseshit to me.

That’s a hard, hard heart. But theirs to be hard. The Angels would not – could not – believe. Not anymore. They are not the first to conclude they are better off without him, that the skills – such as they are – are not worth the time, money or occasional heartache and public relations hit

Forget whatever feelings one has about an addict and his responsibilities to others, and just focus on the complete lack of effort the guy played with in recent years.  Flailing at most every shitty pitch thrown his way, and walking back to the dugout like he didn't care.  Doesn't seem far fetched that they are actually better off without him.

[Mr. Happy]

The stRangers are hitting .211 with a team slugging percentage of .300, so they are desperate for some offense.

[Bench]

I'm sure there's lots of off-the-field stuff that went on that we can only guess about, but I just don't see the point of this move from the Angels' perspective. They are saving Seven million dollars, over 3 years. That's it. You're already losing $118m on the guy, what's $7m more to see if he can turn it around? Hamilton will have plenty of opportunities to make them regret it over the next few years.

I think they really don't like the guy. 

[Mr. Happy]

I think they really don't like the guy.

I agree. I think that they were at their wit's end with him.

[Navin R Johnson]

Some Angels fans' thoughts on Hamilton.   It has since been deleted.

OUCH.

https://twitter.com/KennyDucey/status/593051176502824960

[Mr. Happy]

Some Angels fans' thoughts on Hamilton.   It has since been deleted.

OUCH.

https://twitter.com/KennyDucey/status/593051176502824960

It's all true. Baseball has enabled the guy; there's no question about that.

[JimR]

I read a little of his parting shots at LAA. addict still in denial.

[geezerdonk]

A little harsh.

[Mr. Happy]

I read a little of his parting shots at LAA. addict still in denial.

Failure to accept any responsibility is a classic sign of addiction, and yet, his behavior keeps getting pushed under the rug. Sad. I guess we're going to have to read a sad story about him some day, and baseball will be partly to blame. The Angels simply washed their hands of the situation. They should have had the balls to attempt to terminate his contract. They could have stood up for principle.

[Nate Colbert]

The Rangers returned one of the two Rule 5 guys on their roster. No, not that one. This one.

[NeilT]

The Rangers returned one of the two Rule 5 guys on their roster. No, not that one. This one.

I guess the Astros would pay the $25,000?

[BudGirl]

So, if DDS were to get sent back to the Astros, does he time served with the Rangers count as service time with Houston also?

[JimR]

So, if DDS were to get sent back to the Astros, does he time served with the Rangers count as service time with Houston also?

service time means in the bigs, I think.

[BudGirl]

service time means in the bigs, I think.

I think I was tying to think of options.  Along the lines of him being in the bigs with Texas, is that the same as if the Astros had called him up?

[JimR]

I think I was tying to think of options.  Along the lines of him being in the bigs with Texas, is that the same as if the Astros had called him up?

no clue re effect on options.

[JJxvi]

Options years are for players on the 40 man roster.  Rule 5 players are players not on the 40 man roster with the original team, so when that player gets taken back I assume his option years don't start until that team places him on the 40 man.

[juliogotay]

I guess the Astros would pay the $25,000?

Are you sure he was Rule 5? Looks like a waiver claim.

[NeilT]

Are you sure he was Rule 5? Looks like a waiver claim.

I thought the process for reclaiming a rule V player was more complex than just sending the guy home.  The Rule Five taking team would place the cinco player on waivers, and the sending team could then take him back if they chose for payment of some amount.  That's what I thought the $25,000 payment was for.  If the sending team didn't want him, then I'd assume that the player would still have to go through waivers.

ETA:  of course I've got no clue what I'm talking about.

[juliogotay]

I thought the process for reclaiming a rule V player was more complex than just sending the guy home.  The Rule Five taking team would place the cinco player on waivers, and the sending team could then take him back if they chose for payment of some amount.  That's what I thought the $25,000 payment was for.  If the sending team didn't want him, then I'd assume that the player would still have to go through waivers.

ETA:  of course I've got no clue what I'm talking about.

No, you are correct and that is what happened. I had to google the player to see that he was a Rule 5. I did not see any mention in the article of him being Rule 5 just that the Rangers had acquired him on waivers which is not correct.

[Duman]

If the team that picked them in the rule 5 draft puts them on waivers, the team that picks them up still has to abide by the rule 5 conditions.  So you can be both a rule 5 pick and a waiver claim and go back to the original team. 

[JJxvi]

I think waivers has to happen before he can go back to the original team.  This allows another team to have a shot at the player under the Rule 5 terms that might otherwise not have gotten a chance because he had already been selected.  Without that waiver process, theoretically shenanigans could occur where teams select players in order to offer them back to the original team just to keep them away from other teams, or pick each others players and offer them back or whatever.

[NeilT]

That makes sense.

[Nate Colbert]

Options years are for players on the 40 man roster.  Rule 5 players are players not on the 40 man roster with the original team, so when that player gets taken back I assume his option years don't start until that team places him on the 40 man.

Option years apply to the player, not the organization. So for example, if a player gets traded and has had one option year burned with the old organization, he has only 2 remaining option years with the new organization. I haven't seen anything which specifically addresses option years and Rule 5 draftees. But I'd be surprised if the rules were any different with respect to those players. So in other words if DDJ were returned to the Astros and be sent to the minors, I'd be surprised if that didn't count as an option year.

[JJxvi]

Yeah but I don't think you can "option" a Rule 5 player without him going through waivers and the original team declining to take him back.  And when the original team gets him back he is no longer on a 40 man roster and thus I don't think "sending him down" counts as an option either.

[Mr. Happy]

Yeah but I don't think you can "option" a Rule 5 player without him going through waivers and the original team declining to take him back.  And when the original team gets him back he is no longer on a 40 man roster and thus I don't think "sending him down" counts as an option either.

This makes sense.

[Nate Colbert]

Iwakuma goes on DL with "lat strain". However, that seems to be more of a tentative diagnosis until the MRI results come back.

Setback in recovery, out for likely another six weeks.

[Nate Colbert]

So which is it, the mediocre AL West or the mediocre AL East? The Rainjizz just finished sweeping the Yankees in the Bronx (the same Yankees who've lost 10 of their last 11 games).

Hint: it ain't the folks left of the Mississippi who collectively have the worst record of the two divisions.

[Nate Colbert]

After..um..rehabbing, Hamilton joins Rangers tomorrow in Cleveland.

[jbm]

On the ESPN broadcast last night, they speculated that Martin might go to the minors to make room. I assume it won't be DeShields. By the way, it was only one game but DeShields looked great last night. Basically, playing to the best of his scouting reports: speed, contact ability, a little pop, speed and more speed. Watching it was a bad experience.

[Reuben]

On the ESPN broadcast last night, they speculated that Martin might go to the minors to make room. I assume it won't be DeShields. By the way, it was only one game but DeShields looked great last night. Basically, playing to the best of his scouting reports: speed, contact ability, a little pop, speed and more speed. Watching it was a bad experience.

I'm actually kinda rooting for DDJ to do well, when he's not playing the Astros. It seems fairly likely that his "lack of effort" and "bad attitude" problems were over-exaggerated or over-emphasized by scouts, maybe due to some combination of race and background (having a famous MLB relative and being a very high draft pick - something scouts have never forgiven Colin Moran for, for instance). The couple interviews I've seen with him, he's seemed like a decent, intelligent kid.

And who knows, maybe his success and the continued success of JD Martinez (and to a lesser extent Paredes) will force the Astros FO to think twice in the future before cutting loose young high-ceiling players in favor of roster-filler or utility types like Hoes and Torreyes.

[JimR]

On the ESPN broadcast last night, they speculated that Martin might go to the minors to make room. I assume it won't be DeShields. By the way, it was only one game but DeShields looked great last night. Basically, playing to the best of his scouting reports: speed, contact ability, a little pop, speed and more speed. Watching it was a bad experience.

Why?

[Mr. Happy]

I'm actually kinda rooting for DDJ to do well, when he's not playing the Astros. It seems fairly likely that his "lack of effort" and "bad attitude" problems were over-exaggerated or over-emphasized by scouts, maybe due to some combination of race and background (having a famous MLB relative and being a very high draft pick - something scouts have never forgiven Colin Moran for, for instance). The couple interviews I've seen with him, he's seemed like a decent, intelligent kid.

And who knows, maybe his success and the continued success of JD Martinez (and to a lesser extent Paredes) will force the Astros FO to think twice in the future before cutting loose young high-ceiling players in favor of roster-filler or utility types like Hoes and Torreyes.

Me too. Maybe the kid was saving his A-game for the Show.

[jbm]

Why?

A sense of what the Astros might have lost, combined with him doing it for the Rangers. I'd prefer If he was doing this for the Pirates.

[juliogotay]

The Dallas paper is speculating DDS will platoon in CF with Martin. He has been everything they could have hoped for.

[BudGirl]

A sense of what the Astros might have lost, combined with him doing it for the Rangers. I'd prefer If he was doing this for the Pirates.

Personally, I think we have to move on from trades (or other transactions).  And right now, there are a lot of players that the Astros might regret letting go.  The problem is only 25 can sit on that bench at a time.

[roadrunner]

I think we need to get used to players succeeding on other teams.  There is a ton of talent in this system and the rules won't allow them all to stay.

[Mr. Happy]

I think we need to get used to players succeeding on other teams.  There is a ton of talent in this system and the rules won't allow them all to stay.

+1

[pots]

I think we need to get used to players succeeding on other teams.  There is a ton of talent in this system and the rules won't allow them all to stay.

I don't see it is necessarily damning of the current leadership but a pat on the back of the prior leadership.   Turns out Wade/Heck did a real good job.  They started with almost nothing and really started a great base of talent.   They weren't perfect, but they made more good moves then bad. 

ETA.
Just to be clear.  It is not a damning of Luhnow/Elias.  They are doing quite well in their own right.  The team is 5.5 games up on the division due to them aggressively filling holes in the team.   Yeah they let some folks get away.  They weren't their guys though.  It's not uncommon for new leadership to not see the same in players as the past leadership. 

[Nate Colbert]

Per various tweeters, Mariners have acquired Mark Trumbo from the D-Backs.

[jbm]

Heard that Hamilton is on the DL with hamstring strain.  Could be four weeks.

[Col. Sphinx Drummond]

Heard that Hamilton is on the DL with hamstring strain.  Could be four weeks.

That cocksucker makes Roger Clemens look like a drama princess.

[pots]

Impressive.  The A's have a +35 run differential but yet are 10 games below 500.  That's tough to do

[astrosfan76]

Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi 11m11 minutes ago

Sources: #Rangers and #Phillies having ongoing dialogue about Cole Hamels, and he is willing to waive no-trade to Texas. @FOXSports

Ugh

[juliogotay]

Ugh

It has been reported he would not accept a trade to Houston. Not sure why Arlington would be so appealing then.

[jbm]

It has been reported he would not accept a trade to Houston. Not sure why Arlington would be so appealing then.

I don't get it either, but if they get him, I hope they mortgage their future to do it.

[Fredia]

and still no ac. not a wise use of money

[pots]

Ugh

Let them have him.  His interleague numbers are considerably worse.  He's being paid very well.  Lot of miles on that arm.  Likely hood is while he would be helpful this year, he'll fade considerably during the rest of the contract.  Supposedly this is a seller's year.  Texas will have to give up something real good in return.  I also imagine as payment for the waiving of the no trade clause, he'll want that option year invested.

[Jacksonian]

It has been reported he would not accept a trade to Houston. Not sure why Arlington would be so appealing then.

That report is wrong. He doesn't have the Rangers on his no trade.

[astrosfan76]

It has been reported he would not accept a trade to Houston. Not sure why Arlington would be so appealing then.

When was that?  Not doubting it, just don't remember reading anything about it.

[astrosfan76]

That report is wrong. He doesn't have the Rangers on his no trade.

"Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi 1h1 hour ago

In other words, Cole Hamels placed Rangers on his "permitted teams" list when he established no-trade protection for '14-'15 cycle."

He can be traded to the Rangers without being part of the discussion, at this point.

[astrosfan76]

Let them have him.  His interleague numbers are considerably worse.  He's being paid very well.  Lot of miles on that arm.  Likely hood is while he would be helpful this year, he'll fade considerably during the rest of the contract.  Supposedly this is a seller's year.  Texas will have to give up something real good in return.  I also imagine as payment for the waiving of the no trade clause, he'll want that option year invested.

I don't see him being as much of a detriment in the future as you do.  He's the best upgrade available and I don't see Texas being weakened at the MLB level as a result of a trade.  The next best options are rentals and obtaining a frontline starter is going to be easier via trade than on the open market.   

[juliogotay]

When was that?  Not doubting it, just don't remember reading anything about it.

This is what I saw today. http://www.mlbdailydish.com/2015/6/23/8829049/cole-hamels-would-block-a-trade-to-houston-according-to-new-report?_ga=1.197702639.1911031477.1357570501

[Nate Colbert]

Rangers beat writer--

TR Sullivan ‏@Sullivan_Ranger  12 minutes ago
Rangers source says Cole Hamels trade is "not on the board."

Also tweeted out that Adrian Beltre has been activated from DL.

[astrosfan76]

This is what I saw today. http://www.mlbdailydish.com/2015/6/23/8829049/cole-hamels-would-block-a-trade-to-houston-according-to-new-report?_ga=1.197702639.1911031477.1357570501

Sucks, if true. I would hate to see him go to another team in the AL, especially to the Rangers.

[doyce7]

Sucks, if true. I would hate to see him go to another team in the AL, especially to the Rangers.

Living in fort worth I hear a lot about the rangers on sports radio, rangers won't be going after hamels. For one thing the rangers ownership group wants to cut payroll if anything and the FO wouldn't give up the pieces it would take to get him if the Phil's ate 90% of his contract.

[Bench]

Living in fort worth I hear a lot about the rangers on sports radio, rangers won't be going after hamels. For one thing the rangers ownership group wants to cut payroll if anything and the FO wouldn't give up the pieces it would take to get him if the Phil's ate 90% of his contract.

I'm not disputing what you've heard, but if it's based upon local sports radio I generally assume it's inaccurate.

[HudsonHawk]

"Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi 1h1 hour ago

In other words, Cole Hamels placed Rangers on his "permitted teams" list when he established no-trade protection for '14-'15 cycle."

He can be traded to the Rangers without being part of the discussion, at this point.

Exactly.  Hamels doesn't have the Astros on a "no trade" list, he just doesn't have them on a "I can't refuse a trade" list.  He has to name nine teams to which he cannot refuse a trade, and the Astros are not one of those nine team (which was determined before last season, BTW).  That doesn't necessarily mean he has said he will refuse any trade to the Astros, it only means he has to agree to it. 

[Jacksonian]

Exactly.  Hamels doesn't have the Astros on a "no trade" list, he just doesn't have them on a "I can't refuse a trade" list.  He has to name nine teams to which he cannot refuse a trade, and the Astros are not one of those nine team (which was determined before last season, BTW).  That doesn't necessarily mean he has said he will refuse any trade to the Astros, it only means he has to agree to it.

There's a tweet out somewhere that indicates Hamels is willing to be dealt to Houston.

[pots]

MLB traderumors has the Astros targeting Cueto over Hamels.  I like this a lot.  Being a rental he should cost considerably less prospects.  Cueto's interleague numbers are actually slightly better than his career. 

Wonder if a package of Appel and Santana would get it done

[juliogotay]

MLB traderumors has the Astros targeting Cueto over Hamels.  I like this a lot.  Being a rental he should cost considerably less prospects.  Cueto's interleague numbers are actually slightly better than his career. 

Wonder if a package of Appel and Santana would get it done

I'm going to take a contrarian view here and say I would not trade Appel for a rental pitcher. I realize Appel has failed to impress us but he was the #1-1 and I would give him more time to develop. I would deal him for a guy with more time on his contract though.

[jbm]

I'd take a contrarian view and say they could use a bat over an arm. 

[juliogotay]

I'd take a contrarian view and say they could use a bat over an arm.

What type of hitter are you thinking? A high-average type?

[jbm]

What type of hitter are you thinking? A high-average type?

More of a high OBP guy that isn't a slug and a defensive liability.  Just someone to get on base for the power guys.  Just look at how much better this offense is when Jose is hitting, or during the brief stretch when Springer was getting on.  Maybe Lowrie coming back will provide that spark. 

[doyce7]

More of a high OBP guy that isn't a slug and a defensive liability.  Just someone to get on base for the power guys.  Just look at how much better this offense is when Jose is hitting, or during the brief stretch when Springer was getting on.  Maybe Lowrie coming back will provide that spark.

If we get April lowrie back then I think he fills that hole somewhat. I think we need another starter because I feel like Velasquez and maybe mccullers will be in the bullpen at the end of the year to keep innings down. That leaves a huge hole.

[juliogotay]

If we get April lowrie back then I think he fills that hole somewhat. I think we need another starter because I feel like Velasquez and maybe mccullers will be in the bullpen at the end of the year to keep innings down. That leaves a huge hole.

I still think Kazmir is a more realistic target. One blogger threw out the name of Mike Leake and he has strong GB #s. Could be a Luhnow type guy.

[doyce7]

I still think Kazmir is a more realistic target. One blogger threw out the name of Mike Leake and he has strong GB #s. Could be a Luhnow type guy.

I like leake. I would rather him than kasmir, though kasmir would be nice.

[astrosfan76]

I'm going to take a contrarian view here and say I would not trade Appel for a rental pitcher. I realize Appel has failed to impress us but he was the #1-1 and I would give him more time to develop. I would deal him for a guy with more time on his contract though.

Same here. If you can get 3-4 years out of a frontline starter, that's fine. But, 6 years of club control is too much for a two-month rental.

[Mike S.]

Jordan Zimmermann might also be available, but I would think his asking price would be extremely high and I'm not sure just how keen the Nationals are to move him, if at all.

[doyce7]

Jordan Zimmermann might also be available, but I would think his asking price would be extremely high and I'm not sure just how keen the Nationals are to move him, if at all.

I can't imagine what it would take to get a starting pitcher away from a contending team

[Fredia]

depends on what the team needs and what the astros are willing to part with

[Nate Colbert]

Angst in Anaheim:

Emotions simmered in a series of meetings over the weekend when Dipoto expressed frustration with the coaches’ failure to convey scouting information to the players, sources said. At least one coach responded heatedly to Dipoto and first baseman Albert Pujols issued a pointed rebuttal to his GM, sources said.

Dipoto, according to sources, believes that the coaches too often rely on “feel” while teams such as the AL West-leading Astros are at the forefront of incorporating data. The coaches, in turn, seemingly do not trust the information they are given, and either are not willing or able to translate it for the players.

[pots]

Same here. If you can get 3-4 years out of a frontline starter, that's fine. But, 6 years of club control is too much for a two-month rental.

Unfortunately, there is only one pitcher that fits what you want and the asking price will gut the farm.  I'd guess you'd be looking at a package of Appel, Phillips, Feliz and and another player.  And I don't see how you can overlook the fact he's struggled against the AL.   Plus, you will likely be forced to pick up the option year locking you into 100 million over the next 4.5 years.   No thanks.  There are so many more reasons not to do this deal than there is to do it. 


Edit.  gut might be too harsh, but it would severely reduce the near ready prospects.

[MusicMan]

Unfortunately, there is only one pitcher that fits what you want and the asking price will gut the farm.  I'd guess you'd be looking at a package of Appel, Phillips, Feliz and and another player.  And I don't see how you can overlook the fact he's struggled against the AL.   Plus, you will likely be forced to pick up the option year locking you into 100 million over the next 4.5 years.   No thanks.  There are so many more reasons not to do this deal than there is to do it. 


Edit.  gut might be too harsh, but it would severely reduce the near ready prospects.

That entirely depends on how much money the Phillies are including.

[juliogotay]

Unfortunately, there is only one pitcher that fits what you want and the asking price will gut the farm.  I'd guess you'd be looking at a package of Appel, Phillips, Feliz and and another player.  And I don't see how you can overlook the fact he's struggled against the AL.   Plus, you will likely be forced to pick up the option year locking you into 100 million over the next 4.5 years.   No thanks.  There are so many more reasons not to do this deal than there is to do it. 


Edit.  gut might be too harsh, but it would severely reduce the near ready prospects.

at some point Luhnow almost has to move some prospects because of the limitations of the 40-man and Rule 5. I'd rather not move the names you mentioned but there are going to be some tough decisions to make for roster management and the trade deadline would be a logical time to make some of those.

[HudsonHawk]

at some point Luhnow almost has to move some prospects because of the limitations of the 40-man and Rule 5. I'd rather not move the names you mentioned but there are going to be some tough decisions to make for roster management and the trade deadline would be a logical time to make some of those.

That or move some of the veterans.  There's no reason to move prospects and keep a guy like Feldman, or Qualls, or Carter for that matter.  If you have a catcher ready, there's no reason to hang on to Castro. 

[pots]

at some point Luhnow almost has to move some prospects because of the limitations of the 40-man and Rule 5. I'd rather not move the names you mentioned but there are going to be some tough decisions to make for roster management and the trade deadline would be a logical time to make some of those.

Which is why I think a rental ace may make a lot of sense to the Astros.  You move just a couple of top prospects for a 3 month rental (instead of 3 or 4).  You free up 2 spots without doing too much damage to the farm and making the end of year decisions easier.  While still staying young and not committing too much salary.  A contract like Hamels has the ability to be severely detrimental in a couple of years.  A decent amount of risk in him switching leagues and remaining 20+ million dollar effective into his mid 30s.


You add Cueto to Kuechel, McCullers, McHugh and Velasquez.  Keep the losses to just Appel and Santana. 

Then next year one of Feliz, Straily, Wojo, Obie, Rodgers, etc. step up to fill some of the void left by Cueto.  You don't need Appel.  And the Astros have multiple copies of Santana. Or perhaps could add a bat via free agency in the offseason. 

You might also want to sell a little.  Feldman really has no place when he returns.  His contract was front-loaded.  Owed just 8 million next year.  Maybe not now though, more into the offseason for Feldman.  Might need to go a 6-man rotation to keep the innings down on the young guns

Edit #99:
The farm is much more able to handle a rent-an-ace than it was back in 98.  I think the fears of the Big Unit fallout may way to heavily on people's minds.  Plus, IMO, prospects are weighed more heavily now than back then.  So you can get more with less prospects.

[Nate Colbert]

Angst in Anaheim:

And now Dipoto may be stepping down.

[astrosfan76]

Unfortunately, there is only one pitcher that fits what you want and the asking price will gut the farm.  I'd guess you'd be looking at a package of Appel, Phillips, Feliz and and another player.  And I don't see how you can overlook the fact he's struggled against the AL.   Plus, you will likely be forced to pick up the option year locking you into 100 million over the next 4.5 years.   No thanks.  There are so many more reasons not to do this deal than there is to do it. 


Edit.  gut might be too harsh, but it would severely reduce the near ready prospects.

Eh, there could be others who aren't being discussed currently who become available (conversely, there could be rentals taken off the market). But, if we just want to stick to Hamels, I really don't think he's going to implode if traded to the AL based on a couple of starts per season (he has had decent-good seasons over his career, as well). You trade for a rental, you get nothing in return when you lose them in free agency; you lose Hamels in free agency in a few years, you may get a comp pick. You trade for Hamels, you get a guy who's been an ace over his career at the going rate for a 2/3 starter without having to overbid. His contract will expire around the time that we may try to lock up some of our big names. You trade for a rental, you're still talking about giving up the biggest of the prospects with nothing in return after this season. Then, you take a step back next season. Why step back when we can keep moving forward?

[JimR]

I hate rentals. I would rather promote kids.

[Fredia]

kinda agree with you, you never quite know what a rental will bring

[Mr. Happy]

I hate rentals. I would rather promote kids.

+1

[NeilT]

+1

I loved the Sea Hag when he was here, and then Beltran, but you really are committing yourself to them when they are at the very top of their market.  Given the state of the minors and the quality of play, I wouldn't mind 7 or 8 wins plus some quality post season (and I can't believe I'm saying that) from a rental pitcher as long as it didn't cost too much, and we didn't sell the farm to keep him. 

[JimR]

I was talking about now. Getting Johnson and Beltran blew me away.

[juliogotay]

Dipoto resigned today as Angels G.M.  You don't see that much from a contending club at mid-season. Says something about Sciosa's clout w\in the organization.

[Nate Colbert]

Kazmir getting sexier: tonight he went 8 IP, 2 hits, 0 runs, 7 Ks. Last 5 outings: 35 IP, 21 H, 6 ERs, 7 W, 31 Ks.

Jane Lee ‏@JaneMLB  2 hours ago
Kazmir has a 0.91 ERA in seven starts against AL West opponents this year, and a 4.22 ERA in nine starts against everyone else.

[juliogotay]

I have read some buzz out of Oakland that the Astros may be interested in a Kazmir and Reddick deal. And that was before Springer got hurt.
Not saying there is any credibility to it but it may be worth exploring.

I also heard yesterday on the MLB Network from Heyman that he was in Astros camp this Spring talking to Luhnow and he remarked about some of the young talent in camp and Luhnow allegedly implied that some of their best weren't here yet.

[Reuben]

I have read some buzz out of Oakland that the Astros may be interested in a Kazmir and Reddick deal. And that was before Springer got hurt.
Not saying there is any credibility to it but it may be worth exploring.

I also heard yesterday on the MLB Network from Heyman that he was in Astros camp this Spring talking to Luhnow and he remarked about some of the young talent in camp and Luhnow allegedly implied that some of their best weren't here yet.

I'm trying to think who he might have meant - were Phillips, VV, and McCullers "in camp", or just used as cameo players?

In any case, this got me thinking about how an Astros Top Prospects list might look currently, if you only include guys currently in the minors. Maybe something like:

Phillips
Bregman/K. Tucker/Cameron
Feliz
Appel
Nottingham
Fisher
AJ Reed
Musgrove
Kemp
Francis Martes
Hader
Moran
Gustave
JD Davis
T. Hernandez
Guduan

I dunno. Really hard to rank these guys, and I'm sure I must be forgetting somebody important. You could throw Eshelman and Ferrell in there somewhere too and get an even 20.

[JimR]

Rangers DFAed Feliz.

[jbm]

Wow, haven't followed him closely lately, but that surprises me.

[Mr. Happy]

Rangers DFAed Feliz.

That's a bit odd, given that he gave them two scoreless frames last night. Lots of notable DFA's in baseball yesterday, including Joba Chamberlain and Tom Gorzelany.

[Nate Colbert]

As expected, the Mariners activated LHP David Rollins today after serving his 80-game PED suspension. The Rule 5er from the Astros had spent the last 16 days pitching in the minors under the allowed rehab rules in such situations.

Said Lloyd McClendon of Rollins' minors stint:

"He pitched extremely well. He was 93 [to] 96 [mph], and his last outing, he pitched two innings, struck out four. He's a power left-handed arm that we're excited about, and hopefully he'll fit quite nicely into our bullpen."

Link

ETA:

And immediately thrust into his 1st MLB game this afternoon, throwing a perfect inning with a strikeout.

[juliogotay]

As expected, the Mariners activated LHP David Rollins today after serving his 80-game PED suspension. The Rule 5er from the Astros had spent the last 16 days pitching in the minors under the allowed rehab rules in such situations.

Said Lloyd McClendon of Rollins' minors stint:

"He pitched extremely well. He was 93 [to] 96 [mph], and his last outing, he pitched two innings, struck out four. He's a power left-handed arm that we're excited about, and hopefully he'll fit quite nicely into our bullpen."

Link

ETA:

And immediately thrust into his 1st MLB game this afternoon, throwing a perfect inning with a strikeout.

I had followed, and touted, Rollins on this board from his AA days. Hated to lose him but that's where we are now. Cupboard is full.

[Reuben]

I had followed, and touted, Rollins on this board from his AA days. ...

All the way back to the Fall of 2013, huh?

[juliogotay]

All the way back to the Fall of 2013, huh?

Guilty as charged. But he wasn't a guy that ever made a Top  (fill in the blank)  List of prospects or got talked about here or anywhere else. He was pretty much, to my recollection, JAG.  And he may stick which a majority of Rule 5ers don't do.

[GreatBagwellsBeard]

Kazmir pulled after 3 innings with tightness.  Supposedly not a big deal, but you'd have to imagine that any trade partners would want a full physical work-up before agreeing to anything.

[astrosfan76]

Kazmir pulled after 3 innings with tightness.  Supposedly not a big deal, but you'd have to imagine that any trade partners would want a full physical work-up before agreeing to anything.

Especially as a pitcher who has only cracked 30 starts three times since being called up in '04 and only hit 200 innings once in his career ('07).  If someone trades for him, it will be with the expectation that he can be on the mound every time his turn comes up.  His track record doesn't provide confidence that he will.  I hope he is able to bounce back, but I don't know that I'd want to be the one to take that chance.

[Jacksonian]

CJ Wilson may not pitch again this season.

[hostros7]

CJ Wilson may not pitch again this season.

@BillShaikin: CJ Wilson has pitched w/bone spurs in elbow since April. Surgery now because range of motion diminished, increased risk of shoulder injury.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gwat]

I kind of liked it when CJ was throwing against us.

[JimR]

CJ Wilson may not pitch again this season.

Article yesterday re some of his teammates doubting the seriousness of his injury.

[Reuben]

Article yesterday re some of his teammates doubting the seriousness of his injury.

That sounds rather damning. His teammates think he's wimping out on them?

[Mr. Happy]

Halos lose in extras today against the Dojers. That's six losses in a row. Four game lead now.

[NeilT]

Halos lose in extras today against the Dojers. That's six losses in a row. Four game lead now.

Can't have enough.  Truth is though, I wouldn't mind the Halos with a wild card berth.

[geezerdonk]

I don't think that this is the first time that Wilson's teammates have questioned  his commitment. He was a self absorbed flake when he was with Texas.

[das]

Unsurprisingly, Kazmir is the AL pitcher of the month.

http://m.astros.mlb.com/news/2015/08/03/140922350/scott-kazmir-named-al-pitcher-of-the-month