Buh-Bye PAT

[Limey]

I.e. the ol' one-pointer.

Goodell has suggested canning it, in favor of a TD being 7 points, and then teams able to tack on - or lose - a point based on the outcome of a single extra play.

I haven't heard anything quite this stupid in a long time.  A long time.

[Bench]

I.e. the ol' one-pointer.

Goodell has suggested canning it, in favor of a TD being 7 points, and then teams able to tack on - or lose - a point based on the outcome of a single extra play.

I haven't heard anything quite this stupid in a long time.  A long time.

As long as we're not talking about concussions, he's fine with that.

[NeilT]

As long as we're not talking about concussions, he's fine with that.

The field goal was always a British conspiracy to make Football--Real Football, America's Game--more like rugby.  Good riddance, I say.  There's no reason to have one of the loveliest plays in sports as part of a game designed to be brutish, violent, and stupid. 

[Limey]

The field goal was always a British conspiracy to make Football--Real Football, America's Game--more like rugby.  Good riddance, I say.  There's no reason to have one of the loveliest plays in sports as part of a game designed to be brutish, violent, and stupid. 

Rugby isn't beanbag.

[Bench]

Rugby isn't beanbag.

I think requiring teams to take the PAT from the longitude of the endzone where the team scored (a la rubgy) would be a very entertaining wrinkle to the game. 

[BizidyDizidy]

I prefer the idea of making the player who scored the TD kick it.

[Bench]

I prefer the idea of making the player who scored the TD kick it.

Kickers need jobs too.

[Limey]

Kickers need jobs too.

Yes.  Just not in sports.

[geezerdonk]

Make it a drop kick from the 20 yard line.

[Lefty]

Yes.  Just not in sports.

That's why jesus invented soccer.

[austro]

Make it a drop kick from the 20 yard line.

My dad always used to suggest that they have a single post with a can on top. You have to knock the can off the post to get a point. That would probably just result in everybody going for two points all the time, although that's not the worst possible outcome.

[Limey]

My dad always used to suggest that they have a single post with a can on top. You have to knock the can off the post to get a point. That would probably just result in everybody going for two points all the time, although that's not the worst possible outcome.

As mentioned above by Bench, in rugby, the kick is worth 2 points because the kick has to be made from anywhere on a line drawn back from where the try (TD) was scored.  The try is 5 points, the kick 2.  This does two things: (1) makes the kick harder as tries are often scored along the sidelines; and (2) makes scoring a try under the posts the equivalent of a 7-point play.  That would be an improvement (IMHO), although in rugby, the kicker has to be one of the outfield players.  Otherwise, I like the idea of eliminating the kick and make them go for 2 every time. 

I have a theory as to why the sudden enthusiasm for making the PAT more exciting: Advertisers.  There's a ton of advertising space crammed around a TD, PAT and kick-off.  However, once it's clear that the scoring team isn't going for 2, then everyone is free to have a piss and get another beer - skipping the commercials.  They may have told the NFL to fix that.

[NeilT]

As mentioned above by Bench, in rugby, the kick is worth 2 points because the kick has to be made from anywhere on a line drawn back from where the try (TD) was scored.  The try is 5 points, the kick 2.  This does two things: (1) makes the kick harder as tries are often scored along the sidelines; and (2) makes scoring a try under the posts the equivalent of a 7-point play.  That would be an improvement (IMHO), although in rugby, the kicker has to be one of the outfield players. 

This is why I love English sports.  The descriptions sound remotely comprehensible, but they're really not.

[Mike S.]

It should also be noted that in rugby a try is awarded only when the ball is grounded with downward pressure in the try zone (hence, the term "touchdown" in American football), not for merely breaking the plane, which increases the relevancy of where the conversion is taken (see Limey's post).  Players are taught first and foremost, get the try.  Worry about the conversion after.  Watching a kicker slot a conversion from thirty meters out and near the touchline (i.e. out of bounds) is a thing of beauty, especially at the end of the match with the outcome on the line, and just as often conversion attempts fail.  American football could learn something from that.

[HudsonHawk]

It should also be noted that in rugby a try is awarded only when the ball is grounded with downward pressure in the try zone (hence, the term "touchdown" in American football), not for merely breaking the plane, which increases the relevancy of where the conversion is taken (see Limey's post).  Players are taught first and foremost, get the try.  Worry about the conversion after.  Watching a kicker slot a conversion from thirty meters out and near the touchline (i.e. out of bounds) is a thing of beauty, especially at the end of the match with the outcome on the line, and just as often conversion attempts fail.  American football could learn something from that.

I fail to see why kickers missing PATs would be "a thing of beauty". 

[Limey]

It should also be noted that in rugby a try is awarded only when the ball is grounded with downward pressure in the try zone (hence, the term "touchdown" in American football), not for merely breaking the plane, which increases the relevancy of where the conversion is taken (see Limey's post).  Players are taught first and foremost, get the try.  Worry about the conversion after.  

Here's Will Carling, former England captain and alleged Diana molester, getting this completely and hilariously wrong.

[Mike S.]

Successfully converting a try with a kick close to the touchline is the thing of beauty.  If you're on the opposing team, I suppose an unsuccessful conversion attempt would also be a thing of beauty.

[drew corleone]

FG posts should be narrower regardless, IMO, but they should have separate posts for PATs that are even closer together, aesthetics be damned... 9-10 feet.

[Limey]

FG posts should be narrower regardless, IMO, but they should have separate posts for PATs that are even closer together, aesthetics be damned... 9-10 feet.

So you want to literally be moving the goalposts?

[HudsonHawk]

Successfully converting a try with a kick close to the touchline is the thing of beauty.  If you're on the opposing team, I suppose an unsuccessful conversion attempt would also be a thing of beauty.

The same can be said for a 50 yard field goal to win the game as time expires.

[HudsonHawk]

FG posts should be narrower regardless, IMO, but they should have separate posts for PATs that are even closer together, aesthetics be damned... 9-10 feet.

Damn.  That's cutting them in half.  That would certainly make it more of a challenge.

[Limey]

Damn.  That's cutting them in half.  That would certainly make it more of a challenge.

[Randy Bullock starts updating his resume]

[Bench]

The same can be said for a 50 yard field goal to win the game as time expires.

But when it's an extra point it's not so exciting.  That's the whole point.

[HudsonHawk]

But when it's an extra point it's not so exciting.  That's the whole point.

There are lots of things in rugby that aren't particularly exciting either.  That's *my* point. 

[Bench]

There are lots of things in rugby that aren't particularly exciting either.  That's *my* point. 

But the extra points are much more likely to be exciting, which is the point of the conversation. 

[subnuclear]

On-side kicks should be mandatory and kicks from 50+ yards should count for 5 points.

[HudsonHawk]

But the extra points are much more likely to be exciting, which is the point of the conversation. 

But my point is directly to the assertion that football should change its rules because a particular rugby play is exciting.   There are just as many boring plays in rugby, should football adopt them too?  Should rugby adopt some football rules because that particular football play is exciting?   

[Bench]

But my point is directly to the assertion that football should change its rules because a particular rugby play is exciting.   There are just as many boring plays in rugby, should football adopt them too?  Should rugby adopt some football rules because that particular football play is exciting?   

I think the extra point is fine how it is, but if the NFL wants to make extra points more dramatic than they should look to other examples where extra points are more dramatic. 

[HudsonHawk]

On-side kicks should be mandatory and kicks from 50+ yards should count for 5 points.

There has long been talk about making longer field goals worth more points, presumably so teams would try longer kicks more often.  But the biggest gripe seems to be that kicking is too good, and they want to encourage more fourth down plays and hopefully longer drives and more touchdowns.  Encouraging kicks is contrary to that.

[Bench]

There has long been talk about making longer field goals worth more points, presumably so teams would try longer kicks more often.  But the biggest gripe seems to be that kicking is too good, and they want to encourage more fourth down plays and hopefully longer drives and more touchdowns.  Encouraging kicks is contrary to that.

Sometimes it seems the Houston sports world is upside down.  The kicking in NFL is too good?  MLB teams are swimming in RSN cash?  Cats and dogs are living together?

[HudsonHawk]

I think the extra point is fine how it is, but if the NFL wants to make extra points more dramatic than they should look to other examples where extra points are more dramatic. 

I think the NFL is lamenting that the kicking in general has become *too* good.  They want to discourage kicks and encourage fourth down plays and more touchdowns.  The same goes for kickoffs and punts. 

[HudsonHawk]

I think the NFL is lamenting that the kicking in general has become *too* good.  They want to discourage kicks and encourage fourth down plays and more touchdowns.  The same goes for kickoffs and punts. 

In a world of pretty much automatic, Houston seems to be struggling.  If it was to want to hire a prostitute, she'd probably say "not interested".

[chuck]

If it was to want to hire a prostitute, she'd probably say "not interested".

I saw this happen to a friend of mine.

[HudsonHawk]

I saw this happen to a friend of mine.

Does that mean you're denying ownership of the dildo?

[chuck]

Does that mean you're denying ownership of the dildo?

Can't talk about it.

[Limey]

I think the NFL is lamenting that the kicking in general has become *too* good.  They want to discourage kicks and encourage fourth down plays and more touchdowns.  The same goes for kickoffs and punts. 

Nope.  The thing they are talking about changing is just the PAT.

[NeilT]

Nope.  The thing they are talking about changing is just the PAT.

They could improve the PAT by reducing the offensive lineman to the center and only allow one running back to block.  There would be a lot fewer points-after actually made, and a lot more excitement for typical NFL fans.

[HudsonHawk]

Nope.  The thing they are talking about changing is just the PAT.

Yeah, right now.  I'm saying this is just symptomatic of the larger issue of kicking becoming too predictable.

[drew corleone]

Agreed with HH. I think that the conversion rate of a 50+ yard FG this season was 67% or thereabouts. As you move closer it went up to almost 100% for FGs inside of 30 yards.

Kicking has been part of the game forever and I don't think it should be abolished (the NFLPA would probably not take kindly to it), but there is precedence for increasing the difficulty. Goalposts have been narrowed and tees have been eliminated. Right now it's a non-play that adds very little to the game, IMO.

[Limey]

Kicking is the only area of the game where improvements in physical ability are not matched and offset by the opponent.  It makes sense, therefore, over time, to adjust the rules regarding kicks.

[Limey]

I saw this happen to a friend of mine.

Too beaucoup?

[chuck]

Too beaucoup?

I somehow doubt that was the leading issue.

[Duman]

The same can be said for a 50 yard field goal to win the game as time expires.

[Auburn Fan Gloat] Especially when they miss and your guy runs it back 109 yards for a touchdown![/Auburn Fan Gloat]