Author Topic: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."  (Read 4401 times)

Alkie

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"Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« on: February 18, 2007, 08:42:20 pm »
That's what Chip Caray said on the air during a broadcast in 2003.

It was just as stupid as what Purpura said about Jennings today.  

Before the trade, I thought we all agreed in here that Jennings would be nice as a servicable #3 or #4.  Now, I'm to believe he's a #1 or #2 on any team in the league?  C'mon Tim, that's just silly.

Burzmali

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2007, 10:16:54 pm »
Quote:

That's what Chip Caray said on the air during a broadcast in 2003.

It was just as stupid as what Purpura said about Jennings today.  

Before the trade, I thought we all agreed in here that Jennings would be nice as a servicable #3 or #4.  Now, I'm to believe he's a #1 or #2 on any team in the league?  C'mon Tim, that's just silly.





What teams in the league wouldn't he be a 1 or 2 guy on?

Alkie

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2007, 10:37:52 pm »
Atlanta
Florida
NY Mets
Philadelphia
Milwaukee
Chicago Cubs
Arizona
Los Angeles Dodgers
San Francisco
San Diego

You're not helping him.

Bench

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2007, 11:24:03 pm »
No, no, no. You're just not getting it. He was the ace of the Rockies staff, which means he's an "ace." He's the all-time Rockies leader in wins, fercriyinoutloud.

That being said, he's certainly a serviceable number 2 on this squad.
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JimR

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2007, 01:39:31 am »
Jennings has been a #2 since the day the trade was made. that was the point of it. if you thought he was no better than a #3 or #4, i think you were the only one.
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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2007, 08:53:46 am »
Quote:

That's what Chip Caray said on the air during a broadcast in 2003.

It was just as stupid as what Purpura said about Jennings today.  

Before the trade, I thought we all agreed in here that Jennings would be nice as a servicable #3 or #4.  Now, I'm to believe he's a #1 or #2 on any team in the league?  C'mon Tim, that's just silly.






Alkie...you've been bashing this trade from day one...I thought you'd finally gotten over until...

I agree that an arguement could be made that Jennings is not a number one or two starter, but arguements can be made to the contrary as well.  Anyhow, you should know better...it's not like you have some crystal ball and can tell the future...let it go...let's let Jason's performance in '07 speak for itself in terms of his role on this team.

Burzmali

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2007, 03:20:03 pm »
Quote:

Atlanta
Florida
NY Mets
Philadelphia
Milwaukee
Chicago Cubs
Arizona
Los Angeles Dodgers
San Francisco
San Diego

You're not helping him.





I disagree strongly about the Mets, Cubs, Zona, San Fran, Milwaukee, and Philly.

Technically, you're right that Tim's comment is incorrect. But it's not "silly". Jennings is a clear frontline #1 or #2 starter for most teams. I know you will probably say that I'm a troll for mentioning this, but he ranked 11th among all ML pitchers last season in VORP.

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2007, 03:32:32 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Atlanta
Florida
NY Mets
Philadelphia
Milwaukee
Chicago Cubs
Arizona
Los Angeles Dodgers
San Francisco
San Diego

You're not helping him.





I disagree strongly about the Mets, Cubs, Zona, San Fran, Milwaukee, and Philly.

Technically, you're right that Tim's comment is incorrect. But it's not "silly". Jennings is a clear frontline #1 or #2 starter for most teams. I know you will probably say that I'm a troll for mentioning this, but he ranked 11th among all ML pitchers last season in VORP.





I got VORP after a trip to Papagayo's one time and it ranked 1st with me for a couple of days.
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ValpoCory

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2007, 03:35:48 pm »
By definition, there are 30 #1 pitchers and 30 #2 pitchers in MLB.  Is Jason Jennings one of the top 60 pitchers in the major leagues?  If he is in that 31-60 range, then on average, he's a #2.  On some teams like Colorado he's a #1 and on other teams he'd be a #3, but I think he's a #2 on average, as well as on the Astros.

ValpoCory

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #9 on: February 19, 2007, 03:41:30 pm »
Quote:

That's what Chip Caray said on the air during a broadcast in 2003.

It was just as stupid as what Purpura said about Jennings today.  

Before the trade, I thought we all agreed in here that Jennings would be nice as a servicable #3 or #4.  Now, I'm to believe he's a #1 or #2 on any team in the league?  C'mon Tim, that's just silly.





I read the linked article where it said what NYCU reported,

"Purpura drew some criticism for the deal, but he stands by it, saying Jennings would probably be the No. 1 or No. 2 starter on almost any team in the league.

?Did we overpay? I don't feel that way,? Purpura said. ?I feel like I've got a No. 2 starter and I don't know that there are many clubs this year who traded for (No.) 1 or 2 starters. I think we made a good deal.?"

Now the author, Chris Duncan, hopefully was paraphasing a separate Tim Purpura quote and not summarizing the one that comes in that second paragraph.

JimR

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2007, 04:01:30 pm »
penicillin would have knocked that out in no time.
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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2007, 05:06:20 pm »
Quote:

I read the linked article where it said what NYCU reported,

"Purpura drew some criticism for the deal, but he stands by it, saying Jennings would probably be the No. 1 or No. 2 starter on almost any team in the league.

?Did we overpay? I don't feel that way,? Purpura said. ?I feel like I've got a No. 2 starter and I don't know that there are many clubs this year who traded for (No.) 1 or 2 starters. I think we made a good deal.?"

Now the author, Chris Duncan, hopefully was paraphasing a separate Tim Purpura quote and not summarizing the one that comes in that second paragraph.





If they can sign Double J long-term, then the deal was solid.  Otherwise, it was overpaying.  We shall see.  He will be a better addition to this team this season than Hirsh, Bucholz, or Willy T would have been.
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JimR

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2007, 05:59:21 pm »
the only one i mind losing is WT. Hirsh was not all that.
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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2007, 06:23:37 pm »
I hope losing Willy's "D" doesn't come back to bite them in the ass.

JimR

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2007, 06:40:23 pm »
Burke won't be much worse, except for throwing. WT struggled with defense. i'll miss his speed and his potential as a leadoff hitter.
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MusicMan

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2007, 06:43:36 pm »
Quote:

Burke won't be much worse, except for throwing. WT struggled with defense. i'll miss his speed and his potential as a leadoff hitter.




I thought Willy's routes and positioning improved significantly the latter half of last season.
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coop

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2007, 06:49:46 pm »
Jim, what do you think Burke's potential as a top of the order hitter will be?  Certainly he won't be mistaken for Willy T on the basepaths and isn't going to drive opposing pitchers as nuts when he's on base.

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2007, 06:59:00 pm »
me, too, MM, and i thought working with Sean Berry again would make him a significantly better hitter. they were together in RR when WT won the batting title.

coop: i do not know. i think he'll be fine at 1 or 2, but he won't be trying to get walks, i'll bet. i'd rather have WT at 1 and Burke at 2 when Biggio is gone. not gonna happen now.
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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2007, 09:42:05 pm »
Quote:

the only one i mind losing is WT. Hirsh was not all that.




But I thought Hirsh SAID he was going to  win a Cy Young this year.

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2007, 11:32:47 pm »
Quote:

Atlanta
Florida
NY Mets
Philadelphia
Milwaukee
Chicago Cubs
Arizona
Los Angeles Dodgers
San Francisco
San Diego

You're not helping him.





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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #20 on: February 20, 2007, 08:27:23 am »
I'm not gonna miss any of the three (Taveras, Hirsh, Bucholtz). I'm too excited about the upcoming season to second guess anything. Of course, that could change a week into the season. Willy had improved his positioning but still seemed slow on reads. I also thought he should have become a little more productive as a base crook after his rookie season. I can't totally write Bucholtz off, he could suprise, I just doubt he'll do anything. uh... yeah, Hirsh is going to win the Cy Young.
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MusicMan

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Re: "Shawn Estes Would Be a #1 On Any Other Team in the NL."
« Reply #21 on: February 20, 2007, 10:18:29 am »
Quote:

Quote:

the only one i mind losing is WT. Hirsh was not all that.




But I thought Hirsh SAID he was going to  win a Cy Young this year.





No, he said it was his GOAL.  God forbid he aim high.
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