Jakes claim Sox cheated

[pravata]

Joe Strauss, St L Post Distpatch
 
"During Wednesday's rout, the Cardinals dugout became convinced a center-field camera at U.S. Cellular Field was tipping pitches to the home team.

Signs were changed after the fifth inning, and the White Sox went four for 36 with one extra-base hit and one run after the switch. "

"Let's put it this way," one Cardinals source said Thursday night. "They looked like they knew what was coming the first two nights. They looked like they had no idea tonight."

"You figure it out."
Link

[Zan]

It surprises me that in our day and age of technological possibilities for stealing signs that it doesn't happen 24/7. Or does it?

[CJM]

I noticed Ausmus was using multiple signs, even when the bases were empty.  Seems like they felt there may have been some merit to the Jakes complaints.

[Phil_in_CS]

Quote:
I noticed Ausmus was using multiple signs, even when the bases were empty.  Seems like they felt there may have been some merit to the Jakes complaints.

Using multiple signs with a runner on second indicates it is expected that teams will try to pass the signs to batters when they can.

JD on air last night was talking about this, and what he wondered was how do you get the signal to the batter. There would be lots of options for a runner on second to do something to signal the batter. Without a teammate standing there, I'm not sure what you could do without that to get the sign or location in, in a manner that isn't noticed by the other team or TV crews. First base coach has a wire and signals the batter? Some would notice that.

They did say last night this was a long running complaint against the sox.

[HudsonHawk]

Quote:

Quote:
I noticed Ausmus was using multiple signs, even when the bases were empty.  Seems like they felt there may have been some merit to the Jakes complaints.

Using multiple signs with a runner on second indicates it is expected that teams will try to pass the signs to batters when they can.

JD on air last night was talking about this, and what he wondered was how do you get the signal to the batter. There would be lots of options for a runner on second to do something to signal the batter. Without a teammate standing there, I'm not sure what you could do without that to get the sign or location in, in a manner that isn't noticed by the other team or TV crews. First base coach has a wire and signals the batter? Some would notice that.

They did say last night this was a long running complaint against the sox.

There are any number of ways to signal the batter, from yelling something to something as simple as putting your hands on your knees for a breaking pitch, touching the bill of your helmet, etc.

[JimR]

while at coaching first base at UT, i stole signs and others things i noticed from the pitchers' grip and relayed the pitches to anyone who wanted them. i signaled Coach Falk, and he told the hitters through a first name fastball last name breaking ball system. that is part of the game as far as i am concerned.

[No? in Austin]

Quote:
while at coaching first base at UT, i stole signs and others things i noticed from the pitchers' grip and relayed the pitches to anyone who wanted them. i signaled Coach Falk, and he told the hitters through a first name fastball last name breaking ball system. that is part of the game as far as i am concerned.

There was a time when Jeff Kent was playing on the Astros that I thought that squad was keen on stealing signs.  I think it was the first year he was on the team.  I have no proof they did, but a lot of the manuerisms and just uncanny way the team up and down the lineup almost knew what was coming from the pitcher.  I know it's probably not true though, just my suspicion.  One time in Pittsburgh, I saw Richard Hidalgo actually stay on a pitch on the outside part of the plate perfectly.  He drove it to right field off the wall.  I had never in all my days watching Hidalgo hit a baseball saw him do that.  It was in the ninth inning and led to a win when it looked for all the world the Astros were going to lose.  Kent was the one at second base, so I suspected he was stealing signs and location somehow.

Last night, Joe Crede hit a perfect outside fastball at the knees from Andy Pettitte.  Crede isn't known for his prowess with the bat.  What he did to hit that pitch is usually what you see great hitters do with that pitch.  Stealing signs and location by the ChiSox?  I think it has merit.  And I don't think it's limited to Chicago's home stadium.  I think they've figured out a way to do it everywhere they play.

Face it, the ChiSox are a great team.  They can hit a baseball.  And they destroy mistake pitches.  But when a pitcher makes a perfect pitch against an average hitter like Crede and he hits it like he did... then there is room to consider it.  An inside pitch to Dye previous to that hit was also perfect and I have no idea how Dye knew it going to be an inside fasball and he was ready to get to it.

[HudsonHawk]

Quote:
while at coaching first base at UT, i stole signs and others things i noticed from the pitchers' grip and relayed the pitches to anyone who wanted them. i signaled Coach Falk, and he told the hitters through a first name fastball last name breaking ball system. that is part of the game as far as i am concerned.

In high school,our coach picked up the pitches from the pitcher's grip and simply yelled "HOT" for a fastball and "WAIT" for a curveball.  Everyone, including the pitcher and catcher knew, but there was nothing they could do about it.  He wasn't stealing signs, he was simply recognizing the pitch while the pitcher was still in the windup and calling it out.
 
Also, my coach had me practice recognizing someone stealing our signs.  We'd have a little scrimmage and he'd stand eiteher behind the pitcher or at 2B and relay signals he'd worked out with the guys hitting.  It was my job to try to recognize what he was doing and how he was signaling the hitters.

[hostros7]

Quote:
while at coaching first base at UT, i stole signs and others things i noticed from the pitchers' grip and relayed the pitches to anyone who wanted them. i signaled Coach Falk, and he told the hitters through a first name fastball last name breaking ball system. that is part of the game as far as i am concerned.

I couldn't agree with you more, but in terms of that technological espionage shit the Sox are accused of...save it for Russia

[Zan]

Quote:

Quote:
while at coaching first base at UT, i stole signs and others things i noticed from the pitchers' grip and relayed the pitches to anyone who wanted them. i signaled Coach Falk, and he told the hitters through a first name fastball last name breaking ball system. that is part of the game as far as i am concerned.

I couldn't agree with you more, but in terms of that technological espionage shit the Sox are accused of...save it for Russia

What are the MLB rules on sign-stealing? My assumption has always been it's okay if you steal the signs with a naked eye, but not okay if you're using technology. But I have no real basis for that assumption.