Luhnow discusses trade deadline

[juliogotay]

some thing I did not know here. Says they tried to do deals but were rebuffed by the player or the price was too steep. Rangers getting it done, though.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/columnist/bob-nightengale/2016/08/17/astros-deeply-impacted-trade-deadline/88921096/

[Duman]

I had heard him on the Astros podcast (replay of the pregame show) say that Bregman was the one name everyone wanted and they weren't willing to give him up.

[pots]

I had heard him on the Astros podcast (replay of the pregame show) say that Bregman was the one name everyone wanted and they weren't willing to give him up.

I'm sure everyone wanted Gallo as well.

[juliogotay]

I wonder how the conversation goes with Altuve and Springer when negotiating a new contract and Luhnow tells them no no-trade clauses.

[pots]

I find this quote quite telling:

“It’s hard to go from a veteran leader like Feldman to kids who have never been up here,’’ veteran reliever Pat Neshek said, “and find ways to get the team cohesive. We went from two rookies to nine rookies in a couple of weeks. It makes it tough.’’

[Jacksonian]

I find this quote quite telling:

I hope he's not implying that that is the problem.

[jbm]

My browser is having trouble with the link, so I did a google search and came across this:  http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/jeff-gordon/tipsheet-luhnow-s-blunders-stunt-astros-growth/article_db1e2603-687e-5283-b69b-aa0dab75bdca.html

Wow, there is some real hatred to Luhnow out there!

Having nuance and balance is always difficult, but it seems like very few reporters even strive for it anymore, or maybe the public is too fucking lazy to handle a world filled with gray and reporters just give them what they want.

[JimR]

I'm sure everyone wanted Gallo as well.

I definitely think this is wrong.

[JimR]

My browser is having trouble with the link, so I did a google search and came across this:  http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/jeff-gordon/tipsheet-luhnow-s-blunders-stunt-astros-growth/article_db1e2603-687e-5283-b69b-aa0dab75bdca.html

Wow, there is some real hatred to Luhnow out there!

Having nuance and balance is always difficult, but it seems like very few reporters even strive for it anymore, or maybe the public is too fucking lazy to handle a world filled with gray and reporters just give them what they want.

consider the source

[Jacksonian]

My browser is having trouble with the link, so I did a google search and came across this:  http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/jeff-gordon/tipsheet-luhnow-s-blunders-stunt-astros-growth/article_db1e2603-687e-5283-b69b-aa0dab75bdca.html

Wow, there is some real hatred to Luhnow out there!

Having nuance and balance is always difficult, but it seems like very few reporters even strive for it anymore, or maybe the public is too fucking lazy to handle a world filled with gray and reporters just give them what they want.

That is remarkably poorly written.

[BUWebguy]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/columnist/bob-nightengale/2016/08/17/astros-deeply-impacted-trade-deadline/88921096/

This is the first time I've seen this declared so definitively:

While the Astros have been impressed with rookie third baseman Alex Bregman’s defense, Luhnow says that the starting third base job will go to Gurriel, at least through this season, while Bregman would move to left field.

[Knoxbanedoodle]

That is remarkably poorly written.

So was the Nightengale article. Abject hackery.

[homer]

It seems like Luhnow is implying that Lucroy exercised his no trade clause to block a trade to the Astros in the USA Today story, but eight teams were listed on Lucroy's no trade clause, and the Astros weren't one of them. 

https://twitter.com/jcrasnick/status/759057777243271168

I thought he meant that he blocked the trade to the Indians, which in turn sent him to Texas, which ultimately made them better.

[DVauthrin]

I thought he meant that he blocked the trade to the Indians, which in turn sent him to Texas, which ultimately made them better.

Yeah, I just re-read the piece and you are right, which is why I deleted my post. 

[das]

Yeah, I just re-read the piece and you are right, which is why I deleted my post.

I dunno.  This seems pretty clear cut to me:

And instead of landing Lucroy themselves after their trade proposal, he winds up with the Rangers, too.

“So we’ve had two deals not accepted by the player,’’ Luhnow told USA TODAY Sports, “that has directly impacted us the last two trade deadlines.

[BizidyDizidy]

I dunno.  This seems pretty clear cut to me:

And instead of landing Lucroy themselves after their trade proposal, he winds up with the Rangers, too.

“So we’ve had two deals not accepted by the player,’’ Luhnow told USA TODAY Sports, “that has directly impacted us the last two trade deadlines.

I would love to hear if Chuck has any theories on this.

[astrosfan76]

I wonder how the conversation goes with Altuve and Springer when negotiating a new contract and Luhnow tells them no no-trade clauses.

I'm more worried about them ponying up the kind of money to keep both in the first place.  I know they've said that they will spend money, and they have been increasing payroll.  But, we could be looking at $50M/season to sign both.  Altuve's recent statements and jumping over to Boras imply heavily that he will go to free agency and he will be getting paid.  Since he'll only be 29 at that point (he'll turn 30 the following season), he could be looking at an 8-year deal.  Unless the club tears up the last three years of his contract ('17-'19) and offers to pay him market rate, I'm not optimistic that he wears our uniform in 2020, no-trade clause, or not.     

[JimR]

Lucroy himself wrote he wanted to go to Dallas.

[chuck]

I would love to hear if Chuck has any theories on this.

Why two players in a row would reject Houston to go to what is widely considered the worst place to play over the summer? Why high profile players are lining up to reject the Astros? No clue. I'm as stumped as everyone else.

[Knoxbanedoodle]

Why two players in a row would reject Houston to go to what is widely considered the worst place to play over the summer? Why high profile players are lining up to reject the Astros? No clue. I'm as stumped as everyone else.

Not for nothing, but both Lucroy and Hamels put the decision on their wives.

[JimR]

Why two players in a row would reject Houston to go to what is widely considered the worst place to play over the summer? Why high profile players are lining up to reject the Astros? No clue. I'm as stumped as everyone else.

Lucroy was very clear about his reasons for rejecting Cleveland and wanting Dallas.

[Jacksonian]

Why two players in a row would reject Houston to go to what is widely considered the worst place to play over the summer?

I've never heard players say this.

[das]

Not for nothing, but both Lucroy and Hamels put the decision on their wives.

Do people really prefer Dallas over Houston?  Not being from Texas, I really don't know.  Having been to both, I can't imagine a world where I'd choose Dallas over Houston.  Austin, probably.  San Antonio, maybe.  Not Dallas though.

[MusicMan]

Why two players in a row would reject Houston to go to what is widely considered the worst place to play over the summer?

Hyperbolic statements with no basis in fact are for the WTF thread.


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[BizidyDizidy]

Hyperbolic statements with no basis in fact are for the WTF thread.


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Calling Dallas the worst place in the world is not hyperbolic.

[juliogotay]

My browser is having trouble with the link, so I did a google search and came across this:  http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/jeff-gordon/tipsheet-luhnow-s-blunders-stunt-astros-growth/article_db1e2603-687e-5283-b69b-aa0dab75bdca.html

Wow, there is some real hatred to Luhnow out there!

Having nuance and balance is always difficult, but it seems like very few reporters even strive for it anymore, or maybe the public is too fucking lazy to handle a world filled with gray and reporters just give them what they want.

journalism is corrupt these days.

[juliogotay]

I dunno.  This seems pretty clear cut to me:

And instead of landing Lucroy themselves after their trade proposal, he winds up with the Rangers, too.

“So we’ve had two deals not accepted by the player,’’ Luhnow told USA TODAY Sports, “that has directly impacted us the last two trade deadlines.

I never heard the Astros linked to Lucroy except as speculation.  I'm not sure what to believe.

[GreatBagwellsBeard]

Lucroy himself wrote he wanted to go to Dallas.

Beyond that, Cleveland was unwilling to guarantee that he'd be catching long-term.  I'd imagine that Luhnow wasn't going to make a promise that he would, given Castro and Gattis on the roster (and Gattis under contract for a while).

[Duman]

I read the We in the Lunhow quote as We = baseball not We= Astros. 

[chuck]

I'm genuinely looking forward to the mass confusion and general puzzlement when Springer leaves club control and refuses to re-sign with the Astros. There shall be talk of wives, school districts, ranches, who knows what new rationalizations might be invented.

Of course this scenario assumes several things, one is that Crane has not debugged Luhnow right out of the spreadsheet and another is that Springer is still a useful and coveted player and has not fallen off Mount Rasmus.

[pots]

I never heard the Astros linked to Lucroy except as speculation.  I'm not sure what to believe.

Luhnow said after the deadline passed that almost every player that moved the Astros had some level of talks for. 

[JimR]

Do people really prefer Dallas over Houston?  Not being from Texas, I really don't know.  Having been to both, I can't imagine a world where I'd choose Dallas over Houston.  Austin, probably.  San Antonio, maybe.  Not Dallas though.

He did not mention Houston. He said they wanted Dallas.

[JimR]

I'm genuinely looking forward to the mass confusion and general puzzlement when Springer leaves club control and refuses to re-sign with the Astros. There shall be talk of wives, school districts, ranches, who knows what new rationalizations might be invented.

Of course this scenario assumes several things, one is that Crane has not debugged Luhnow right out of the spreadsheet and another is that Springer is still a useful and coveted player and has not fallen off Mount Rasmus.

You do not come anywhere near fair in your obsession about this.

[chuck]

You do not come anywhere near fair in your obsession about this.

There is no such thing as fair. Ask your source what Springer thinks of Luhnow.

[MusicMan]

There is no such thing as fair.

Big Tex disagrees.

[JimR]

There is no such thing as fair. Ask your source what Springer thinks of Luhnow.

I have no source concerning the Astros or Luhnow.

[Mr. Happy]

I'm hesitant to weigh in here, but Luhnow's explanation is plausible, so I accept it. I think that the club was too far away even with a move or two, so we just have soon held on to the prospects.

[MusicMan]

I think that the club was too far away even with a move or two

This past few weeks has shown that we were more than a reanimated Ruth and Gehrig from contention. 


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[JimR]

I'm hesitant to weigh in here, but Luhnow's explanation is plausible, so I accept it. I think that the club was too far away even with a move or two, so we just have soon held on to the prospects.

this

[Nate Colbert]

Heyman milks it some more...

"Astros people say GM Jeff Luhnow wasn’t serious when he was quoted in a story saying one of their big issues was no-trade clauses (i.e. Hamels, who used one to turn them down, and Jonathan Lucroy, who accepted their rival Rangers). Maybe so, but it certainly didn’t come off that way. Anyway, from here it shouldn’t be said at all. Trade vetoes are a negotiated right, and negotiations with hiccups such as the Brady Aiken and Ryan Vogelsong discussions don’t necessarily help if they want to seem player friendly (though Astros people say they are getting better in this regard)."

[Knoxbanedoodle]

I have almost no idea what any of that means.

[Mr. Happy]

Heyman is a fucking troll moron.

[JimR]

I have almost no idea what any of that means.

Nor do I

[MusicMan]

Heyman is a fucking troll moron.

This is the correct answer.


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[Col. Sphinx Drummond]

Heyman is a troll fucking moron.

FIFY

[Bench]

Heyman milks it some more...

"Astros people say GM Jeff Luhnow wasn’t serious when he was quoted in a story saying one of their big issues was no-trade clauses (i.e. Hamels, who used one to turn them down, and Jonathan Lucroy, who accepted their rival Rangers). Maybe so, but it certainly didn’t come off that way. Anyway, from here it shouldn’t be said at all. Trade vetoes are a negotiated right, and negotiations with hiccups such as the Brady Aiken and Ryan Vogelsong discussions don’t necessarily help if they want to seem player friendly (though Astros people say they are getting better in this regard)."

It's interesting that the Aiken issue keeps bringing brought up as a dismal failure when it seems to me in hindsight to be a great success. 

[moriartp]

It's interesting that the Aiken issue keeps bringing brought up as a dismal failure when it seems to me in hindsight to be a great success.

Bregman might have been a Ranger if the Astros had signed Aiken.

[austro]

Bregman might have been a Ranger if the Astros had signed Aiken.

That would have sucked loudly.

[David in Jackson]

It's interesting that the Aiken issue keeps bringing brought up as a dismal failure when it seems to me in hindsight to be a great success.

Agree 100%.  I never understood what was wrong with walking away knowing you would get the #2 pick in next year's draft.  And it looks like they picked the right guy with that #2 pick.

Whether the system needs to be changed (to better protect the drafter or the draftee) is another issue.