Fedor!

[Rebel Jew]

anybody else see this fight on saturday?  the guy is amazing

http://www.mmashare.com/fedor-vs-sylvia-fight-video-affliction-banned-t1782.html

[Taras Bulba]

anybody else see this fight on saturday?  the guy is amazing

http://www.mmashare.com/fedor-vs-sylvia-fight-video-affliction-banned-t1782.html

Maybe it's because I'm an old man now, but I don't find that sport compelling. 

[tophfar]

It's no different than boxing.  Except, these guys can actually fight.

[Taras Bulba]

It's no different than boxing.  Except, these guys can actually fight.

100% bullshit.

[tophfar]

100% bullshit.

No really, what part of two people beating each other up is different than two other people beating each other up?  or is it the grappling you find repugnant?  Is Muy thai "100% different from boxing" and something you dont find compelling?

I can understand those that are ignorant of grappling to not appreciate the subtleties of that type of fight, but then it has also been said that those that don't appreciate the subtleties of baseball are the great unwashed.

Or do you think that boxers are better fighters?  Because, I hate to break it to you, they are exceedingly limited and have consistently lost in mixed martial arts competition. 

There's a reason why Mayweather, despite his grandstanding against the UFC, chose the WWE over fighting in the octagon.

[Taras Bulba]

No really, what part of two people beating each other up is different than two other people beating each other up?  or is it the grappling you find repugnant?  Is Muy thai "100% different from boxing" and something you dont find compelling?

I can understand those that are ignorant of grappling to not appreciate the subtleties of that type of fight, but then it has also been said that those that don't appreciate the subtleties of baseball are the great unwashed.

Or do you think that boxers are better fighters?  Because, I hate to break it to you, they are exceedingly limited and have consistently lost in mixed martial arts competition. 

There's a reason why Mayweather, despite his grandstanding against the UFC, chose the WWE over fighting in the octagon.

How many "mixed martial arts" guys have defeated a boxer in a boxing match?

If you don't see a difference in boxing versus octagon/Texas chain match/no holds barred whatever it's called, then you don't see it.  Enjoy.

[Bench]

How many "mixed martial arts" guys have defeated a boxer in a boxing match?

If you don't see a difference in boxing versus octagon/Texas chain match/no holds barred whatever it's called, then you don't see it.  Enjoy.

They're just completely different sports. I don't understand why one has to exist at the expense of another.

[Taras Bulba]

They're just completely different sports. I don't understand why one has to exist at the expense of another.

They don't.  Grab a brew, sit back and enjoy watching a guy knee his opponent in the head.

[tophfar]

How many "mixed martial arts" guys have defeated a boxer in a boxing match?

Any MMA fighter would have a punchers chance in any boxing match.  See MMA guys have to be able to punch, and defend against a punch.  While a boxer's skills end there, MMA does not.  An MMA fighter could limit his skill set and be able to compete.  A boxer has no ability to expand his skillset to deal with arms, legs, elbows, and the ground.  He chose WWE over backing up his words against the UFC.  That alone should tell you all  you need to know about the state of boxing today.

If you don't see a difference in boxing versus octagon/Texas chain match/no holds barred whatever it's called, then you don't see it.  Enjoy.

No, the difference is that I don't equate MMA to "Texas Chain Match", whatever mythical beast that is, nor to any no holds barred type of fighting, because it simply is neither of those things.  

You still havent answered what you see is the difference?  What do you think about Muy Thai?  San Shou? Or is just Western Boxing that is the only form of fighting that is "acceptable" as an art form, and [not] some form of barbarism?  

Really what separates one person trying to knock someone unconscious from two other people from doing the same?  Until you can sit down and answer that question, you have done nothing more than make up your mind in ignorance, and spout platitudes from the depths of it.

[tophfar]

They don't.  Grab a brew, sit back and enjoy watching a guy knee his opponent in the head.

Because a punch, is much more artistic and humane.

[Bench]

Really what separates one person trying to knock someone unconscious from two other people from doing the same?  Until you can sit down and answer that question, you have done nothing more than make up your mind in ignorance, and spout platitudes from the depths of it.

The rules of the different sports separate the two. Boxing isn't about who is the best "fighter" it's about who is the best "boxer." Likewise, MMA isn't about who is the best puncher or the best grappler, it's about who is the best mixed martial artist. There's no reason to get your knickers up just becuase somebody points out an obvious difference. You seem oddly defensive about this. I haven't seen any disparaging remarks about MMA, merely that it is not the same sport as boxing. And why should it be?

[tophfar]

I haven't seen any disparaging remarks about MMA

If you don't see a difference in boxing versus octagon/Texas chain match/no holds barred whatever it's called,

Is rather disparaging.  The insinuation that boxing is civilized, and MMA is human cock fighting.

MMA is none of those things.

While the rules seperate how they go about beating each other up, the essence of two people beating each other up, still is the same.  It's a test of skills, effort, mental and physical toughness, in both types of fighting. 

But the perception, that one is a legitimate "art", while the other is not, is preposterous.

[Taras Bulba]

Is rather disparaging.  The insinuation that boxing is civilized, and MMA is human cock fighting.

MMA is none of those things.

While the rules seperate how they go about beating each other up, the essence of two people beating each other up, still is the same.  It's a test of skills, effort, mental and physical toughness, in both types of fighting. 

But the perception, that one is a legitimate "art", while the other is not, is preposterous.

I don't "insinuate that boxing is civilized."   I stated that I didn't care to watch whatever Fedor does.  You sure got worked up about it so I hope you don't get me in the claw hold.

[tophfar]

I don't "insinuate that boxing is civilized."   I stated that I didn't care to watch whatever Fedor does.  You sure got worked up about it so I hope you don't get me in the claw hold.

If this were the truth, you wouldnt have said this

"If you don't see a difference in boxing versus octagon/Texas chain match/no holds barred whatever it's called"

You still haven't gotten around to explaining exactly what this "100%" difference is, besides comparing MMA to "Texas Chain Match", and that if I don't see it....then well nothing you didnt explain anything after that either.

I'd still love to hear how two people punching each other in the face is "100%" different that two other people, beating the tar out of each other through other means.

[Taras Bulba]

I didn't say "100% different."  I said "100% bullshit."  If one were to say that there was basically no difference between hockey and soccer because the object of both was to send an object into the opponent's net, I would not say that the sports were "100% different."  I would say that the person making that statement was "100% full of shit" or that's "100% bullshit."

You like throwing around words like "ignorance" as it applies to others, so I'm guessing yours is just a comprehension issue.  Whatever the case, enjoy "MMA" (not Texas Chain Match, or Death Match, or Cage Match--I stand corrected).

[tophfar]

I didn't say "100% different."  I said "100% bullshit."  If one were to say that there was basically no difference between hockey and soccer because the object of both was to send an object into the opponent's net, I would not say that the sports were "100% different."  I would say that the person making that statement was "100% full of shit" or that's "100% bullshit."

false analogy.  you could make a comparison of indoor soccer, as compared to outdoor soccer.  that would be correct. 

to follow your line of logic, one would have to compare boxing/MMA to say fencing.

Also, when the statement that you refuted as being "100% bullshit" states that they are the same, that means you believe they are 100% different.  See how that works.

"They are the same"

+

"100% wrong"
 
=

"They are 100% different"

Since there is no middle ground with "100%".

Your words, Not mine, defined your position.

You like throwing around words like "ignorance" as it applies to others, so I'm guessing yours is just a comprehension issue.  Whatever the case, enjoy "MMA" (not Texas Chain Match, or Death Match, or Cage Match--I stand corrected).

And once again, you make the incorrect statement that an MMA match is equal to being some sort of death match.  Do you have any idea what it takes to be sanctioned to allow legal fights across the united states?  The regulations that you must adhere to are long.  So to continually equate a SANCTIONED sport, to a "Death Match", while not ridiculing ANOTHER SANCTIONED SPORT, is the height of ignorance and stupidity.

And you still have yet to answer the question that I have continually asked.  I would gather that it is because you have no answer.  You are just used to the self-righteous "Death Match" defense.

What exactly do you perceive as the difference between two sports that have one goal, and that is to knock your opponent unconscious?

[BizidyDizidy]

I didn't say "100% different."  I said "100% bullshit."  If one were to say that there was basically no difference between hockey and soccer because the object of both was to send an object into the opponent's net, I would not say that the sports were "100% different."  I would say that the person making that statement was "100% full of shit" or that's "100% bullshit."

You like throwing around words like "ignorance" as it applies to others, so I'm guessing yours is just a comprehension issue.  Whatever the case, enjoy "MMA" (not Texas Chain Match, or Death Match, or Cage Match--I stand corrected).

I'm not a fan of boxing or MMA, but I'd probably watch a Texas Chain Match (whatever the hell that is). Especially if it was you and tophar.

[Taras Bulba]

I'm not a fan of boxing or MMA, but I'd probably watch a Texas Chain Match (whatever the hell that is). Especially if it was you and tophar.

He'd kick my ass.  I have gone to enough boxing classes in the last year to realize that fifty year old men have a short life span in the ring.

[BizidyDizidy]

He'd kick my ass.  I have gone to enough boxing classes in the last year to realize that fifty year old men have a short life span in the ring.

I can't imagine a chain match lasts that long. I grant that I'm a pussy, but I'm pretty sure after I catch one good chain to the head, that's the end.

[tophfar]

I can't imagine a chain match lasts that long. I grant that I'm pussy, but I'm pretty sure after I catch one good chain to the head, that's the end.

Ive been told I have a hard head.  Maybe I have a chance.

[Taras Bulba]

I can't imagine a chain match lasts that long. I grant that I'm a pussy, but I'm pretty sure after I catch one good chain to the head, that's the end.

No, you see in a real chain match, they chain the opponents by one wrist to the other so what you want to do is wrap the center part of the chain around your opponent's neck.  Let me know if you need any pointers on that.  

[BizidyDizidy]

Ive been told I have a hard head.  Maybe I have a chance.

I'm still pissed off at you for disparaging the sweet science of chain twirling.

[BizidyDizidy]

No, you see in a real chain match, they chain the opponents by one wrist to the other so what you want to do is wrap the center part of the chain around your opponent's neck.  Let me know if you need any pointers on that.  

So wait - is each person chained to their own wrists, or is their one chain between the two of them. The latter sounds fairly homoerotic (and yet strangely arousing).

[MRaup]

So wait - is each person chained to their own wrists, or is their one chain between the two of them. The latter sounds fairly homoerotic (and yet strangely arousing).

(insert Stanford joke here)

[MusicMan]

I've never understood boxing's appeal, and that extends to the current MMA craze.

[Rebel Jew]

mma is great, so is boxing.  most mma fighters excel in, and started off in, one area like wrestling, jiu jitsu, kickboxing, muay thai, judo, or boxing, but have become well-versed enough in the rest to at least be competitive.  randy couture is a world-class wrestler, while wladimir klitschko is a world-class boxer, but randy is almost certainly a better boxer than klitschko is a wrestler.  thus, if it was an mma match, klitschko would likely get killed as soon as the match hit the ground.  if klitschko were to train enough in wrestling or jiu jitsu to at least learn how to get up after a takedown, then he would have a chance to knock out couture as kickboxing ace chuck liddell did.

[MusicMan]

Yes, but I couldn't give a shit about which guy can beat up which other guy.

[HudsonHawk]

mma is great, so is boxing.  most mma fighters excel in, and started off in, one area like wrestling, jiu jitsu, kickboxing, muay thai, judo, or boxing, but have become well-versed enough in the rest to at least be competitive.  randy couture is a world-class wrestler, while wladimir klitschko is a world-class boxer, but randy is almost certainly a better boxer than klitschko is a wrestler.  thus, if it was an mma match, klitschko would likely get killed as soon as the match hit the ground.  if klitschko were to train enough in wrestling or jiu jitsu to at least learn how to get up after a takedown, then he would have a chance to knock out couture as kickboxing ace chuck liddell did.

Kickboxing: The Sport of the Future.

[Rebel Jew]

Kickboxing: The Sport of the Future.

http://www.freewebs.com/indianmounds/Dippin%20Dots%20Logo.jpg

[MusicMan]

Kickboxing: The Sport of the Future.

But do they have to sell anything that is made, or make anything to be sold?

[HudsonHawk]

http://www.freewebs.com/indianmounds/Dippin%20Dots%20Logo.jpg

Finally, a movie reference from *my* day that others don't get.

[austro]

Finally, a movie reference from *my* day that others don't get.

That was in a movie? I thought it was an Alkie reference.

[JackAstro]

But do they have to sell anything that is made, or make anything to be sold?

Or process anything that's made or sold? Or repair anything that's processed or made? Because I don't want to do that.

[Duke]

Clearly the guys doing the MMA are smart folks.

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/jackson-arrested-on-a-rampage-13689

What this article didn't say was the Jackson's truck had his name and picture painted on the driver and passenger doors of his cammo'd 4X4.

[Rebel Jew]

Clearly the guys doing the MMA are smart folks.

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/jackson-arrested-on-a-rampage-13689

What this article didn't say was the Jackson's truck had his name and picture painted on the driver and passenger doors of his cammo'd 4X4.

most mma fighters, particularly the american and japanese ones, have university degrees.  most fighters i've known seem to be kind-of nerds, if anything.

this is a picture of jackson's truck, which to me is the only funny thing about this story:

http://www.mmapunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/quinton-rampage-truck.jpg

all accounts show this episode be a result of mental illness, and the cops supposedly took him straight to a hospital after the incident, where he still remains.

[tophfar]

Clearly the guys doing the MMA are smart folks.

Because Mike Tyson is a pillar of the community?

There are idiots, and/or people with problems, in every walk of life, why this had to be broad brushed is beyond me.

[Ty in Tampa]

This is my favorite thread.

[Lurch]

This is my favorite thread.

Boobs short of masterpiece.

[JackAstro]

This is my favorite thread.

You're a pillar of this community.

[Limey]

Boobs short of masterpiece.

FIFY

[Rebel Jew]

here's fedor fighting the gheorge muresan of mma, hong man choi, last december:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3QzX1ZadJM

fedor annihilating some japanese guy (link fixed):
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6440665513263579607&q=fedor&ei=to2HSO6GBJOKrgO3-fm4CA&hl=en

here he is a few years back getting dropped on his head by the dennis rodman of mma, kevin randleman, then breaking randleman's arm 30 seconds later:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1499390000238023472

[Lurch]

FIFY

Someone give this thread a number so we can retire it.

[MusicMan]

here he is a few years back getting dropped on his head by the dennis rodman of mma, kevin randleman, then breaking randleman's arm 30 seconds later:

Well, now I'm convinced that this is a worthwhile endavour.

[Rebel Jew]

Well, now I'm convinced that this is a worthwhile endavour.

it's a fight sport, MM.  if you can't take it then go back to playing tiddly winks with your grandmother's tits.

[JackAstro]

it's a fight sport, MM.  if you can't take it then go back to playing tiddly winks with your grandmother's tits.

MMA... enjoy it, or you're a pussy. Great sales pitch.

[Rebel Jew]

MMA... enjoy it, or you're a pussy. Great sales pitch.

it's a fight sport.  the point is for two guys to try to beat each other up.  the skill level may be sophisticated, but the ultimate goal underlying it all is quite primitive.  if you don't like to watch people fight, then that's fine and it doesn't make you anything in my book, but to find fault with a fight sport because there's fighting is like finding fault with a gentleman's club because they have girls with no clothes on.

ETA:  and i know that MM made it clear in previous posts that fighting is not his cup of tea

[JackAstro]

That's fine, I'm just saying that these two statements aren't exactly equivalent:

if you can't take it then go back to playing tiddly winks with your grandmother's tits.

if you don't like to watch people fight, then that's fine and it doesn't make you anything in my book

[Lurch]

The evolution of how the UFC->MMA has been marketed has to be considered in the conversation about who enjoys the sport or not.  In the early 90s they were very brazen in being no holds barred, glove-less, rule-less blood matches.  They were clearly aimed at the Faces of Death crowds and seemingly had little desire to be anything but PPV material.  The current state of the sport with (gasp!) rules and governance is significantly more watchable for me, at least.  I admire their clear athleticism and (interestingly enough) the obvious respect they have for each other, at least in the matches Ive seen.  That so many still dismiss them as nothing more than car accident rubbernecking, though, is not at all surprising.  They did that to themselves.

[Rebel Jew]

That's fine, I'm just saying that these two statements aren't exactly equivalent:

sarcasm mahoney, sarcasm.

[JackAstro]

sarcasm mahoney, sarcasm.

I'll be in the shop, getting my meter tuned.

(that's not a euphemism)

[JaneDoe]

I'll be in the shop, getting my meter tuned.

(that's not a euphemism)

This time.

[Rebel Jew]

anybody see the fight last night?  fedor versus brett "the grim" rogers on cbs!!!  awesome fight:

http://www.mmator.com/fedor-emelianenko-vs-brett-rogers---fight-video-strikeforce-t10776.html

[Col. Sphinx Drummond]

The way he goes from his pre-fight demeanor (an almost apologetic child-like innocence) to savage brute and back, is quite impressive. Wish I could seem him and Lesnar get it on.

[Rebel Jew]

The way he goes from his pre-fight demeanor (an almost apologetic child-like innocence) to savage brute and back, is quite impressive. Wish I could seem him and Lesnar get it on.

this is my all-time favorite pre-fight staredown.  it's fedor's less talented but still pretty good younger brother aleksander fighting brit james thompson in japan five or six years ago:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3ihk_aleksanderemelianenkovsjamesthompso_extreme

[strosrays]

This is my favorite thread.

I think the "Do you have to have a front license plate in Texas?" thread is still the leader by a few furlongs, but this argument here, which I'd forgot about, dammit, approaches being one of the most pointless I've ever seen on this site.  And that is saying something.  It's saying a lot, actually.

The Energy and Emotion Expended over Size, Heft, and Importance of Topic ratio (EEE/SHIT) here is 250, one of the highest I've ever seen.

[Col. Sphinx Drummond]

I learned the bar height of ignorance and stupidity is lower than expected.

[chuck]

I learned the bar height of ignorance and stupidity is lower than expected.

Usually you can send in your hurdler rather than your high jumper.

Every fucking time I see the title of this thread I think someone wants to talk about the Brothers Karamazov but instead people are talking about the idiots.

[strosrays]

Usually you can send in your hurdler rather than your high jumper.

Every fucking time I see the title of this thread I think someone wants to talk about the Brothers Karamazov but instead people are talking about the idiots.

Actually, a discussion here regarding the relative merits of Dostoyevsky (vs. Gogol or perhaps Pushkin) might be even more pointless than MMF vs. boxing.

[VirtualBob]

Actually, a discussion here regarding the relative merits of Dostoyevsky (vs. Gogol or perhaps Pushkin) might be even more pointless than MMF vs. boxing.

Lermentov ... A Hero for Our Times.

[HudsonHawk]

Actually, a discussion here regarding the relative merits of Dostoyevsky (vs. Gogol or perhaps Pushkin) might be even more pointless than MMF vs. boxing.

Dostoevsky's pre-fight staredown sucks.  When it comes to glaring down the opposistion, Dostoevsky makes Chekhov look like Tolstoy.

[chuck]

Dostoevsky's pre-fight staredown sucks.  When it comes to glaring down the opposistion, Dostoevsky makes Chekhov look like Tolstoy.

You know Dostoevsky faced a firing squad without blinking. I'm pretty sure his pre-fight staredown would be about as contemptuous and chilling as they come.

[HudsonHawk]

You know Dostoevsky faced a firing squad without blinking. I'm pretty sure his pre-fight staredown would be about as contemptuous and chilling as they come.

You're taking this way too seriously.

[chuck]

You're taking this way too seriously.

I thought that was my role around here.

[strosrays]

I thought that was my role around here.

No, that's my role.

Your role is to go forth, and prosper.

[chuck]

No, that's my role.

Your role is to go forth, and prosper.

Oh, I'll go forth all right. I'll let you know how the prosper bit works out.

[Rebel Jew]

so it had to happen some time, and last night it did.  fedor loses for the first time to brazilian jiu-jitsu world champion fabricio werdum, tapping out to a combo triangle choke/armbar in just 79 seconds.  and i was there to see it happen:

http://www.cagepotato.com/fedor-emelianenko-vs-fabricio-werdum-video

here's what fedor said after the fight:

The one who doesn't fall doesn't stand up. It happens that I was made kind of an idol. Everybody loses. That happens. I'm a normal human being, as are all of us. If it is God's will, the next fight I'll win... No pressure at all. There is some relief because tomorrow I will go back home.