Low Minors Playing Guinea Pig Again This Season

[Mr. Happy]

The owners act as if they're serious about shortening the length of games.

Sound off on these tinkerings. I don't see a snowball's chance of seeing them at the Big League level any time soon.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080228&content_id=2395008&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

[Limey]

Restricting the mound visits is not a big deal for me.  Many sports limit the number of time outs allowed, and some don't have any at all.  But what is this thing about the time allowed for the pitcher to pitch.  How can a pitcher make a decision on what pitch he wants to throw until the hitter has set up?

[BUWebguy]

Additionally, no more than one infielder at a time is permitted to visit the mound, including during any visit by a manager or coach.

This one's interesting. So the team can't huddle to talk about how to defend a bunt or double-steal situation?

[Mr. Happy]

Restricting the mound visits is not a big deal for me.  Many sports limit the number of time outs allowed, and some don't have any at all.  But what is this thing about the time allowed for the pitcher to pitch.  How can a pitcher make a decision on what pitch he wants to throw until the hitter has set up?

I categorically reject the premise that the owners want to shorten the game for several reasons. First, and probably foremost, the longer that games last, the more commerical time can be sold and the more concessions and memorabilia will be sold at the ball park. Second, their on-the-field folks will object to the changes as being anti-competitive and anti-strategy.

I love long games. I say a silent prayer at the beginning of every game for extra innings, i.e, free baseball. I also reject the notion that the fans really are clamoring for shorter games.

[Limey]

This one's interesting. So the team can't huddle to talk about how to defend a bunt or double-steal situation?

It's to help speed up the game.  So only one infielder comes in, then he has to visit with all the other infielders to tell them what play is on.  See?  Much quicker.

[VirtualBob]

It's to help speed up the game.  So only one infielder comes in, then he has to visit with all the other infielders to tell them what play is on.  See?  Much quicker.

Or maybe they each come in, but one at a time?

[Duman]

This one's interesting. So the team can't huddle to talk about how to defend a bunt or double-steal situation?

I can't wait for the first manager to try to have the Infield gather at 1st or 3rd instead of on the mound. 

[Limey]

I can't wait for the first manager to try to have the Infield gather at 1st or 3rd instead of on the mound. 

La Russa.  I'd put money on it.

[Duman]

I categorically reject the premise that the owners want to shorten the game for several reasons. First, and probably foremost, the longer that games last, the more commerical time can be sold and the more concessions and memorabilia will be sold at the ball park. Second, their on-the-field folks will object to the changes as being anti-competitive and anti-strategy.

I love long games. I say a silent prayer at the beginning of every game for extra innings, i.e, free baseball. I also reject the notion that the fans really are clamoring for shorter games.

I agree with you for the most part.  However, shorter games might actually raise the cost of ads because there would be fewer of them. 

However, the length of games always come up in surveys as to why people don't like baseball as opposed to other sports.  I don't thing they are trying to change it as much as give the impression they are trying to change it so people will quit putting it on surveys.

[Amy]

However, the length of games always come up in surveys as to why people don't like baseball as opposed to other sports.  I don't thing they are trying to change it as much as give the impression they are trying to change it so people will quit putting it on surveys.

But is it really the length of the game that people object to, or is it more the pace of the game?  And I still think that for the most part the people who harbor these objections are people who get bored during the lapses in action because they don't understand what's going on.  Same goes for a lot of people who say they don't like baseball because it's boring.  Football has a lot of breaks in the action but I don't recall hearing that the NFL powers that be are desperate to keep things moving.  I think MLB would do better to try to educate their audience about the game.  Hiring TV and radio commentators who know what the fuck they're talking about would be a good first step.

[VirtualBob]

I think MLB would do better to try to educate their audience about the game.  Hiring TV and radio commentators who know what the fuck they're talking about would be a good first step.

Agreed.  But don't hold your breath.

[Duman]

The minors do a nice job of filling in those breaks with promotions and music.  Some major league teams are trying to do this as well. I know the Marlins have gone to cheerleaders and are now taking this ill advised move

[Limey]

I know the Marlins have gone to cheerleaders and are now taking this ill advised move

Oh, the humanatee!

[homer]

Oh, the humanatee!

Oh, the huge manatee! is more appropriate.

[JackAstro]

...the longer that games last, the more commerical time can be sold...

However, shorter games might actually raise the cost of ads because there would be fewer of them. 

I'm not sure I follow. Commercials happen between halves of the inning and during pitching changes, pretty much. How will changes to mound visits and time to deliver a pitch affect the commercial breaks?

[Duman]

I'm not sure I follow. Commercials happen between halves of the inning and during pitching changes, pretty much. How will changes to mound visits and time to deliver a pitch affect the commercial breaks?

how dare you bring logic into this!  Of course you bring up a great point and I now retract my statement.

[David in Jackson]

The owners act as if they're serious about shortening the length of games.

Sound off on these tinkerings. I don't see a snowball's chance of seeing them at the Big League level any time soon.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080228&content_id=2395008&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

I think MLB needs to take steps to reduce the time it takes to play a 9-inning game.  The biggest cause they won't touch: advertising.  Time limitations (on batters stepping into the box or ptichers throwing a pitch) won't work.  I support limiting visits to the mound (how about 1 per inning for a manager) and would be open to other suggestions

[JimR]

I think MLB needs to take steps to reduce the time it takes to play a 9-inning game. 

why? do you get bored?

[Froback]

I think MLB needs to take steps to reduce the time it takes to play a 9-inning game. 

Not meaning to target you David, but...

I think people who feel that Baseball games need to be "sped up" typically fall into two categories:

1) Those who don't like baseball anyway.  These people, assuming they are even sports fans, want high paced action.  They are like most people in society who want more in less time types.  The instant gratification of our society has bred tons of these.  "I want my entertainment in small, fast-paced bites, that I can consume and move on, of if I really like it, consume a bunch in a short period of time".

2) Those who don't understand or appreciate baseball.  Baseball has so much to it.  It is almost a way of life.  It grows with you, as you spend more and more time with it.  A fan will begin to learn more about each part of the game, and see new things in the game.  Those who don't understand baseball fail to appreciate the relaxing nature of sitting there and watching a game and not feel constantly rushed.  They miss the beauty of how each player plays a important role in each play (or could, and thus have to be ready to).  There is so much subtly to the game that is lost because it isn't always fast-paced, in your face type action.  Baseball allows you the chance to share the experience with a child and teach them about the game as it unfolds.  In other sports it moves to fast for you to be able to get the child's attention and point out something before it is over and there is nothing more to see.

Baseball is truly hard to explain to someone who doesn't spend the time to learn to love it.

I think baseball needs focus on who does watch baseball and learn how to appreciate them more, because baseball is truly the one sport that is handed down from generation to generation.  Make it easier for those who love it, to love it, and they will be able to pass it down that much more, because that kind of passion for things is contagious.  And should be cultivated, not ignored.

[Arky Vaughan]

I think you can love baseball and still find it annoying when the batter steps out of the box half a dozen times to readjust his batting gloves, causing the pitcher to step off the rubber and go through his whole routine with the rosin bag. Or watching LaGenius wait until the last second to make a trip to the mound and then wait 10 minutes for the third reliever of the inning who happens to specialize in pitching to left-handed hitters with flyball tendencies to come in from the bullpen, throw his warm-up pitches and finally get the game moving again.

[JimR]

I think you can love baseball and still find it annoying when the batter steps out of the box half a dozen times to readjust his batting gloves, causing the pitcher to step off the rubber and go through his whole routine with the rosin bag. Or watching LaGenius wait until the last second to make a trip to the mound and then wait 10 minutes for the third reliever of the inning who happens to specialize in pitching to left-handed hitters with flyball tendencies to come in from the bullpen, throw his warm-up pitches and finally get the game moving again.

nope. where else do you have to be?

[Mr. Happy]

I'm not sure I follow. Commercials happen between halves of the inning and during pitching changes, pretty much. How will changes to mound visits and time to deliver a pitch affect the commercial breaks?

[golf clap]

[David in Jackson]

Not meaning to target you David, but...

I think people who feel that Baseball games need to be "sped up" typically fall into two categories:

1) Those who don't like baseball anyway.  These people, assuming they are even sports fans, want high paced action.  They are like most people in society who want more in less time types.  The instant gratification of our society has bred tons of these.  "I want my entertainment in small, fast-paced bites, that I can consume and move on, of if I really like it, consume a bunch in a short period of time".

2) Those who don't understand or appreciate baseball.  Baseball has so much to it.  It is almost a way of life.  It grows with you, as you spend more and more time with it.  A fan will begin to learn more about each part of the game, and see new things in the game.  Those who don't understand baseball fail to appreciate the relaxing nature of sitting there and watching a game and not feel constantly rushed.  They miss the beauty of how each player plays a important role in each play (or could, and thus have to be ready to).  There is so much subtly to the game that is lost because it isn't always fast-paced, in your face type action.  Baseball allows you the chance to share the experience with a child and teach them about the game as it unfolds.  In other sports it moves to fast for you to be able to get the child's attention and point out something before it is over and there is nothing more to see.

Baseball is truly hard to explain to someone who doesn't spend the time to learn to love it.

I think baseball needs focus on who does watch baseball and learn how to appreciate them more, because baseball is truly the one sport that is handed down from generation to generation.  Make it easier for those who love it, to love it, and they will be able to pass it down that much more, because that kind of passion for things is contagious.  And should be cultivated, not ignored.

The average time of a baseball game is significantly longer than it was 20 years ago and MUCH longer than it was prior to WWII.  World Series games of more than four hours are common.  I'll try to poke around and find examples, but this is true.

I've loved baseball all my life and will always be a baseball fan, but there's no need to have 4-5 hour games.  Much is due to TV and advertising, but I think MLB should explore changes that don't damage the integrity of the game.

[David in Jackson]

One thing I found:

Games lasted 2:52 in 2002.  As recently as 1983, the Elias Sports Bureau reported games averaged 2:36, while games 60 years ago took an incredible 1:58 to complete.

[David in Jackson]

A brief study:

http://www.roadsidephotos.com/baseball/95gamelength.htm

[Amy]

I would've thought the biggest reason for longer games is more offense.  Isn't that what the owners wanted way back when, more offense in general and home runs in particular?  I seem to recall back in the early '90s a lot of general grousing about how the game needed more offense to keep the fans interested.  More runs scored generally means more batters faced, more pitches thrown, more pitching changes and longer games, n'est-ce pas?

[Mr. Happy]

I would've thought the biggest reason for longer games is more offense.  Isn't that what the owners wanted way back when, more offense in general and home runs in particular?  I seem to recall back in the early '90s a lot of general grousing about how the game needed more offense to keep the fans interested.  More runs scored generally means more batters faced, more pitches thrown, more pitching changes and longer games, n'est-ce pas?

With the advent of addition specialization beginning with routine use of the closer as well as the use of pitch counts and set up men, the number of pitching changes has increased exponentially since 1980. Compare the number of complete games back then to the number of complete games now.

[Col. Sphinx Drummond]

I like the fact that, unlike every other major sport, baseball has no time clock. It's part of the wonder. It allows contemplation. I do however, prefer the pace of pitchers who work fast and batters who don't fidget with equipment.

The reason these games last longer is because virtually every game is now on commercial television. Twenty-five years ago this was not the case and even less so 35 years ago. I dislike 99% of all commercials but television exists to captivate consumers so advertisers can sell them products. The price I pay to see a game on television is a more time consuming game.

Sometimes the abundance of commercials makes me weary. There have been more than a few games that I missed a fantastic ending because I dosed off during a commercial break. When I attend a game in person, sometimes I have remind myself the excess time at the end of and between innings and pitching changes is 'cause the game is being televised. 

[strosrays]

I like the fact that, unlike every other major sport, baseball has no time clock. It's part of the wonder. It allows contemplation. I do however, prefer the pace of pitchers who work fast and batters who don't fidget with equipment.

The reason these games last longer is because virtually every game is now on commercial television. Twenty-five years ago this was not the case and even less so 35 years ago. I dislike 99% of all commercials but television exists to captivate consumers so advertisers can sell them products. The price I pay to see a game on television is a more time consuming game.

Sometimes the abundance of commercials makes me weary. There have been more than a few games that I missed a fantastic ending because I dosed off during a commercial break. When I attend a game in person, sometimes I have remind myself the excess time at the end of and between innings and pitching changes is 'cause the game is being televised. 

In a way, I think two different things are being talked about here.  One is the length of the baseball itself, including dawdling pitchers, mound visits, etc.  The other is the amount of time set aside for between innings and other in game commercials to accomodate television.

I'm not real worked up about either one, but wouldn't mind it if the time between innings was reduced.  Also less Jeannie Zelasko and Kevin Kennedy, if at all possible.

[pravata]

In a way, I think two different things are being talked about here.  One is the length of the baseball itself, including dawdling pitchers, mound visits, etc.  The other is the amount of time set aside for between innings and other in game commercials to accomodate television.

I'm not real worked up about either one, but wouldn't mind it if the time between innings was reduced.  Also less Jeannie Zelasko and Kevin Kennedy, if at all possible.

MLB may be talking about the same thing, 3 hour broadcast is a given.  Fewer minutes spent fiddling with pine tar and rosin means more minutes can be spent selling Ford trucks.  I am in anticipation of what fresh hell they've cooked up for us this season.

[Amy]

MLB may be talking about the same thing, 3 hour broadcast is a given.  Fewer minutes spent fiddling with pine tar and rosin means more minutes can be spent selling Ford trucks.  I am in anticipation of what fresh hell they've cooked up for us this season.

Not to mention, I can't wait to see how much more annoying FOX and FSN's on-screen graphics and sound effects will be on my new HDTV and home theater system.  Is FOX still using that stupid Scooter cartoon, or have they come up with something worse?

[Arky Vaughan]

nope. where else do you have to be?

On the Internet arguing with you about whether I'm a real fan, apparently.

[JimR]

On the Internet arguing with you about whether I'm a real fan, apparently.

go jump in the lake, Arky. today. i said nothing about "real fan."