Sign of the Apocalypse?

[austro]

McCarver actually said something useful last night when he pointed out how the catcher proceeded up the line to cover 3rd when the 3B came in to field a sac bunt. The catcher's activity was out of frame, so it's probably not something the casual viewer would have noticed.

[Houston]

Tim must have sniffed an acorn near third base.

[ValpoCory]

Of course Tim McCarver also insulted the intelligence of his entire audience when he went into a 30 second monologue about why a runner leading off 3rd base leads off in foul territory.

[JimR]

McCarver actually said something useful last night when he pointed out how the catcher proceeded up the line to cover 3rd when the 3B came in to field a sac bunt. The catcher's activity was out of frame, so it's probably not something the casual viewer would have noticed.

that's something every good HS team does.

[hostros7]

what was that horrible simile he used last night?....something about "striking like a cobra in a basket." 

[Bill McLuggage]

My vote goes to the 'casual' conversatoin in the Red Sox dugout about how if anyone steals a base then everyone in America gets a free taco from Taco Bell.

Follow up with an interview in the stand with the COO of Taco Bell.

Nothin' spells October baseball in Boston like taco-meat-food-products!

[Fredia]

My vote goes to the 'casual' conversatoin in the Red Sox dugout about how if anyone steals a base then everyone in America gets a free taco from Taco Bell.

Follow up with an interview in the stand with the COO of Taco Bell.

Nothin' spells October baseball in Boston like taco-meat-food-products!

wonder if they got a "bonus" for that conversation.. maybe when they get to the rocks place we will be blessed with so many tacos

[strosrays]

My vote goes to the 'casual' conversatoin in the Red Sox dugout about how if anyone steals a base then everyone in America gets a free taco from Taco Bell.

Follow up with an interview in the stand with the COO of Taco Bell.

Nothin' spells October baseball in Boston like taco-meat-food-products!

Taco Bell.  Leading the league in runs created.™

[S.P. Rodriguez]

Taco Bell.  Leading the league in runs created.™

I'd respond with "Rim shot, please!" but someone is bound to take that the wrong way.

[Outlawscotty]

I'd respond with "Rim shot, please!" but someone is bound to take that the wrong way.

and I'd respond with '"That ain't no shit!", when in reality it's too much.

[Taras Bulba]

and I'd respond with '"That ain't no shit!", when in reality it's too much.

A nice running commentary.

[HudsonHawk]

that's something every good HS team does.

I learned to do that by about age 13. 

[HudsonHawk]

The worst of McCarver last night was when he pointed out the catcher shaking his head at the pitcher and said you could be sure that it meant a fastball was coming.  The pitcher then threw a slider.  McCaver just went on talking about the fastball.  The one that didn't come.

[Limey]

The worst of McCarver last night was when he pointed out the catcher shaking his head at the pitcher and said you could be sure that it meant a fastball was coming.  The pitcher then threw a slider.  McCaver just went on talking about the fastball.  The one that didn't come.

It really would be better to have Scooter.

[austro]

I learned to do that by about age 13. 

I understand that people that have actually played baseball learn to do that early on. But I'd guess that a lot of people watching these games haven't actually played baseball, and this was a rare instance of McCarver possibly helping them to understand that there's actually a lot more going on on the diamond than one might appreciate at first glance.

Having said that, Scooter would probably still come out on top in any objective comparison.

[geezerdonk]

It really would be better to have Scooter.

Who is this Scooter that you refer to? Phil Rizzuto? Even in his current state, Rizzuto would be better? Even if Scooter is your pet worm, it would be better. Beyond tedious, beyond incoherent, beyond terminal tautology; with every succesive game McCarver expands the frontiers of broadcasting incompetence.

[Limey]

Who is this Scooter that you refer to? Phil Rizzuto? Even in his current state, Rizzuto would be better? Even if Scooter is your pet worm, it would be better. Beyond tedious, beyond incoherent, beyond terminal tautology; with every succesive game McCarver expands the frontiers of broadcasting incompetence.

Scooter is a talking baseball.  "I'm a curveball because I cuuuuuuurve!"

[strosrays]

Scooter is a talking baseball.  "I'm a curveball because I cuuuuuuurve!"

A distant relative, I am pretty sure, to Towlie.

[ValpoCory]

McCarver dropped this beauty tonight after a double switch removed Drew instead of Manny:

"Terry Francona removed JD Drew [instead of Manny] since that allowed him to double switch."

[DVauthrin]

McCarver dropped this beauty tonight after a double switch removed Drew instead of Manny:

"Terry Francona removed JD Drew [instead of Manny] since that allowed him to double switch."

Did you miss it when manny was thrown out at home and mccarver was saying the ump delayed the call to see if manny touched home plate?  Except for the trivial fact Buck pointed out which was that torrealba never made any other attempt to tag ramirez other than the dive.   Buck said it was to make sure the ball never squirted out of torrealba's mitt, and McCarver finally acknowledged his idiocy.

[ValpoCory]

Another perplexing one tonight, talking about how Manny Ramirez throws off his helmet while running:

"It certainly doesn't make you faster ... if it did, we'd see marathon runners wearing helmets ... hundred meter dash guys wearing helmets"

My jaw dropped.  What kind of fubar logic is that?

[HurricaneDavid]

"It certainly doesn't make you faster ... if it did, we'd see marathon runners wearing helmets ... hundred meter dash guys wearing helmets"

Between that line and the Boras/ARod announcement in the middle of the game, I have never come closer to throwing a brick through my TV.

[Fredia]

Between that line and the Boras/ARod announcement in the middle of the game, I have never come closer to throwing a brick through my TV.

if you are going to thorw bricks make them good ones. i was listenting to the radio and the scrubbies are mentioned on the arod might do list (bo sox, angels and cubs were on the aforementioned list)

[Holly]

Between that line and the Boras/ARod announcement in the middle of the game, I have never come closer to throwing a brick through my TV.

That was ANNOUNCED during the game? Good grief.

[Ankh]

My jaw dropped.  What kind of fubar logic is that?

It's related to the question of "why slide into first base ever?" - it sliding ever helped, you would see marathon runners sliding into the finish line.

Though there are issues of the infeasibility of sliding on concrete, this argument line is not uncommon.

[HurricaneDavid]

That was ANNOUNCED during the game? Good grief.

Yup... in the middle of the game, Buck says "Let's go down to the field, where Ken Rosenthal has some BIG news."  Silly of me to think that the news would have something to do with the GAME THEY WERE BROADCASTING, like a sudden injury.

ARod couldn't make it to the game to pick up his Hank Aaron award, but Boras still tried to make ARod bigger than the World Series anyway.  What a classless prick.

At one point, I remember hearing that teams were "discouraged" from making big announcements (e.g. managerial changes) until the WS was over.  Apparently no one is concerned about MLB sanctioning those who do.

[ValpoCory]

It's related to the question of "why slide into first base ever?" - it sliding ever helped, you would see marathon runners sliding into the finish line.

Though there are issues of the infeasibility of sliding on concrete, this argument line is not uncommon.

That is ok logic.  I am fine with the comparison of sliding into first base and sprinters.  You can slide to avoid a tag on a wild throw, but not to reach the base more quickly.

But this is a totally different issue.  McCarver made a leap that was not applicable.  The question at the heart of the issue is whether running around the bases while taking time to flip off your helmet is faster or slower than running around the bases while keeping your helmet on.

Marathon runners and sprinters do not wear helmets, so those situations do not apply.

What McCarver said was that sprinters are faster without helmets than with helmets.  No shit.  What does that have to do with anything? 

[JimR]

That is ok logic.  I am fine with the comparison of sliding into first base and sprinters.  You can slide to avoid a tag on a wild throw, but not to reach the base more quickly.

prove it.

[subnuclear]

That is ok logic.  I am fine with the comparison of sliding into first base and sprinters.  You can slide to avoid a tag on a wild throw, but not to reach the base more quickly.

I'm not an expert, but in sprinting don't they just have to break the plane of the finish line?  In baseball, you have to touch the base.   They may be enough of a difference to not be comparable.

[austro]

I'm not an expert, but in sprinting don't they just have to break the plane of the finish line?

You "finish" when your chest breaks the plane.  Head, hands, knees, feet don't count.

[Bill McLuggage]

Doesn't Manny flip it off because it's about 2 sizes too big and will just fall off anyway?

[HudsonHawk]

prove it.

I think it's pretty well established, through multitudes of tests, that you reach a base faster by running through it than you do by sliding.

[JimR]

I think it's pretty well established, through multitudes of tests, that you reach a base faster by running through it than you do by sliding.

then you should be able to prove it easily.

[HudsonHawk]

then you should be able to prove it easily.

I'll bring a stopwatch to the next softball game.

[JimR]

I'll bring a stopwatch to the next softball game.

the TZ game? take a sun dial.

[ybbodeus]

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_sliding_into_a_base_make_you_reach_base_faster

THESE folks think it can get you to first more quickly, anyway, though I'm uncertain who's making the call on their behalf.

[HudsonHawk]

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_sliding_into_a_base_make_you_reach_base_faster

THESE folks think it can get you to first more quickly, anyway, though I'm uncertain who's making the call on their behalf.

Thos people are idiots, and certainly not physicists.  When you stop running, your body does NOT continue on at the same speed, it begins to slow down as soon as you stop accelerating.  Secondly, players dive for ground balls because the ball is on the ground.  It's not enough to simply reach the ball with your feet, you must actually pick it up with your hand if you wish to make a throw. 

[JimR]

Thos people are idiots, and certainly not physicists.  When you stop running, your body does NOT continue on at the same speed, it begins to slow down as soon as you stop accelerating.  Secondly, players dive for ground balls because the ball is on the ground.  It's not enough to simply reach the ball with your feet, you must actually pick it up with your hand if you wish to make a throw. 

right, and curve balls do not curve.

[HurricaneDavid]

Thos people are idiots, and certainly not physicists.

But Jason.kanzler has a Contributor trust: 17... it MUST be true!

[T. J.]

But Jason.kanzler has a Contributor trust: 17... it MUST be true!

And not only "contributor trust 17", he actually IS 17!

2nd from the left, back row

[NeilT]

Thos people are idiots, and certainly not physicists.  When you stop running, your body does NOT continue on at the same speed, it begins to slow down as soon as you stop accelerating.  Secondly, players dive for ground balls because the ball is on the ground.  It's not enough to simply reach the ball with your feet, you must actually pick it up with your hand if you wish to make a throw. 

Apparently, according to Wikipedia, the good folks at the Discovery Channels' Mythbusters have done an episode on the subject, but I couldn't find it on their website.  The Wikipedia entry suggested that Mythbusters determined that sliding is marginally faster, and that the tv show guessed it was because of faster deceleration from sliding.  Of course that wouldn't apply for first base, and like I said, I couldn't find a description of the episode.  Except on Wikipedia.

There was also on the internet a discussion of a comparison done on ESPN, where tape of runners who typically slid into first was timed against tape of the same runners when they didn't slide.  The discussion said that ESPN found sliding faster for those runners, but maybe they were slacking when they didn't slide?

I don't know whether those reports are right or not, but if the difference is infintessimal, it would seem like the greater danger of injury to the runner would argue for not sliding into first.  Not that sliding presents any danger of injury to runners.  Or diving for ground balls.

[subnuclear]

Thos people are idiots, and certainly not physicists.  When you stop running, your body does NOT continue on at the same speed, it begins to slow down as soon as you stop accelerating.  Secondly, players dive for ground balls because the ball is on the ground.  It's not enough to simply reach the ball with your feet, you must actually pick it up with your hand if you wish to make a throw. 

Seeing as they assumed the runner was in a vacuum, I'm convinced they must of have had some physics training.

[NeilT]

Seeing as they assumed the runner was in a vacuum, I'm convinced they must of have had some physics training.

That's funny.

[JimR]

Apparently, according to Wikipedia, the good folks at the Discovery Channels' Mythbusters have done an episode on the subject, but I couldn't find it on their website.  The Wikipedia entry suggested that Mythbusters determined that sliding is marginally faster, and that the tv show guessed it was because of faster deceleration from sliding.  Of course that wouldn't apply for first base, and like I said, I couldn't find a description of the episode.  Except on Wikipedia.

There was also on the internet a discussion of a comparison done on ESPN, where tape of runners who typically slid into first was timed against tape of the same runners when they didn't slide.  The discussion said that ESPN found sliding faster for those runners, but maybe they were slacking when they didn't slide?

I don't know whether those reports are right or not, but if the difference is infintessimal, it would seem like the greater danger of injury to the runner would argue for not sliding into first.  Not that sliding presents any danger of injury to runners.  Or diving for ground balls.

if injury is the issue, never slide any way, anywhere.

[NeilT]

if injury is the issue, never slide any way, anywhere.

Someone should pass that on to Mr. Pence.

[HudsonHawk]

right, and curve balls do not curve.

Of course curve balls curve.  That's why they're call curve balls. 

[HudsonHawk]

Seeing as they assumed the runner was in a vacuum, I'm convinced they must of have had some physics training.

I think they were absent the day they tought physics in physics class.

[T. J.]

Apparently, according to Wikipedia, the good folks at the Discovery Channels' Mythbusters have done an episode on the subject, but I couldn't find it on their website.  The Wikipedia entry suggested that Mythbusters determined that sliding is marginally faster, and that the tv show guessed it was because of faster deceleration from sliding.  Of course that wouldn't apply for first base, and like I said, I couldn't find a description of the episode.  Except on Wikipedia.

There was also on the internet a discussion of a comparison done on ESPN, where tape of runners who typically slid into first was timed against tape of the same runners when they didn't slide.  The discussion said that ESPN found sliding faster for those runners, but maybe they were slacking when they didn't slide?

I don't know whether those reports are right or not, but if the difference is infintessimal, it would seem like the greater danger of injury to the runner would argue for not sliding into first.  Not that sliding presents any danger of injury to runners.  Or diving for ground balls.

The Mythbusters completely screwed up that myth.  They thought the myth was sliding into the base vs decelerating and stopping on the base (like at 2nd or 3rd).  Apparently neither of them had ever watched a game in their life.  I love Mythbusters, but that episode was terrible.

ETA:  Here's the wikipedia page:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters_(season_6)#Episode_83_-_Baseball_Myths

[strosrays]

I think they were absent the day they tought physics in physics class.

Niels Bohr says going in hovering about a quarter inch off the ground is faster than either running through or sliding in.  Less friction that way.  Of course, this method requires one to have ceramic cleats.

[NeilT]

The Mythbusters completely screwed up that myth.  They thought the myth was sliding into the base vs decelerating and stopping on the base (like at 2nd or 3rd).  Apparently neither of them had ever watched a game in their life.  I love Mythbusters, but that episode was terrible.

ETA:  Here's the wikipedia page:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters_(season_6)#Episode_83_-_Baseball_Myths

So did Wikipedia get the results of their tests right?  Sliding was fractions of a second faster?  If that's the case, then I'd infer that not decelerating would make that difference even smaller (or that not sliding would in fact be faster).  How did they set up the test?

[T. J.]

So did Wikipedia get the results of their tests right?  Sliding was fractions of a second faster?  If that's the case, then I'd infer that not decelerating would make that difference even smaller (or that not sliding would in fact be faster).  How did they set up the test?

Yes, but like I said, they weren't testing sliding vs running through the base.  They tested sliding vs running to the base.  I don't think there's any question that sliding is faster in that situation.  Also, even if it was a question as to whether or not this was true, they didn't use athletes to test this "myth", they used the people from the show who had to learn to slide.