Bob Watson

[BatGirl]

wants the gm job?
footer says he's interviewing next week -

http://houston.astros.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070905&content_id=2191584&vkey=news_hou&fext=.jsp&c_id=hou

[Waldo]

February 1, 2007 - MLB.com

"I like what I do now. I think I'm in the right place at the right time."

Of course, that was in response to whether or not he would want to be commish.  But why would he give up that job to be the GM in Houston?

How good of a GM was he for the Astros?

[juliogotay]

February 1, 2007 - MLB.com

Of course, that was in response to whether or not he would want to be commish.  But why would he give up that job to be the GM in Houston?

How good of a GM was he for the Astros?

I always considered his GMship a bit undistinguished in Houston. Solid BB guy...won a WS with Yankees but that's a different class they play in.

[Froback]

I always considered his GMship a bit undistinguished in Houston. Solid BB guy...won a WS with Yankees but that's a different class they play in.

I agree that is true today, but was it still true when he did it?  I don't know, just asking.

Heck, I don't even recall when he was GM of the Yanks, was it their recent WS championships?  Seems like he has been an MLB exec for longer than that... but maybe not.

[Zac D]

I agree that is true today, but was it still true when he did it?  I don't know, just asking.

Heck, I don't even recall when he was GM of the Yanks, was it their recent WS championships?  Seems like he has been an MLB exec for longer than that... but maybe not.

'Twas for '96, when they played the Braves and I was rooting for them and didn't feel dirty.

Long, long ago.

[ybbodeus]

I was somewhat surprised to see that name, only from the standpoint of figuring he has moved on.org from desiring that kind of work.  Have to think he sought HOUSTON out....but that's just a swag.

[Noe]

How good of a GM was he for the Astros?

Bob Watson, when with the Houston Astros (and then later), had/has a reputation as a good evaluator of young talent.  Houston was going to go with young guys for a good long while, so Watson was key with his ability to spot talent and draft well.  His weakness is his somewhat stubborn streak and sometimes combative nature.  His most famous fight was with, ironically enough, his #1 draft choice Phil Nevin.  Nevin was full of himself and wanted to be brought along faster than anyone else thought he should be.  He also cause many a riff in the organization.  Watson read him the riot act, but Nevin bascially ignored him and said "so what".  So Bob Watson got rid of him, and Nevin almost lost his entire career because of it.  Nevin bounced around a bit until he reached San Diego and he finally grew up and realized he was to blame for his own career failings.

Later in his career, well after his job with the Yankees and with the Astros, Bob Watson was assigned the job by the MLB of putting together the young Olympic team.  Watson scoured the minor leagues for talent and put together what would eventually be the Olympic team that won a gold medal over Cuba.  Ben Sheets, Roy Oswalt, Adam Everett, Jon Rauch, Brad Wilkerson, Doug Mankebunchalphabets, Kurt Ainsworth and Brent Abernathy were just a few of the key minor leaguers that Watson put together as a team to go play in Sydney.  It is said that Watson came to see Adam Evertt play one day and while there scouting him, he heard of the kid named Roy Oswalt.  So he asked permission to come see the kid pitch in AA if Houston didn't mind.  He loved what he saw and invited him to join the team.

Watson knows young talent, is good at drafting players but no one really knows if his stubborn, somewhat stern ways works with veterans or not.  Young guys may listen to "Mr. Watson" and fear him a bit.  Veterans may just ignore him.  So if the team is going to be mostly about getting the most out of young talent, Watson is a good choice.  If it's a veteran free agent you want to sign up, it may be harder with Watson at the helm.

BTW - this would be Watson's second stint of being a GM under Drayton McLane.  McLane was responsible for firing his first GM, Bill Wood, because he convinced the neo owner of the Astros that he should make a splash in the free agent market and sign Doug Drabek and Greg Swindell.  When neither panned out, Wood was fired.  It was Watson, then the assistant to Wood who got promoted to continue the work with the young club that was going to try and jettison many veteran guys to allow the youngsters a chance to play.  BTW - it was Bob Watson who pulled the trigger on the Caminiti to San Diego for Derek Bell trade.  He is a no nonsense guy.

[Waldo]

Watson knows young talent, is good at drafting players but no one really knows if his stubborn, somewhat stern ways works with veterans or not.

What exactly do you mean by "works with veterans"?  Does that mean that the concern would be that he would have trouble attracting them to the Astros, or that he could scare away the ones already here?

The article I linked says that Watson is going to put together the 2008 Olympic team, and has been put in charge of the 2009 WBC.  MLB obviously thinks highly of him.  Just seems that moving to the GM job in Houston wouldn't even be a lateral move at best.

[Froback]

Wow, thanks Noe, that is a great breakdown of him as a GM.

From what you describe, I would love him as GM.  Although I am not sure Drayton would... seems like Bob, might actually call Drayton out on certain items which might lead to him being fired.

[mihoba]

Just seems that moving to the GM job in Houston wouldn't even be a lateral move at best.

My thoughts exactly. Why would MLB's discipline czar want to return to his former job?

[kevwun]

He sounds perfect.  Knows talent and won't let Uncle Drayton and everyone's favorite president of business operations walk all over him.  Of course, that might disqualify him from getting the job in the first place.

[Noe]

What exactly do you mean by "works with veterans"?  Does that mean that the concern would be that he would have trouble attracting them to the Astros, or that he could scare away the ones already here?

Both actually, although I'm sure some veterans would welcome a stern hand running a ship.  Purpura mentioned in his interview with Justice that he knew that he had to have a professional relationship with the players, but at the same time it does get a bit personal because they're together like family for a long time.  Not that he placated veterans or anything, not at all.  But he did tend to have sit down talks with them as man to man professional approach.  Watson may not tend to do that as much.

Some veterans will like it, some won't.

The article I linked says that Watson is going to put together the 2008 Olympic team, and has been put in charge of the 2009 WBC.  MLB obviously thinks highly of him.  Just seems that moving to the GM job in Houston wouldn't even be a lateral move at best.

I was only teasing when I tossed his name out there waaaay back when, namely because if Houston had a black GM, black Asst. GM and a black manager, that would be a unique and refreshing situation.  All three men that are candidates for those jobs have merit beyond the color of their skin too, so it's not about satisfying a quota (IMHO).  Watson, Bennett and Cooper would make a fine team and run this team well.  Houston has to now demand a lot from young players because the era of Bagwell and Biggio is gone.  No player has stepped up to take their place to instill a purpose, a discipline and a veteran presence on this team.  The closes they get is with Adam Everett, but he's not looked at by players as a star player, so it only goes so far.

Watson is no nonsense and a good judge of talent.  Cooper is well respected for his even handed approach, giving veterans no leeway just because they're veterans.  Bennett could fall right in line with them and run the minor leagues in a similar fashion.  So I see a trend that the Astros might like and it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility (IMHO again).  So why would Watson do it?  Because he may see it as a challenge he'd like to tackle.  He may also think he owes it to the organization that took him from hitting instructor (Oakland A's) and elevated him into front office status.

[Noe]

He sounds perfect.  Knows talent and won't let Uncle Drayton and everyone's favorite president of business operations walk all over him.  Of course, that might disqualify him from getting the job in the first place.

I'm not sure that would change and Watson already went one go-round with Drayton before, so he probably knows what to expect.  With Gardner?  I dunno, that may be something they ask Tal Smith to run interference on from now on.  But the no nonsense is about Watson with players.  He's a very disciplined man and seems to command it from others.  When he got rid of Caminiti, one of the rumors floating around was he did it because of the bad influence Cammy was becoming for the young guys, especially Craig Biggio.  It takes guts to send off a guy like Caminiti simply because his off-field influence.

Goes to show you a bit about Watson.

[OldBlevins]

I agree it took guts to trade Caminiti, Finley et al., but that was also a terrible trade in the end, in my opinion.

[Jacksonian]

What were the circumstances surrounding Watson leaving the Astros GM job?  Was it just to take the Yankee job?  I can't remember.

[SaltyParker]

I'm not sure that would change and Watson already went one go-round with Drayton before, so he probably knows what to expect.  With Gardner?  I dunno, that may be something they ask Tal Smith to run interference on from now on.  But the no nonsense is about Watson with players.  He's a very disciplined man and seems to command it from others.  When he got rid of Caminiti, one of the rumors floating around was he did it because of the bad influence Cammy was becoming for the young guys, especially Craig Biggio.  It takes guts to send off a guy like Caminiti simply because his off-field influence.

Goes to show you a bit about Watson.

Watson was charged by Steinbrenner with the hiring of a new manager when he walked into the Yankee situation.

The Choice?:

Joe Torre

[Noe]

What were the circumstances surrounding Watson leaving the Astros GM job?  Was it just to take the Yankee job?  I can't remember.

Yes.  George Steinbrenner came calling and McLane was foolishly committed to one year contracts for his GM back then.  McLane wanted Watson to build the team from the young guys and get rid of veteran, high cost players because he still had a bad taste in his mouth with Drabek and Swindell.  Watson, as I remember it, obeyed orders from McLane and let Mark Portugal walk away into free agency rather than negotiate a contract with him beyond McLane's threshold (no more than two years was one threshold that was later ammended to three years tops for pitchers).  So Watson, because he had only one year contracts to work with for himself, jumped at the opportunity offered by Steinbrenner.  You could not have a diametrically different situation from owner's budget back then than Steinbrenner and McLane.

[kevwun]

As Watson has already been a gm and a higher up in MLB, wouldn't be much more likely to put his foot down than a first time gm coming from another organization?  My fear is that Drayton will hire an assistant from another organization or from inside the Astros and then proceed to keep doing the same silly things.

[Noe]

As Watson has already been a gm and a higher up in MLB, wouldn't be much more likely to put his foot down than a first time gm coming from another organization?  My fear is that Drayton will hire an assistant from another organization or from inside the Astros and then proceed to keep doing the same silly things.

This may have Tal Smith "working it" all over it.  He's doing his job and trying to do what will work for the baseball side, so this should get interesting.  Smith, ironically, was not here when Watson was here last.

[Waldo]

Watson was charged by Steinbrenner with the hiring of a new manager when he walked into the Yankee situation.

The Choice?:

Joe Torre

Who, depending on the Yankees' record, is the best manager ever or the worst manager ever.  According to Yankee fans, at least.

Sounds like Watson would be a great choice, but it sounds like a pipe dream.

[Noe]

Watson was charged by Steinbrenner with the hiring of a new manager when he walked into the Yankee situation.

The Choice?:

Joe Torre

Only because Bucky Showalter wanted to show up the Boss and refused to sign a new contract to manage the Yanquis until he had knowledge of the GM hire.  The Boss got angry at Showalter's demands, especially that they made the papers, and hired Watson and then ordered him to find a new manager.

Bucky was one year away from winning it all, but his own stubborn nature caused a riff in New York.  He repeated the same thing in Arizona, helping to build a good team into a contender and then getting released one year before they won it all.  Same reasons too.  At least in Texas, Showalter never had a will-win-it-all-next-year team.  He got fired at Texas because his own dictorial nature rubbed all the players the wrong way.

BTW - Watson's manager during his tenure with Houston? 

Terry Collins.

[Noe]

I agree it took guts to trade Caminiti, Finley et al., but that was also a terrible trade in the end, in my opinion.

Jason Jennings bad? 

Watson was under orders to get rid of high cost veterans like Finley and he needed some young guys that were under club control and ready to play in the majors.  Think Ty Wiggington this year for the type of player Watson sought to help shore up the holes that would be evident once he got rid of certain guys.  Ricky Guiterrez, Derek Bell, et. al. seemed to him at the time, good young players he could use.

[Froback]

If Watson truly is interested, then put me in the camp that wants him as the next GM.

His track record and strengths seems to fit this team to a "T".

This is no knock on any of the other candidates, just the fact that his track record gives him the edge, IMO.

[Froback]

Jason Jennings bad? 

Watson was under orders to get rid of high cost veterans like Finley and he needed some young guys that were under club control and ready to play in the majors.  Think Ty Wiggington this year for the type of player Watson sought to help shore up the holes that would be evident once he got rid of certain guys.  Ricky Guiterrez, Derek Bell, et. al. seemed to him at the time, good young players he could use.

Keep in mind his directive from Drayton would be different this time around.  So it would be interesting to see if he would run the club differently now because of that change.

[JimR]

Jason Jennings bad? 

Watson was under orders to get rid of high cost veterans like Finley and he needed some young guys that were under club control and ready to play in the majors.  Think Ty Wiggington this year for the type of player Watson sought to help shore up the holes that would be evident once he got rid of certain guys.  Ricky Guiterrez, Derek Bell, et. al. seemed to him at the time, good young players he could use.

and they were.

[jbm]

This may have Tal Smith "working it" all over it.  He's doing his job and trying to do what will work for the baseball side, so this should get interesting.  Smith, ironically, was not here when Watson was here last.

I'd like to think this was a genius move by Tal to nominate one candidate who stood out in stature (and would thereby put public pressure on Drayton to hire him) and wouldn't be a Drayton lackey, thus getting a qualified man through cunning subterfuge.  However, I suspect it is just dumb luck as Watson is more interested in being a GM than in his present job.  

[JimR]

I'd like to think this was a genius move by Tal to nominate one candidate who stood out in stature (a would thereby put public pressure on Drayton to hire him) and wouldn't be a Drayton lackey, thus getting a qualified man through cunning subterfuge.  However, I suspect it is just dumb luck as Watson is more interested in being a GM than in his present job.  

why is it the perception among some that Tal Smith does not know what he is doing?

[MusicMan]

why is it the perception among some that Tal Smith does not know what he is doing?

Hmmm... how to put this gently...

I guess, Jim, that we would expect you to recognize prejudice against the elderly when you see it.

[JimR]

Hmmm... how to put this gently...

I guess, Jim, that we would expect you to recognize prejudice against the elderly when you see it.

i guess i'll choose not to dignify your statement with a response.

[jbm]

why is it the perception among some that Tal Smith does not know what he is doing?

I didn't mean to imply that at all.  I think very highly of him.  I was just under the impression that Watson contacted the Astros rather than the other way around.  However, maybe Tal knew Bob was interested and set it up to appear he wasn't squeezing his boss. 

[MusicMan]

i guess i'll choose not to dignify your statement with a response.

Just yanking your chain.

It's actually a prejudice against curly white receding perms.

[Houston]

Just yanking your chain.

It's actually a prejudice against curly white receding perms.

As one with a white receding perm, Don Sutton thinks you're one of the haters!

[Noe]

why is it the perception among some that Tal Smith does not know what he is doing?

I dunno, but I think this has all the makings of Tal Smith doing good by the baseball side of things and not necessarily disavowing his boss and co-worker's desires per se.  He's not running against them, he's running alongside without hurting the side he knows best.

[Noe]

I didn't mean to imply that at all.  I think very highly of him.  I was just under the impression that Watson contacted the Astros rather than the other way around.  However, maybe Tal knew Bob was interested and set it up to appear he wasn't squeezing his boss. 

Tal could've said no when Bob called too.  But I suspect Watson called because the bug was put in his ear appropriately.  I have no way of knowing and I've already speculated why Watson would even consider a lateral move like this... but Watson doesn't owe anything to anybody at this point of his career and Smith wasn't with the team when Bob was the GM.

It just may boil down to Bob Watson loves a challenge and Smith is seizing on the opportunity to hand him one.  It fits boths ways, else Smith would've said "don't bother" to the man already.

[L.I. Bill]

Only because Bucky Showalter wanted to show up the Boss and refused to sign a new contract to manage the Yanquis until he had knowledge of the GM hire.  The Boss got angry at Showalter's demands, especially that they made the papers, and hired Watson and then ordered him to find a new manager.

For what it's worth, I don't believe Watson had much say into Torre's hiring.
The GM in Yankee-land isn't (or at least wasn't) like being GM elsewhere as Steinbrenner liked keeping seperate groups of competing - and occasionally feuding - advisors who he'd alternately listen to and/or ignore.  The titular GM in those days not only didn't have final say in such matters but sometimes didn't have any.  Longtime Steinbreener advisor Arthur Richman is credited with being the one who suggested and pushed for Torre.  I don't know what Watson's opinion was on the matter nor whether it was even considered.
Steinbrenner even got cold feet just a few days after hiring Torre and went back to Showalter trying to lure him back.

Watson eventually tired of that arrangement (as well as the abuse the often went along with it) eventually leaving not long after he was over-ruled in the Eric Milton & Christian Guzman for Chuck Knoblauch trade - which would fit into the notion that he believes in hanging on to young talent.

[Noe]

For what it's worth, I don't believe Watson had much say into Torre's hiring.
The GM in Yankee-land isn't (or at least wasn't) like being GM elsewhere as Steinbrenner liked keeping seperate groups of competing - and occasionally feuding - advisors who he'd alternately listen to and/or ignore.  The titular GM in those days not only didn't have final say in such matters but sometimes didn't have any.  Longtime Steinbreener advisor Arthur Richman is credited with being the one who suggested and pushed for Torre.  I don't know what Watson's opinion was on the matter nor whether it was even considered.
Steinbrenner even got cold feet just a few days after hiring Torre and went back to Showalter trying to lure him back.

Watson eventually tired of that arrangement (as well as the abuse the often went along with it) eventually leaving not long after he was over-ruled in the Eric Milton & Christian Guzman for Chuck Knoblauch trade - which would fit into the notion that he believes in hanging on to young talent.

Thanks, great info LIB.  I also think that Gene Michaels had similar problems with Steinbrenner but later found a way to influence The Boss without having to be in the GM position.

[Noe]

FWIW, what Bob Watson is saying publically:

"I have really a real feeling for the Houston Astros," he said. "As you know, and hopefully our readers know, that in 1964 I signed with then the Colt .45s, so I go a way back. I've been with this organization in a number of capacities. And I left to go to New York, and bottom line is I left a job undone. I'd like to culminate my career of some 43 years as we speak with bringing in and putting this club where it needs to be.

"And I think the other reason is I think Drayton McLane deserves to have a championship club. He has worked so hard and tirelessly. He has spent a lot of his money and energy trying to make this a championship city, and I'd like to help him accomplish that."

Last time I heard a man speak like that about this city and the sport organization he loved, it was Rudy Tomjanovich and why he wanted to be the new Rocket's manager.  Something about being sick and tired of watching all those Jordan jerseys at the Malls and no one wanting to wear a Rocket jersey.

Tomjanovich wanted to try and bring a championship here to change all that.  And he did it along with Carrol Dawson.

[Waldo]

Well, that sounds promising.  Where'd you get that from?

[Noe]

Well, that sounds promising.  Where'd you get that from?

Just posted at noon by JdJO in his blog.  Watson is saying all the right things publically.

Read the blog report and the reaction by the confused masses here

JdJO's pointed opinion:

Of all the candidates for the job, Watson is the only one who truly knows what it is to love Houston, to love the Houston Astros and to have literally shed his blood and sweat trying to bring a winning product to Houston fans on the field and in the front office.

This is getting very interesting.

[MusicMan]

Indeed.  Watson would restore a lot of my faith in the organization's direction.

[Froback]

Just posted at noon by JdJO in his blog.  Watson is saying all the right things publically.

Read the blog report and the reaction by the confused masses here

JdJO's pointed opinion:

Of all the candidates for the job, Watson is the only one who truly knows what it is to love Houston, to love the Houston Astros and to have literally shed his blood and sweat trying to bring a winning product to Houston fans on the field and in the front office.

This is getting very interesting.

Of course the current assistant GM for the Astros knows nothing about that too, right?

While I want Watson as the GM, sweeping comments from people like JdJO make me want to hit them with a bat.

[MusicMan]

While I want Watson as the GM, sweeping comments from people like JdJO make me want to hit them with a bat.

Never make excuses for wanting to hit JdJO with a bat.

[pravata]

Just posted at noon by JdJO in his blog.  Watson is saying all the right things publically.

Read the blog report and the reaction by the confused masses here

JdJO's pointed opinion:

Of all the candidates for the job, Watson is the only one who truly knows what it is to love Houston, to love the Houston Astros and to have literally shed his blood and sweat trying to bring a winning product to Houston fans on the field and in the front office.

This is getting very interesting.

Does this jackanape even know what "literally" means?  Pretty insensitive, Mr Emoto, considering the calendar date.

[pravata]

Never make excuses for wanting to hit JdJO with a bat.

If only to teach him what it means to "literally" bleed.

[JGrave]

This particular thread is why I love this site.  Very informative.  Thanks to all who are posting.

[geezerdonk]

I liked Watson as a player - all business.
He had damn few chats with opposing players.

Was Terry Collins his boy or was he foisted on him?

If he becomes GM, does that give anyone in particular a leg up in the field manager sweepstakes?

How is his health?

[Froback]

Does this jackanape even know what "literally" means?  Pretty insensitive, Mr Emoto, considering the calendar date.

Wait a minute.  I am sure Watson bleed from skinned knees or the like as a player, so he did bleed as a player.  And well playing in Houston it is a foregone conclusion that either you sweat or die here.

And as a front office guy, I am sure he has experienced his share of near fatal paper cuts.  Heck his ears might have bled if the questions he was ask as GM were from people like JdJO.

So it is POSSIBLE, that he "literally" bled and sweated for the Astros.  And I am sure he was always trying to bring winning to the city of Houston, because that is the kind of guy he was.

[pravata]

Wait a minute.  I am sure Watson bleed from skinned knees or the like as a player, so he did bleed as a player.  And well playing in Houston it is a foregone conclusion that either you sweat or die here.

And as a front office guy, I am sure he has experienced his share of near fatal paper cuts.  Heck his ears might have bled if the questions he was ask as GM were from people like JdJO.

So it is POSSIBLE, that he "literally" bled and sweated for the Astros.  And I am sure he was always trying to bring winning to the city of Houston, because that is the kind of guy he was.

I still stand by the jackanape part.

[Froback]

I still stand by the jackanape part.

And I still stand by the wanting to beat him with a bat part.

[homer]

I still stand by the jackanape part.

How dows a jackanape compare to a jake?

[pravata]

How dows a jackanape compare to a jake?

The dictionary definition is "one who is like an ape in tricks, airs, or behaviour..."  he's a person who draws attention to himself through his endless buffoonery.  Jakes, they just quit when they don't have an advantage.

[homer]

The dictionary definition is "one who is like an ape in tricks, airs, or behaviour..."  he's a person who draws attention to himself through his endless buffoonery.  Jakes, they just quit when they don't have an advantage.

Yeah, yeah. Definitions. I was thinking more in pravata's spectrum of douchebaggery.

[pravata]

Yeah, yeah. Definitions. I was thinking more in pravata's spectrum of douchebaggery.

Jackanapes are way worse than Jakes, and Jakes are preening ninnies when they can't get their way.  Although that might be an insult to Preening Ninnies.

[pravata]

Just posted at noon by JdJO in his blog.  ..."Watson is the only one who truly knows what it is to love Houston, to love the Houston Astros and to have literally shed his blood and sweat trying to bring a winning product to Houston fans"

Great Moments in Astros GM Blood and Mud (but mostly blood)

Some say Tim Purpura was so afraid of  sheding blood that he would not cut his fingernails or toenails for fear he might get a knick.  His hair was cut with children’s plastic scissors.  It is also rumored that he had no sweat glands. 

Gerry Hunsicker bathed daily in razor blades, his blood was distributed to supplicants crippled by the lack of an Astros World Series ring.

Bill Wood wore suits made entirely of bubble wrap.  Sharp objects were banned from the Astros front office. 

Bob Watson stabbed himself with lawn darts, the blood was funneled through an elaborate system of pipes in the Astrodome and was incorporated into the players’ showers.

Just to be safe, Spec Richardson had his entire blood supply replaced with mice.

Al Rosen was actually a vampire and would extract blood from the Astros players and spit it in the eye of Astros fans as they came through the turnstiles.  It was the very first Astros promotion.  “The first 10,000 fans get Astros' blood spit in their eye by Al Rosen. He hates winning!”   Soon after this, bobble head dolls were invented.