Author Topic: calling anyone with inside info  (Read 8913 times)

JimR

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calling anyone with inside info
« on: July 30, 2007, 04:56:18 pm »
are there any deals still in the works? i'm fresh out of news.
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Andyzipp

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2007, 05:01:56 pm »
Talks are ongoing for Lamb and Loretta.

No interest in Jennings. Seattle was the last hope there.

Qualls is off the market (unless something blows them away...)

JimR

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2007, 05:07:20 pm »
Talks are ongoing for Lamb and Loretta.

No interest in Jennings. Seattle was the last hope there.

Qualls is off the market (unless something blows them away...)

thanks. i was hoping Qualls is still in play.
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WulawHorn

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2007, 05:08:53 pm »
thanks. i was hoping Qualls is still in play.

Idle curiosity- why?


Limey

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2007, 05:11:38 pm »
Idle curiosity- why?



Because he has value and might return something good?  Hogging three of the league's best relievers on one of the league's worst teams doesn't make much sense.
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JimR

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2007, 05:12:51 pm »
Idle curiosity- why?



what Limey said. he has more value than Wheeler, imo.
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WulawHorn

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2007, 05:15:58 pm »
what Limey said. he has more value than Wheeler, imo.

Agreed- but then who pitches the 8th inning next year when I'm guessing the stors will eye themselves as a contender? After the Wheeler trade we is down to two good relievers.

I'm not shedding any tears if Qualls is on the way out- I agree 100% with your assesment re Wheeler and Qualls relative value.


JimR

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2007, 05:18:24 pm »
Agreed- but then who pitches the 8th inning next year when I'm guessing the stors will eye themselves as a contender? After the Wheeler trade we is down to two good relievers.

I'm not shedding any tears if Qualls is on the way out- I agree 100% with your assesment re Wheeler and Qualls relative value.



the 8th inning pitcher is the least of this team's worries.
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2007, 05:20:12 pm »
Amen.

A bigger concern is how to get to the 8th inning.  And how to have a lead to protect.
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Limey

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2007, 05:20:35 pm »
Agreed- but then who pitches the 8th inning next year when I'm guessing the stors will eye themselves as a contender? After the Wheeler trade we is down to two good relievers.

I'm not shedding any tears if Qualls is on the way out- I agree 100% with your assesment re Wheeler and Qualls relative value.



Relievers you can get in the off season.  They stand around near gas stations and wait for GMs to drive by (I wish I could remember who made that wonderful analogy in here).
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Arky Vaughan

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2007, 05:20:52 pm »
Agreed- but then who pitches the 8th inning next year when I'm guessing the stors will eye themselves as a contender? After the Wheeler trade we is down to two good relievers.

I'm not shedding any tears if Qualls is on the way out- I agree 100% with your assesment re Wheeler and Qualls relative value.

Catch the right guy at the right time, and there's your set-up man. There are guys with the stuff, it's just a matter of finding who's got the hot hand.

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2007, 05:22:27 pm »
Catch the right guy at the right time, and there's your set-up man. There are guys with the stuff, it's just a matter of finding who's got the hot hand.

The Astros often like to blood prospects by putting them in the pen, too.
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WulawHorn

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2007, 05:23:54 pm »
the 8th inning pitcher is the least of this team's worries.

sorry if I was vague- I was thinking next year's team and what their worries might be when talking about trading Qualls.

I'm with you in the do it camp though- if you can get a good CF lead off type or a 2nd baseman (or catcher) of the future, and are parting ways with Loretta.


JimR

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #13 on: July 30, 2007, 05:25:53 pm »
sorry if I was vague- I was thinking next year's team and what their worries might be when talking about trading Qualls.


so was i
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WulawHorn

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #14 on: July 30, 2007, 05:31:21 pm »
so was i

If you trade him you got to do some bully work in the offseason then. Not the most daunting challenge ever, but an area you'd have to strengthen internally or through FA.


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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #15 on: July 30, 2007, 05:32:13 pm »
If you trade him you got to do some bully work in the offseason then. Not the most daunting challenge ever, but an area you'd have to strengthen internally or through FA.



There is a hell of a lot of work to be done. 

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #16 on: July 30, 2007, 05:37:28 pm »
There is a hell of a lot of work to be done.

Not at the top of the list, though. I'm more worried about the rotation.

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #17 on: July 30, 2007, 05:38:41 pm »
Not at the top of the list, though. I'm more worried about the rotation.

Yep and CF/or RF, 2nd base, C, etc.

Noe

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #18 on: July 30, 2007, 05:40:06 pm »
If you trade him you got to do some bully work in the offseason then. Not the most daunting challenge ever, but an area you'd have to strengthen internally or through FA.



Well, truth be told, you either go with Pence in CF and roll the dice on Burke for leadoff/2nd baseman all year.  Or you use Qualls to try and get a up and coming (and under club control for many years) CF with leadoff written all over him like Michael Bourn.  That means you have to weigh which is your biggest need and you go from there.

If you (as in legit GM) think that you can still have strength in the bullpen even if you trade Qualls, you're going to persue the trade if it's still viable.  If not, then you look towards alternatives including Pence in CF for next season and Burke at leadoff.  Either way is a decision that needs to be made.

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #19 on: July 30, 2007, 05:56:12 pm »
Well, truth be told, you either go with Pence in CF and roll the dice on Burke for leadoff/2nd baseman all year.  Or you use Qualls to try and get a up and coming (and under club control for many years) CF with leadoff written all over him like Michael Bourn.  That means you have to weigh which is your biggest need and you go from there.

If you (as in legit GM) think that you can still have strength in the bullpen even if you trade Qualls, you're going to persue the trade if it's still viable.  If not, then you look towards alternatives including Pence in CF for next season and Burke at leadoff.  Either way is a decision that needs to be made.

What about Loretta at second? I guess that leaves a hole leading off.

Noe

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #20 on: July 30, 2007, 06:00:36 pm »
What about Loretta at second? I guess that leaves a hole leading off.

You could always be radical and bat Pence leadoff.  I'm serious too and probably waaaaay off on that one!

Pence CF
Loretta 2nd
Berkman 1st
Lee LF
Scott RF
Wiggington 3rd
Munson C
Everett SS
P

hostros7

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #21 on: July 30, 2007, 06:09:53 pm »
If Phils were dangling Bourn I would be tempted to offer up Qualls...if the decision were left to me, which it is not (and if the media is to be believed, the Phils are reluctant).

Bourn CF
Pence RF
Berkman 1B
Lee LF
Wigginton 3B
Burke 2B (if Loretta is resigned the order could be mixed up a bit)
Catcher
Everett SS
Pitcher

Try and go get some late innings relievers via free agency, look internally at guys like Albers and Nieve

Then the offseason becomes (after starting pitching) about RP/C/Burke @ 2B .  Shit that still sounds like a daunting amount of work.

On a side note, hope the Braves moves make the Mets get desperate and overpay for pieces at the deadline in a panic


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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #22 on: July 30, 2007, 06:55:09 pm »

On a side note, hope the Braves moves make the Mets get desperate and overpay for pieces at the deadline in a panic



One less suitor for Loretta, Mets obtained Castillo from the Twins.

ETA:  Padres or bust i guess now
« Last Edit: July 30, 2007, 06:57:35 pm by CarolinaStro »

austro

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #23 on: July 30, 2007, 07:26:06 pm »
I just watched Rowand launch a homer for the Phils, and the announcer (couldn't possibly have been Sutcliffe, who's nearly useless) reminded me that Rowand is a free agent this year. Besides the Astros and the Phils, who else will be in the market for a CF?
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #24 on: July 30, 2007, 07:37:15 pm »
Phillies won't necessarily be if they believe Bourn to be their CF of the future.

I would also add to that list:

Braves
DBacks
Padres
Twins

May be others as well.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2007, 07:39:16 pm by hostros7 »

JimR

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2007, 08:23:21 pm »
If you trade him you got to do some bully work in the offseason then. Not the most daunting challenge ever, but an area you'd have to strengthen internally or through FA.



the bullpen is never a major concern. there are 1000 pitchers who can do that. Lidge, Qualls and Dotel were failed starters with good arms. that is the last thing to be concerned about.
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S.P. Rodriguez

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2007, 09:17:37 pm »
I just watched Rowand launch a homer for the Phils, and the announcer (couldn't possibly have been Sutcliffe, who's nearly useless) reminded me that Rowand is a free agent this year. Besides the Astros and the Phils, who else will be in the market for a CF?

Complementary question:  Which CF will go to FA this year? 

Right now, I'm thinking
Eric Byrnes
Aaron Rowand
Andruw Jones
maybe Torii Hunter
Mike Cameron

As far as I can tell, not a one of them provides everything that Houston is theoretically looking for in a CF, i.e. leadoff hitter and good defense.  Hunter and Cameron are, IMO, the best defensive options and almost identical offensively, with Cameron 2 yrs older at 34/35 compared to Hunter at 32/33. 

If I were going to play dream GM, I'd go after Cameron (less expensive than Hunter) for 2-3 yrs and hope he holds up.  If you can get run production from CF, I'd put Bruntlett at the top of the order, despite his lack of power.

Bruntlett
Pence
Berkman
Lee
Wigginton
Cameron
Everett
Catcher

On the catcher front, I got a wild hair so feel free to ridicule.  Texas needs arms.  I'd package Albers and a bullpen arm (Borkowski/McLemore, not Qualls) for Saltalamacchia, if they can pry him loose.  Okay, if that's too nuts, I'm pretty sure a platoon of Gimenez and Munson is the default option (definitely more realistic) unless something happens with Ausmus, i.e. 1 yr extension.  If so, Gimenez/Ausmus with Munson taking on utility responsibilities vacated by Lamb, who's bound to garner some interest this offseason as an FA.   

Anyway, I don't know how Houston goes thru the offseason only adding pitching.  As far as I can tell CF is a pretty big need right now.  And I like Pence, but he's not a CF. 
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2007, 09:41:08 pm »
Watched the Phillies-Cubs matchup tonight, and Victorino & Bourn left with injuries. Sutcliffe said they may need another outfielder, as they were forced to put Greg Dobbs (3B) out in RF for the rest of the game.

Bourn had an ankle injury, I doubt they will trade him now that Victorino is ailing.
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #28 on: July 30, 2007, 09:50:07 pm »
On the catcher front, I got a wild hair so feel free to ridicule.  Texas needs arms.  I'd package Albers and a bullpen arm (Borkowski/McLemore, not Qualls) for Saltalamacchia, if they can pry him loose.

You're being way too generous. I mean, Texas only gave up Teixeira to get him, so why would the Astros even need to offer Albers? Borkowski by himself should do the trick.

Noe

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #29 on: July 30, 2007, 10:03:47 pm »
Anyway, I don't know how Houston goes thru the offseason only adding pitching.  As far as I can tell CF is a pretty big need right now.  And I like Pence, but he's not a CF. 

Adding a CF is a need (IMHO) and so would adding a catcher, but it doesn't have to be restricted to the free agent market.  Realize that the free agent market is trending upwards and guys like Gary Mathews Jr. got 10 million per year for five years after a career year.  You're talking about players like Andruw or Torii who will point to Sarge Jr.'s contract and laugh that they're being asked to take the same or less.

Free agency is an area that is costly to use to build your team with complimentary players (IMHO).  If you have a core, spent a pretty penny for them, then stay away from the free agent market (IMHO again) for said complimentary players.  Unless you're willing to dump salaries, as Gerry Hunsicker was prone to do when he went into the free agent market to get players.  He was known to jettison a player or two to pay for the new acquisition.

The other method to reload your team is via trades or minor leaguers getting promoted.  But let's talk a little bit about that. Houston would have to be really smart to make trades because you won't get the better type of complimentary player (like a CF that can leadoff) without paying for it somehow.  If it means you have to delve into your minor league system, and you've done this quite often, then you're continuing to gut your minor leagues.  At some point you have to stop that.  You have to realize that it just may be time to give some of these kids a chance to prove themselves rather than thinking of going out and making a lot of trades this offseason with your own prospects in mind.  You have to look at your good players (like Wheeler or Qualls) that you could replace with young players.  If you get back good complimentary players that are in your system for a while, you've done well to stay out of the run away free agent market or overpay with prospects and hurt your minor league system to fill all your complimentary needs.

I say that no one will trade away pitching, so you'll have to look at free agents for this need. *THIS* is where you'll need to save your pennies to spend (and spend wisely as much as you can).  Starters or bullpen, you'll need to use your dollars here.  So how you reload or your strategy for doing so is as important as what you get back.  Because as you've seen with the Jason Jennings trade, things can go bad quite quickly.  Houston stayed out of the free agent market of pitching (Meche, et. al.) because the dollars were high.   Of course they made an offer to Pettitte for one year of service, but that was still 12 million dollars for one year.  So to get what they needed, they went the trade route and it cost them three young players, all major league ready guys.  And because Jennings has struggled, it's now seen as a very bad move.  A stupid move.  So all in all, when you make a trade of a Albers and others for Salty or pitching and they fail, you're back to being criticized for shipping out the prospects and gutting the future.  So Houston can't do that any more, but they can look at certain strategic players like Qualls this offseason if a market exist that can get you back someone that you need with Qualls as the main fodder.  Maybe Luke Scott.  Maybe Chris Burke.  Those are the guys you have to use as fodder to pull back the guys you may need that cost too much in free agent dollars.  Again, like Salty.  If you package Burke and Qualls, then you better be getting back a leadoff guy or be willing to move Pence to leadoff and try to resign Mark Loretta for a reasonable price.  Or use Brooks Conrad on your team as well.

GM Purpura has options on how to make his plays this offseason (and also set up his needs acquires by making trades now with guys like Lamb and Loretta as trading fodder, maybe even Luke Scott).  He can call up guys like Conrad or Anderson to give them some PT to see if they're answers.  All in all, he's got to develop his strategy as much as anything else and I think we're seeing some of that at work now.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2007, 10:07:11 pm by Noe in Austin »

JimR

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #30 on: July 31, 2007, 12:37:03 am »
complementary

fyi--the Phils want Qualls but will not pay Houston's price
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #31 on: July 31, 2007, 12:51:41 am »
the 8th inning pitcher is the least of this team's worries.

But...but...Wheelr for Wigger is the worst trade since Ruth for cash and carry.  My mentor here tells me not to listen to Houston sports radio, at least not until I can learn to interpret these feelings correctly.  However, I swear to you that trade analysis was on the Weather Channel this evening.  Maybe I should thinkg twice before so freely mixing Merlot, key lime pie and vodka......then posting.
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #32 on: July 31, 2007, 12:56:09 am »
complementary

fyi--the Phils want Qualls but will not pay Houston's price
Is Houston's price Bourne straight up for Qualls?

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Re: calling anyone with inside info (Bourn)
« Reply #33 on: July 31, 2007, 01:17:46 am »
Is Houston's price Bourne straight up for Qualls?
Talks between the Astros and the Philadelphia Phillies regarding center fielder Michael Bourn, a Houston native, have ended, a baseball official said. The Phillies appear content to keep Bourn, who sprained an ankle Monday, in case they lose Aaron Rowand to free agency.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/5013178.html

S.P. Rodriguez

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #34 on: July 31, 2007, 06:17:08 am »
You're being way too generous. I mean, Texas only gave up Teixeira to get him, so why would the Astros even need to offer Albers? Borkowski by himself should do the trick.

For the same reason Noe stated.  No one is giving up pitching and unless I missed something, Albers has shown as much or more promise at the major league level than most of Texas pitching prospects.  It's about need.  I'm not trying to pawn off crap for gold.  As a matter of fact, I think Albers is going to be pretty damn good.  He's young with good stuff.  Borkowski or any other middle reliever they put in here fills an immediate bullpen need.  And they didn't give up Texeira for only Saltalamacchia.  They are also getting 2 of Atlanta's top pitching prospects, based on what I read.  That, I suspect is of more interest to Texas than adding more offense to that lineup.  Not to mention, they raved about Laird coming up.  I don't think he's been outstanding but for a young catcher, he's doing fairly well. 
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Re: calling anyone with inside info (Bourn)
« Reply #35 on: July 31, 2007, 09:41:46 am »
Talks between the Astros and the Philadelphia Phillies regarding center fielder Michael Bourn, a Houston native, have ended, a baseball official said. The Phillies appear content to keep Bourn, who sprained an ankle Monday, in case they lose Aaron Rowand to free agency.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/5013178.html

my Phillies source said they want Qualls but have moved on to Seattle looking for setup help. he did not say Bourn but just said they will not give Houston what it wants. the source had the authority to trade Rowand during ST b/c they thought Victorino could handle CF well. now, i guess, Bourn has moved ahead of him in CF.
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #36 on: July 31, 2007, 09:48:37 am »
I'd like to see Rowand signed in the offseason.  He has the hard-nosed attitude that seems to be lacking from this squad, and he seems to know how to run the bases.
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #37 on: July 31, 2007, 11:58:33 am »
fyi--the Phils want Qualls but will not pay Houston's price
they seem to have a definite plan in place and are determined not to deviate from it: solve as many everyday needs as possible as cheaply as possible so they can focus available resources on free agent pitchers this winter. wiggington fits the bill - under contract and brings a power bat to 3B - as does bourn, who, i have to assume, is "Houston's price" - a young (read: club-controlled) CF with a glove and a top of the order stick. those 2 would solve 3 glaring problems on this team.

if you're not offering them what they want, then the astros aren't interested. and i say, "good for them!" it's a sound approach, imo. you have enough money invested in your everyday line-up - it needs "parts;" - the pitching staff, though, needs a chance to be completely overhauled and that is going to cost $$$$.

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #38 on: July 31, 2007, 12:05:53 pm »
they seem to have a definite plan in place and are determined not to deviate from it: solve as many everyday needs as possible as cheaply as possible so they can focus available resources on free agent pitchers this winter. wiggington fits the bill - under contract and brings a power bat to 3B - as does bourn, who, i have to assume, is "Houston's price" - a young (read: club-controlled) CF with a glove and a top of the order stick. those 2 would solve 3 glaring problems on this team.

if you're not offering them what they want, then the astros aren't interested. and i say, "good for them!" it's a sound approach, imo. you have enough money invested in your everyday line-up - it needs "parts;" - the pitching staff, though, needs a chance to be completely overhauled and that is going to cost $$$$.

Hmmm... wish I would've said that!

JimR

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #39 on: July 31, 2007, 12:09:27 pm »
Hmmm... wish I would've said that!

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davek

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #40 on: July 31, 2007, 12:31:20 pm »
Hmmm... wish I would've said that!

I think there's an echo in here...
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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #41 on: July 31, 2007, 12:34:42 pm »
Hmmm... wish I would've said that!

in less words!  (I like your long posts though).

Houston has the ace- check

Intriguing arms at the bottom of the rotation fairly cheap- Check

Intriguing cheap arms in bully- Check

Dominant closer- Looks good- Check

Just need another stud at the top if you think (which I do) that some combination of Williams, Sampson, Wandy, Patton, Backe can handle the back end of the rotation. None of them are making a ton except maybe woody.


HPFRic

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #42 on: July 31, 2007, 01:16:45 pm »
Hmmm... wish I would've said that!

yeah, sorry, noe - i usually peter out on your posts around chapter 4...

Arky Vaughan

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #43 on: July 31, 2007, 03:01:38 pm »
yeah, sorry, noe - i usually peter out on your posts around chapter 4...

There should be a poster named Cliff Noe who condenses his posts into quickly readable format.

chuck

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #44 on: July 31, 2007, 05:18:28 pm »
There should be a poster named Cliff Noe who condenses his posts into quickly readable format.
Excellent.
Y todo lo que sube baja
pregĂșntale a Pedro Navaja

94CougarGrad

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Re: calling anyone with inside info
« Reply #45 on: August 01, 2007, 12:47:07 pm »
There should be a poster named Cliff Noe who condenses his posts into quickly readable format.

Can we pay them with bottles of double bock?
And, by the way, f*** off. --Mr. Happy, with a tip of the cap to JimR
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