Under Purpura's Watch

[Alkie]

The Astros have gone 194-186 (.510).

We made a WS, which I think everyone can agree, with Hunsicker's players (Tim DOES get credit for not fucking it up, for what that's worth.  I mean, he didn't hold a fire sale when he could have). 

The Astros have averaged 4.36 runs a game, while the NL average over the same period was 4.59.

The 2007 Astros average 0.40 runs fewer per game than the NL average and give up 0.27 runs per game more than the average NL team.   

It is now June.  Other than a desperate-but-lucky move to call up Hunter Pence, Tim Purpura has made a total net moves of zero.  He sent down Burke, but then rewarded him with his not-hitting-in-RR with a call back up.  Bravo, Tim.  That was a brilliant use of resources and time.   

If Drayton wants to begin a new search, I'm officially for it.  This means nothing and it has no bearing on the team, and I understand that.  I'm just beyond frustrated with today's "big move."

ETA:  The Astros had a winning percentage of .568 in Hunsicker's last year.  A .549 in Tim's first year.   .506 in his second year.  And .411 so far this year.   

Tim Purpura has not made the Astros better. 

[stubbyc]

In fairness, Purpura couldn't do anything his first offseason. McLane handled the Beltran negotiations and the only other real choice was to either sign a retread OF (Burnitz) or just let guys like Lane, Scott, Taveras, and Burke have a shot. You cannot say that as Assitant GM since 1999 that Purpura had nothing to do with the players who were here.

However, this year's team was a poorly constructed team to begin with. There still is not an adequate backup shortstop on the roster. We have 3 catchers. We have 12 pitchers including 1 isn't used unless the game is so out of hand that you might as well have Lane pitch. Speaking of Lane, why the hell was he on the roster for so long? We now have 3 2b's on the roster with 1 playing 3b and 1 apparently playing RF and SS now. How long can you justify Palmeiro as a lefty contact hitter when his contact consists of popping out on the infield most of the time?

These don't seem to be the same Astros I'm used to seeing. They yanked Lidge out of the closer's role after 2 appearances. They yanked Burke out of CF after 20 games. Ausmus has been replaced by a career .211 hitter for offensive purposes. They have never been this reactionary.

I don't know what the Astros can possibly do. Who's the future catcher? 3b? 2b? RF? What's the rotation looking like next year? Oswalt, ??, ??, Sampson, ??

Trade Lidge, Jennings, and all the expiring contracts at the deadline? Or make another Huff trade and try to piece together the roster again next year.

[Alkie]

Looks like you're as frustrated with the reactionary focus this season as I am.

Agreed that Purpura gets some credit for being Assistant GM from 1999-on.  But I think most of the credit for the success of the team for the last 12 years goes to Gerry Hunsicker who was, by all accounts, an exceptional GM.

[SaltyParker]

Irregardless of how well Jennings does here on out, that trade simply gave too much for someone
poorly scouted and sold to fans as Mr Endurance, also in the last year of a contract. We have lost draft picks on FAs, traded away youth for short term gratification, and done little to replenish farm talent.
A shrewd GM would go some measure to market expendable talent but we are far too short sighted to ever do that. Coming out of ST Jason Lane very well could have possibly had value to someone some where. There was a time when Burke could have been marketed for decent value. We instead chose to
run em down to zero value.

Then there are the moves  that are not made, but that's another story. This guy is very weak.

[Random]

You would hope that every GM would go into their job trying to construct a team that either a) you could hope to build towards winning in the future or b) if your desire is to win now, construct a team that you could expect would give you a good chance to win.  During Purpura's tenure we've been left with teams that are, at best, teams that you HOPE will win.  Granted, they may win (and in some stretched they have), but realistically, we've gone into the past few seasons merely hoping that the right version of Biggio, Lane, Ensberg and Scott shows up.  And in turn, we hope the team is a winning one.

I'm glad that we at least have a teams with the potential to win, as opposed to the crap fest the Pirates field every year, but I'd like to see a GM willing to take a risk.  One that does not rely on mediocre players with no track record.

[SeanBergmanRules]

I don't really have a problem with taking the occasional shot with an Ensberg or a Lane, where odds are he isn't gonna produce, but there is a chance.  What gets me is the signings of guys like Williams and Moehler.  You give up money, and in Williams case a draft pick, for guys who are virtually assured of struggling.  I can forgive one year to Williams, but a two year deal was foolish.  I would much rather see that money spent on Patton/Barthmaier picks where you overpay a young guy to get him to ditch college.  With our free agent activity the past three or four years, we've lost a lot of draft picks, and I feel we're not showing the money to enough high schoolers in order to compensate for that.  I'm just frustrated with losing guys like Drew Stubbs in favor of signing and subsequently releasing whatever washed up reliever we decide to target. 

[Alkie]

I genuinely get the feeling Purpura's biggest fear is being "that guy" who gave up on Morgan Ensberg or Jason Lane too early when they become HoFers with the Dodgers in 4 years.

[legs_of_eggs]

wasnt the Hun pressured out of his job by McLane because he wanted too much control of the team and didnt want biggio back or something? maybe purp doesnt have all the control of this roster as we might think..

[ValpoCory]

Irregardless

Giggle.

[Alkie]

Giggle.

I decided to let it go.

[Random]

wasnt the Hun pressured out of his job by McLane because he wanted too much control of the team and didnt want biggio back or something? maybe purp doesnt have all the control of this roster as we might think..

From what they say, the Hun as a difficult GM to deal with.  He was never above going behind the owner's back. 

Plus, I really don't think it's Drayton with the attachment to Lane and Ensberg.

[legs_of_eggs]

true its probly more purp's attatchment to these guys cause hes fathered them through the farm. just wish he was more creative with his moves and looked outside the organization every once in a while.

[gwat]

Giggle.

hahahahahaa
I was stinking the same tang.

[JimR]

The Astros have gone 194-186 (.510).

We made a WS, which I think everyone can agree, with Hunsicker's players (Tim DOES get credit for not fucking it up, for what that's worth.  I mean, he didn't hold a fire sale when he could have). 

The Astros have averaged 4.36 runs a game, while the NL average over the same period was 4.59.

The 2007 Astros average 0.40 runs fewer per game than the NL average and give up 0.27 runs per game more than the average NL team.   

It is now June.  Other than a desperate-but-lucky move to call up Hunter Pence, Tim Purpura has made a total net moves of zero.  He sent down Burke, but then rewarded him with his not-hitting-in-RR with a call back up.  Bravo, Tim.  That was a brilliant use of resources and time.   

If Drayton wants to begin a new search, I'm officially for it.  This means nothing and it has no bearing on the team, and I understand that.  I'm just beyond frustrated with today's "big move."

ETA:  The Astros had a winning percentage of .568 in Hunsicker's last year.  A .549 in Tim's first year.   .506 in his second year.  And .411 so far this year.   

Tim Purpura has not made the Astros better. 

does this make you feel better to post stuff like this? just Mr. Happy II.

[remy]

I decided to let it go.

Sadly, Webster has had to add the word to their dictionary because of the rampant usage among... well...

Just ask my realator about the nuculur expressos at Starbucks.

[ybbodeus]

Don't forget REALUTY, remy.

BTW, if you still need that toe, I can have it to you by 3 o'clock this afternoon.....with nail polish, if necessary. 

[remy]

No, dude.  She kidnapped herself.

[Jacksonian]

I don't really have a problem with taking the occasional shot with an Ensberg or a Lane, where odds are he isn't gonna produce, but there is a chance.  What gets me is the signings of guys like Williams and Moehler.  You give up money, and in Williams case a draft pick, for guys who are virtually assured of struggling.  I can forgive one year to Williams, but a two year deal was foolish.  I would much rather see that money spent on Patton/Barthmaier picks where you overpay a young guy to get him to ditch college.  With our free agent activity the past three or four years, we've lost a lot of draft picks, and I feel we're not showing the money to enough high schoolers in order to compensate for that.  I'm just frustrated with losing guys like Drew Stubbs in favor of signing and subsequently releasing whatever washed up reliever we decide to target. 

This demonstrates a serious lack of knowledge with respect to the draft.

[Foghorn]

1999--Gallo, Lane, Sampson
2000--Qualls, Bruntlett
2001--Burke, Saarloos, Alberts
2002--McLemore
2003--Hirsch

10 players have reached the majors (may be a few more who had a cup of coffee here or there like Jimerson) in some form from these drafts.

Exhibit A in the case of "its not all Purpura's fault".

[ASTROCREEP]

does this make you feel better to post stuff like this? just Mr. Happy II.

It makes me feel better.

[Jacksonian]

1999--Gallo, Lane, Sampson
2000--Qualls, Bruntlett
2001--Burke, Saarloos, Alberts
2002--McLemore
2003--Hirsch

10 players have reached the majors (may be a few more who had a cup of coffee here or there like Jimerson) in some form from these drafts.

Exhibit A in the case of "its not all Purpura's fault".

This is good.  The actual number to make the majors from 99-03 drafts is 16, not all with the Astros.  99- Gallo, Lane, Sampson though drafted as a shortstop. (The Padres had the Astros first round pick that year in exchange for the Astros signing Caminiti.  They took Gevik Baxter.) 00- Qualls, Bruntlett, Self, and Mike Burns.  01- Burke, Saarloos, Barzilla, Jimerson, Cormier though he didn't sign with the Astros and was drafted in 02 by the Snakes, Houlton, and Albers. 02- McLemore. 2 prospects from that draft remain viable candidates to be major leaguers (Mitch Talbot now with Tampa and Nick Stavinoha who didn't sign and instead went to LSU now is at AA with Stl.) 03- Hirsh. (Barthmaier remains the only prospect with a high ceiling from that draft) (David Aardsma was drafted that year by the Giants with the Astros first pick in exchange for the Astros signing Jeff Kent.)  My 03 draft review this fall should be completely depressing.

Footnote.  The Astros gave up their first round pick in 04 to the Yankees for signing Pettitte.  They took Philip Hughes.

[JimR]

It makes me feel better.

boy, that's a shocker. you're quite a supporter to have.

[ASTROCREEP]

boy, that's a shocker. you're quite a supporter to have.

I'm sure there's more, but for some reason people are afraid to speak their mind on certain subjects.

Why Purpura has so many apologetics is beyond me.

[pravata]

I'm sure there's more, but for some reason people are afraid to speak their mind on certain subjects.

Why Purpura has so many apologetics is beyond me.

Who is apologizing for Purpura?

[Astroholic]

I'm sure there's more, but for some reason people are afraid to speak their mind on certain subjects.

Why Purpura has so many apologetics is beyond me.

I am not speaking for other people, but I usually withhold judgement on a persons ability until that person has a good amount of time to perform their job.  I have been giving Purp that time (not that it matters what I or you think about his performance).  His time is running shorter by the day.

[Noe]

I'm sure there's more, but for some reason people are afraid to speak their mind on certain subjects.

Why Purpura has so many apologetics is beyond me.

Specifics.  What apologies have been given for Purpura?

[JimR]

I'm sure there's more, but for some reason people are afraid to speak their mind on certain subjects.

Why Purpura has so many apologetics is beyond me.

if you ever agreed with something i said, i'd change my opinion immediately. others can make their own decisions about your support.

[Froback]

I'm sure there's more, but for some reason people are afraid to speak their mind on certain subjects.

Why Purpura has so many apologetics is beyond me.

I am not a fan or hater of Purp... or better put I have not seen anything to indicate either way on him to be honest... if you do nothing, ever... then you are not very good, and he is approaching that level.

I am also not a big fan of the Hun either... I thought he made some good and some bad choices and the more I have heard about the inner workings of the org while he was here, some of what people praise him for is the work of other people.  He was an ok GM, but nothing that special, IMO.

Now if you want a good GM that nobody really talks about look at Bob Melvin in Mil (and formerly of Tex).  I think he was what you want in a GM, as far as deal making and such goes.  I am not sure his track record for minor league development, but then often times this is a delegated task, but he doesn't seem to burn his up in trades from what I have seen though.  He does seem to have a knack for getting something for players he was either not planning on keeping, or not wanting anymore.

[dirty steve]

I am not a fan or hater of Purp... or better put I have not seen anything to indicate either way on him to be honest... if you do nothing, ever... then you are not very good, and he is approaching that level.

I am also not a big fan of the Hun either... I thought he made some good and some bad choices and the more I have heard about the inner workings of the org while he was here, some of what people praise him for is the work of other people.  He was an ok GM, but nothing that special, IMO.

Now if you want a good GM that nobody really talks about look at Bob Melvin in Mil (and formerly of Tex).  I think he was what you want in a GM, as far as deal making and such goes.  I am not sure his track record for minor league development, but then often times this is a delegated task, but he doesn't seem to burn his up in trades from what I have seen though.  He does seem to have a knack for getting something for players he was either not planning on keeping, or not wanting anymore.

think you mean Doug--Bob is the manager is arizona right now.

[pravata]

I am not a fan or hater of Purp... or better put I have not seen anything to indicate either way on him to be honest... if you do nothing, ever... then you are not very good, and he is approaching that level.

I am also not a big fan of the Hun either... I thought he made some good and some bad choices and the more I have heard about the inner workings of the org while he was here, some of what people praise him for is the work of other people.  He was an ok GM, but nothing that special, IMO.

Now if you want a good GM that nobody really talks about look at Bob Melvin in Mil (and formerly of Tex).  I think he was what you want in a GM, as far as deal making and such goes.  I am not sure his track record for minor league development, but then often times this is a delegated task, but he doesn't seem to burn his up in trades from what I have seen though.  He does seem to have a knack for getting something for players he was either not planning on keeping, or not wanting anymore.

What I liked about Hunsicker was that he thought it important to explain  to the fans what he was doing.  And generally, he did what he said he was going to do.   I don't trust what Purpura says in public.

[Noe]

think you mean Doug--Bob is the manager is arizona right now.

Ironically, Doug Melvin was the GM at Arlington for the Texas Rangers.  Another team known for having young talent, great hitters, good farm system.  But Melvin did nothing with them (obstensively) because it is about pitching and he didn't pay that much attention to that.  In Milwaukee, they may have good hitters, but you also need pitchers to win.

And he's gotten to the point of paying attention to pitching as much he does to hitting and that is why he's doing so much better at Milwaukee than he did in Texas.

[ASTROCREEP]

if you ever agreed with something i said, i'd change my opinion immediately. others can make their own decisions about your support.

I also believe Luke will hit.

[VirtualBob]

Sadly, Webster has had to add the word to their dictionary because of the rampant usage among... well...

Just ask my realator about the nuculur expressos at Starbucks.

Note also that biannual and semiannual are now synonyms.

[JimR]

I also believe Luke will hit.

trade the MF.

[ASTROCREEP]

Specifics.  What apologies have been given for Purpura?

Quote from: BudGirl on May 23, 2007, 04:43:36 PM
I believe every team has a position that can be improved.  I believe it is wrong if a GM doesn't try and improve it.


Three ways to improve a team:

1. Trade.
2. Let the young guys play.
3. Sign a free agent.

Fans get shortsighted sometimes and measure a GM by his ability to do Items #1 and #3 only.



This was mildly apologetic to me. (excuse my ability to properly refrence old posts) Sorry BudGirl, but they asked.

[VirtualBob]

This is good.  The actual number to make the majors from 99-03 drafts is 16, not all with the Astros.  99- Gallo, Lane, Sampson though drafted as a shortstop. (The Padres had the Astros first round pick that year in exchange for the Astros signing Caminiti.  They took Gevik Baxter.) 00- Qualls, Bruntlett, Self, and Mike Burns.  01- Burke, Saarloos, Barzilla, Jimerson, Cormier though he didn't sign with the Astros and was drafted in 02 by the Snakes, Houlton, and Albers. 02- McLemore. 2 prospects from that draft remain viable candidates to be major leaguers (Mitch Talbot now with Tampa and Nick Stavinoha who didn't sign and instead went to LSU now is at AA with Stl.) 03- Hirsh. (Barthmaier remains the only prospect with a high ceiling from that draft) (David Aardsma was drafted that year by the Giants with the Astros first pick in exchange for the Astros signing Jeff Kent.)  My 03 draft review this fall should be completely depressing.

Footnote.  The Astros gave up their first round pick in 04 to the Yankees for signing Pettitte.  They took Philip Hughes.

Shouldn't Purp get some credit for 2004 draft:  Pence (2nd round) & Zobrist (6th)?

[utastro]

trade the MF.

Luke or ASTROCREEP?

[pravata]

Quote from: BudGirl on May 23, 2007, 04:43:36 PM
I believe every team has a position that can be improved.  I believe it is wrong if a GM doesn't try and improve it.


Three ways to improve a team:

1. Trade.
2. Let the young guys play.
3. Sign a free agent.

Fans get shortsighted sometimes and measure a GM by his ability to do Items #1 and #3 only.



This was mildly apologetic to me. (excuse my ability to properly refrence old posts) Sorry BudGirl, but they asked.

Even if that list of options were "apologetic" and not factual, there is the further question of how "mildly apologetic" is beyond you?

[Noe]

Quote from: BudGirl on May 23, 2007, 04:43:36 PM
I believe every team has a position that can be improved.  I believe it is wrong if a GM doesn't try and improve it.


Three ways to improve a team:

1. Trade.
2. Let the young guys play.
3. Sign a free agent.

Fans get shortsighted sometimes and measure a GM by his ability to do Items #1 and #3 only.



This was mildly apologetic to me. (excuse my ability to properly refrence old posts) Sorry BudGirl, but they asked.

The part about the GM is mine and how is that apologetic?  I don't get it.

[VirtualBob]

Luke or ASTROCREEP?

The Chronicle reports that AD may be interested in the latter ... maybe for a poster-to-be-named-later?

[strosrays]

Even if that list of options were "apologetic" and not factual, there is the further question of how "mildly apologetic" is beyond you?

Look, bottom line, you Popes screwed this up.  Posts 2 through about 15 or so, this baby was an all-out Clark-a-Palooza!

[ASTROCREEP]

The part about the GM is mine and how is that apologetic?  I don't get it.

It appeared you were implying that Pup is improving the team. No?

[Noe]

Even if that list of options were "apologetic" and not factual, there is the further question of how "mildly apologetic" is beyond you?

That is the problem to me.  How is stating the obvious considered an apology for the GM?  He really only has three options at this disposal and yes, fans only consider two options viable: trade or sign a free agent.  The decision to stick with MoBerg (for instance) this offseason instead of acquiring another third baseman may have all sorts of extenuating circumstances that lead to that decision being made.  Aubrey Huff outpriced himself to the league, MoBerg had no takers in the trade front, MoBerg was working with a personal trainer to get his arm back in shape, MoBerg talked to the GM and they were able to understand better how Mo was trying to get himself ready to help this year, et. al.

I like a GM who gets all the information he can before he makes a vital decision.  If he sat on his hands and then made a vital decision, that is different.  At that point, one would wonder what the heck he's doing in such a job.  He is well overmatched.  So again, how is that apologetic when it's the truth.

[Noe]

It appeared you were implying that Pup is improving the team. No?

You have reading comprehension problems.  It is very easy to read what I said and take it for it's face value:

3 ways to make moves: trade, sign free agents, let young players play.

Fans don't pay attention to the last part pretty much.

What I'm implying more than anything else is that fans are pretty much clueless when it comes to the job a GM does.

[Jacksonian]

Shouldn't Purp get some credit for 2004 draft:  Pence (2nd round) & Zobrist (6th)?

That was Hun's last draft as GM.  Purp was around for the others as well, but IMO the draft falls on the GM.

[ASTROCREEP]

That is the problem to me.  How is stating the obvious considered an apology for the GM?  He really only has three options at this disposal and yes, fans only consider two options viable: trade or sign a free agent.  The decision to stick with MoBerg (for instance) this offseason instead of acquiring another third baseman may have all sorts of extenuating circumstances that lead to that decision being made.  Aubrey Huff outpriced himself to the league, MoBerg had no takers in the trade front, MoBerg was working with a personal trainer to get his arm back in shape, MoBerg talked to the GM and they were able to understand better how Mo was trying to get himself ready to help this year, et. al.

I like a GM who gets all the information he can before he makes a vital decision.  If he sat on his hands and then made a vital decision, that is different.  At that point, one would wonder what the heck he's doing in such a job.  He is well overmatched.  So again, how is that apologetic when it's the truth.

So are you saying given the exact same curcumstance no other GM could have done a better job?

[VirtualBob]

That was Hun's last draft as GM.  Purp was around for the others as well, but IMO the draft falls on the GM.

Fair enough ... either way, though, my point was that 2004 should be included in the list.

[pravata]

That is the problem to me.  How is stating the obvious considered an apology for the GM?  He really only has three options at this disposal and yes, fans only consider two options viable: trade or sign a free agent.  The decision to stick with MoBerg (for instance) this offseason instead of acquiring another third baseman may have all sorts of extenuating circumstances that lead to that decision being made.  Aubrey Huff outpriced himself to the league, MoBerg had no takers in the trade front, MoBerg was working with a personal trainer to get his arm back in shape, MoBerg talked to the GM and they were able to understand better how Mo was trying to get himself ready to help this year, et. al.

I like a GM who gets all the information he can before he makes a vital decision.  If he sat on his hands and then made a vital decision, that is different.  At that point, one would wonder what the heck he's doing in such a job.  He is well overmatched.  So again, how is that apologetic when it's the truth.

And to understand that he's overmatched you have to understand why he makes the decisions he does.  Purpura has never intentionally done anything to hurt the Astros.  That is a pointless view to take.  He is always, by his methods, trying to improve every position on the team.  How? (edit. not Why?) is the interesting part.  Given of course the resources he has available and the real world situation of the Astros.

[Noe]

So are you saying given the exact same curcumstance no other GM could have done a better job?

I'm saying Tim Purpura is doing his job.  Fans thinking they know better make me laugh... out loud even.  That the team is not doing well is perhaps an indictment of shoddy GM-ship or maybe not.  How in the heck was Tim Purpura going to know that Lance Freaking Berkman was going to no-show for the month of May and April and look like he's still sleep walking going into June?  How is *THAT* Purpura's fault?  Please, find me something to pin on Purpura like it is easy to pin stuff on say Cam Bonifay.  I want to hear it because if he is the problem and getting rid of him makes Lance Berkman hit off a sudden, then I'm all for it.

So tell me, what ya got?

[Jacksonian]

Fair enough ... either way, though, my point was that 2004 should be included in the list.

Foggy went with 99-03 so I did too.  2004 was Hun's best draft post '98 by far.  Most of that talent is just making it's way to AA though so the final outcomes for that draft aren't as easily measured as the previous drafts.  I think Foggy's point though was that the lack of younger homegrown talent in Houston and the upper minors sits squarely on Hun's shoulders.

[ASTROCREEP]

You have reading comprehension problems.  It is very easy to read what I said and take it for it's face value:

3 ways to make moves: trade, sign free agents, let young players play.

Fans don't pay attention to the last part pretty much.

What I'm implying more than anything else is that fans are pretty much clueless when it comes to the job a GM does.

OK, so I guess I'm having a hard time seeing where your stance is.
How would you grade him? Pravata too. Seriously I value your opinions.


A: He is great, best GM in recent Astros history

B:  Pup has done the best he possibly can, considering the circumstances. Give him 2 more years, before you even cosnider replacing him.

C: He needs to do "something" soon or his job should be considered in jepeordy.

D: Fire Him now he is useless

[Noe]

OK, so I guess I'm having a hard time seeing where your stance is.
How would you grade him? Pravata too. Seriously I value your opinions.

No you don't.

A: He is great, best GM in recent Astros history

B:  Pup has done the best he possibly can, considering the circumstances. Give him 2 more years, before you even cosnider replacing him.

C: He needs to do "something" soon or his job should be considered in jepeordy.

D: Fire Him now he is useless

E. I dunno, I don't care, I'd like to see Lance Berkman hitting again.

[pravata]

OK, so I guess I'm having a hard time seeing where your stance is.
How would you grade him? Pravata too. Seriously I value your opinions.


A: He is great, best GM in recent Astros history

B:  Pup has done the best he possibly can, considering the circumstances. Give him 2 more years, before you even cosnider replacing him.

C: He needs to do "something" soon or his job should be considered in jepeordy.

D: Fire Him now he is useless

Listen carefully, I've said this before, many, many times, I do not value my own opinion.  I also dont speculate on topics when I have incomplete information.  All I am ever trying to do is understand why the Astros do what the Astros do. 

[Jose Cruz III]

think you mean Doug--Bob is the manager is arizona right now.

Didn't Doug and Bob used to be a drunk comedy team before they got into baseball?

[Jose Cruz III]

Question for Noe, prav, or Jim...........

If there is no one in the farm system that can help this team, how much of that is the fault of the GM and how much of that is the fault of the minor league instructors?

I will hang up and listen...........

[Noe]

Question for Noe, prav, or Jim...........

If there is no one in the farm system that can help this team, how much of that is the fault of the GM and how much of that is the fault of the minor league instructors?

I will hang up and listen...........

What?  Why don't you go ask the Minor League forum for that information?

[Jacksonian]

What?  Why don't you go ask the Minor League forum for that information?

Hey now, I post here too.

IMO, GM.

[Noe]

Hey now, I post here too.

IMO, GM.

Tis what I meant though.  Why pravata, Jim or I?  Is it because folks just want to come after us today?  I mean, take a look, do I have a bulls-eye on my back today?  If so, take it off me, m'kay.  Is today "all rants" day at the OWA and no one told me about it?  Damn, I should be getting these memos after the Astros drop a series to the Jakes... shouldn't I.  Damn me for getting in the way of all these lovely little rants.

Go ahead people, knock yourselves out.. fire anyone and everyone you want, I won't say another word today.  Hehe

[Andyzipp]

Tis what I meant though.  Why pravata, Jim or I?  Is it because folks just want to come after us today?  I mean, take a look, do I have a bulls-eye on my back today?  If so, take it off me, m'kay.  Is today "all rants" day at the OWA and no one told me about it?  Damn, I should be getting these memos after the Astros drop a series to the Jakes... shouldn't I.  Damn me for getting in the way of all these lovely little rants.

Go ahead people, knock yourselves out.. fire anyone and everyone you want, I won't say another word today.  Hehe

So the correct answer is...Noé's fault.

[Jose Cruz III]

What?  Why don't you go ask the Minor League forum for that information?

Is there a minor league forum? I reserve comments about the GM because I don't have enough info to judge him. But the fact that guys are not developing cannot be the total fault of a front office guy. Every team has guys that don't pan out. And we have our share of guys that did (Oswalt, Berkman, etc.). I just thought you guys could provide some insight of how this whole development stage progresses.

But you don't have to if ya don't want to.

[WulawHorn]

Of course it is rant day. Pitiful 2-4 homestand, on the backs of an abysmal 0-7 roadtrip from hell, after dropping three of the last four on a previous homestand.

We haven't had a save opportunity in 18 freaking games!

The villagers are restless. This is going to happen. Especially on an off day. I vote for more you tube posts of Jennifer Love Hewitt and maybe there would be less rants.  Just saying....

[pravata]

Is there a minor league forum? ...

Ouch.  Go here, http://www.orangewhoopass.com/forums/index.php scroll down, whole section on the minors. 

[Jacksonian]

Tis what I meant though.  Why pravata, Jim or I? 

Because you three have 3 of the 4 highest post totals. And the 4th? Well, no one really cares what Limey thinks.

[Noe]

So the correct answer is...Noé's fault.

Yes.  My apologetic ways for the GM has apparently affected Lance Berkman's swing so much that this team is just not good any more.  I will humbly take what ever punishment is deemed necessary to appease the BBGs for my horrible ways.  Watch a Scott Baio marathon?  Eat Frito Pies for a week?  Work on the landscape in my backyard?

Come on people, here is your chance to enter an OWA contest of worth:

What should be Noe's punishment for the Astros being so woeful and for breaking Lance Berkman like he did (is it any coicidinky that last year I put Lidge and Ensberg on our banner and they both failed miserably and that this year I place Berkman and Biggio up there and now look!).  I am a bad, bad, bad person and my jinxosity needs to stop.  Please, I implore you, oh great sages of the OWA... what should I do to run this bad mojo off of me?

Best answer will get a prize of some sort, perhaps a date with me for some Shiner 98.  Okay, let me hear your answers!

[Andyzipp]

Because you three have 3 of the 4 highest post totals. And the 4th? Well, no one really cares what Limey thinks.

He's going to tell you anyway...why ask?

[Andyzipp]

Yes.  My apologetic ways for the GM has apparently affected Lance Berkman's swing so much that this team is just not good any more.  I will humbly take what ever punishment is deemed necessary to appease the BBGs for my horrible ways.  Watch a Scott Baio marathon?  Eat Frito Pies for a week?  Work on the landscape in my backyard?

Come on people, here is your chance to enter an OWA contest of worth:

What should be Noe's punishment for the Astros being so woeful and for breaking Lance Berkman like he did (is it any coicidinky that last year I put Lidge and Ensberg on our banner and they both failed miserably and that this year I place Berkman and Biggio up there and now look!).  I am a bad, bad, bad person and my jinxosity needs to stop.  Please, I implore you, oh great sages of the OWA... what should I do to run this bad mojo off of me?

Best answer will get a prize of some sort, perhaps a date with me for some Shiner 98.  Okay, let me hear your answers!

Throw in some barrio queso and I'm in.

[Jose Cruz III]

Tis what I meant though.  Why pravata, Jim or I?  Is it because folks just want to come after us today?  I mean, take a look, do I have a bulls-eye on my back today?  If so, take it off me, m'kay.  Is today "all rants" day at the OWA and no one told me about it?  Damn, I should be getting these memos after the Astros drop a series to the Jakes... shouldn't I.  Damn me for getting in the way of all these lovely little rants.

Go ahead people, knock yourselves out.. fire anyone and everyone you want, I won't say another word today.  Hehe

Woah hossie. I didn't come after you guys. I asked because I dont know and you and prav and jim and jacksonian seem to know more about the inner workings of the minor league system than most here.

[pravata]

Woah hossie. I didn't come after you guys. I asked because I dont know and you and prav and jim and jacksonian seem to know more about the inner workings of the minor league system than most here.

I dont know crap about the minors and I defy you to prove to me that I do.  (Except what I read here in the OWA's Bus Ride.)

[Andyzipp]

I dont know crap about the minors and I defy you to prove to me that I do.  (Except what I read here in the OWA's Bus Ride.)

We have a Bus Ride?

Is this different than the mustache rides that Hudson is constantly offering Budgirl?

[pravata]

We have a Bus Ride?

Is this different than the mustache rides that Hudson is constantly offering Budgirl?

Bus Ride Discussion Forum, I defy you to prove to me there's a difference.

[Noe]

Woah hossie. I didn't come after you guys. I asked because I dont know and you and prav and jim and jacksonian seem to know more about the inner workings of the minor league system than most here.

Maybe Jim and Jacksonian, but pravata and I don't hold a cnadle to those guys in the minor league forum on the insight.  Did you *really* not know we had a minor league forum, perhaps the best for all the Houston Astros fansites out there?  *sigh*

[Jacksonian]

We have a Bus Ride?

Yes, it's short and yellow.

[Jose Cruz III]

Yes.  My apologetic ways for the GM has apparently affected Lance Berkman's swing so much that this team is just not good any more.  I will humbly take what ever punishment is deemed necessary to appease the BBGs for my horrible ways.  Watch a Scott Baio marathon?  Eat Frito Pies for a week?  Work on the landscape in my backyard?

Come on people, here is your chance to enter an OWA contest of worth:

What should be Noe's punishment for the Astros being so woeful and for breaking Lance Berkman like he did (is it any coicidinky that last year I put Lidge and Ensberg on our banner and they both failed miserably and that this year I place Berkman and Biggio up there and now look!).  I am a bad, bad, bad person and my jinxosity needs to stop.  Please, I implore you, oh great sages of the OWA... what should I do to run this bad mojo off of me?

Best answer will get a prize of some sort, perhaps a date with me for some Shiner 98.  Okay, let me hear your answers!

Keep the mojo and next year have an array of players on the banner such as Pujols, the Milwaukee infield, Bay, and others. Could work.

[Andyzipp]

Maybe Jim and Jacksonian, but pravata and I don't hold a cnadle to those guys in the minor league forum on the insight.  Did you *really* not know we had a minor league forum, perhaps the best for all the Houston Astros fansites out there?  *sigh*

I keep telling you...we've got to change the format of this place.  Put the information where it can be found and whatnot.

[Jacksonian]

Maybe Jim and Jacksonian, but pravata and I don't hold a cnadle to those guys in the minor league forum on the insight.  Did you *really* not know we had a minor league forum, perhaps the best for all the Houston Astros fansites out there?  *sigh*

Perhaps?  I'm starting to feel slighted in this thread.

[Noe]

Yes, it's short and yellow.

POTW candidate.  Sent!

[Jose Cruz III]

Maybe Jim and Jacksonian, but pravata and I don't hold a cnadle to those guys in the minor league forum on the insight.  Did you *really* not know we had a minor league forum, perhaps the best for all the Houston Astros fansites out there?  *sigh*

No I didn't. *will accept 50 lashes*

[Andyzipp]

Perhaps?  I'm starting to feel slighted in this thread.

Who in the hell are you?  Aren't you the same guy as Virtual Bob? 

[pravata]

Maybe Jim and Jacksonian, but pravata and I don't hold a cnadle to those guys in the minor league forum on the insight.  Did you *really* not know we had a minor league forum, perhaps the best for all the Houston Astros fansites out there?  *sigh*

Fansites?  Hell all Astros coverage put together, astros.com included. Which brings me to this comment, Charlie Palillo needs to shutup about the Astros minor league players until Ben Zobrist's major league BA is higher than Adam Everett's. 

[pravata]

No I didn't. *will accept 50 lashes*

And well deserved.  If a website is measured on unique content, that's the only thing that keeps this place above water.   

[Noe]

I keep telling you...we've got to change the format of this place.  Put the information where it can be found and whatnot.

Hmmmmmm.... you're on to something here.  Or you're on something, can't decide which!

[Jacksonian]

Who in the hell are you?  Aren't you the same guy as Virtual Bob? 

You shouldn't insult Bob like that.  But, I am starting to feel a little better.  At least you didn't mistake me for Barzilla.  Thanks Andy!

[Noe]

Perhaps?  I'm starting to feel slighted in this thread.

No question in my mind.  I leave that in for the sake of others who want to make arguments on the contrary.  I allow them their opinions as it were, even though mine is one without any doubts whatsoever.

[Jacksonian]

No question in my mind.  I leave that in for the sake of others who want to make arguments on the contrary.  I allow them their opinions as it were, even though mine is one without any doubts whatsoever.

[vanity]There isn't one that can carry our sports bra.[/vanity]

[Jacksonian]

Fansites?  Hell all Astros coverage put together, astros.com included. Which brings me to this comment, Charlie Palillo needs to shutup about the Astros minor league players until Ben Zobrist's major league BA is higher than Adam Everett's. 

I will admit to some jealousy at Alyson's ease of access.  Of course living in Houston might help that.

[Spider Pellini]

Hmmmmmm.... you're on to something here.  Or you're on something, can't decide which!

Sorta makes you wonder if that fellar can find his way to Andy's Zipper Flap don't it...

[Andyzipp]

Sorta makes you wonder if that fellar can find his way to Andy's Zipper Flap don't it...

No fellar is gonna find his way to that. 

[BudGirl]

We have a Bus Ride?

Is this different than the mustache rides that Hudson is constantly offering Budgirl?

Damm you are funny.  Not.

[Andyzipp]

Damm you are funny.  Not.

I never told anyone how interested you were in accepting. 

[BudGirl]

I never told anyone how interested you were in accepting. 

Why are you playing this game?  Don't you have someone to counsel?

[Andyzipp]

Why are you playing this game?  Don't you have someone to counsel?

Nah.  I'm supposed to be studying.  For a certification.  Test on Friday.

[BudGirl]

Nah.  I'm supposed to be studying.  For a certification.  Test on Friday.

Keep this up and I'm sure you'll have no problem failing.



Good Luck.

[davek]

Keep this up and I'm sure you'll have no problem failing.

Good Luck.

I doubt he'll have a problem...

I've thought Zipper was certifiable for years...

[Mike]

Fansites?  Hell all Astros coverage put together, astros.com included. Which brings me to this comment, Charlie Palillo needs to shutup about the Astros minor league players until Ben Zobrist's major league BA is higher than Adam Everett's. 

Ben has really struggled this year and was sent down to Durham. But he had a great attitude about it...so his major league BA isn't going to change soon

[MusicMan]

Ben has really struggled this year and was sent down to Durham. But he had a great attitude about it...so his major league BA isn't going to change soon

That's not possible.  BEn Zobrist could come up RIGHT NOW and be a better shortstop than Adam Everett.

Charlie told me so.

[Noe]

That's not possible.  BEn Zobrist could come up RIGHT NOW and be a better shortstop than Adam Everett.

Charlie told me so.

And have a great attitude about it too!  You know, unlike that sour puss, whiny beeyotch that is Adam Everett.

[pravata]

Ben has really struggled this year and was sent down to Durham. But he had a great attitude about it...so his major league BA isn't going to change soon

Exactly.  And what does that tell us about Charlie Palillo and his constant criticism of the Astros for not bringing up minor league players?  Last season he gabbled endlessly about how Zobrist couldn't be a worse hitter than Everett.  Turns out, he can be.  These and other of his comments are based on no direct knowledge of the players involved and betray him as just a mindless little knee jerk complainer.

[Noe]

Exactly.  And what does that tell us about Charlie Palillo and his constant criticism of the Astros for not bringing up minor league players?  Last season he gabbled endlessly about how Zobrist couldn't be a worse hitter than Everett.  Turns out, he can be.  These and other of his comments are based on no direct knowledge of the players involved and betray him as just a mindless little knee jerk complainer.

Or maybe Purpura knows sumptin' sumptin' about being a MLB GM?  Oops, nevermind, that can't be so!  Carry on!

[Foghorn]

Foggy went with 99-03 so I did too.  2004 was Hun's best draft post '98 by far.  Most of that talent is just making it's way to AA though so the final outcomes for that draft aren't as easily measured as the previous drafts.  I think Foggy's point though was that the lack of younger homegrown talent in Houston and the upper minors sits squarely on Hun's shoulders.

My main point for doing 1999-2003 was because to me your "hits" from the 2003 draft should be in the majors, but it is reasonable for some of the 2004 draft "hits" to still be in the minors.  So if 2003 was my end point, I just went back 5 years.

The list of draftees from 1999-2003 is horrid.  Only Chad Qualls is a regular contributor to the Astros, though you could claim that Burke should be. 

From a 5-year period the best the Astros can claim is their 7th inning guy. 

Piss.  Fucking.  Poor.

[HudsonHawk]

Note also that biannual and semiannual are now synonyms.

Huh?  I'm missing the joke.