MLB: How could we know it would be cold in the North in April?

[OldBlevins]

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070409&content_id=1889680&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

[pravata]

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070409&content_id=1889680&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

"If somebody can predict weather for me 18 months in advance we'd be happy to do it another way," added Katy Feeney, Major League Baseball's senior vice president of scheduling and club relations, when reached in New York on Monday. "But nobody has been able to do that.

OK http://www.worldclimate.com/cgi-bin/data.pl?ref=N41W081+1304+331657C

Katy further puzzles us with the intricacies of keeping teams from being snowed on, "...in two-team markets, it's not practical to have both open on the road."

"Do you really want to have a city like Chicago with neither playing at home for a week?" Feeney said. "If the White Sox weren't home now, the Cubs would be, and somebody else would be complaining."
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/2007-04-08-snow_N.htm

So, it's not just about the obvious problems of forgetting how to schedule double headers.  I mean, who can predict the north will be cold?  Meterologist Juan Rincon tries to explain it to the certificate printing, dollar store frame buying, desperate franchise appeasing Ms Feeney,

"If we're going to play a series with the White Sox this early, why not in Minnesota where we still have a dome?" Twins pitcher Juan Rincon told the Minneapolis Star Tribune. "Tampa Bay opens in New York. Toronto, with a dome, opens in Detroit. I must be stupid, because I don't understand."
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/2007-04-08-snow_N.htm

[DVauthrin]

Katy further puzzles us with the intricacies of keeping teams from being snowed on, "...in two-team markets, it's not practical to have both open on the road."

"Do you really want to have a city like Chicago with neither playing at home for a week?" Feeney said.

Which is more practical Ms. Feeney, starting the year with cancelled games do to cold weather, or having no cancellations and teams get road trips(primarily the nasty west coast trip) out of the way?   But that would be far too logical for MLB.

[tophfar]

Which is more practical Ms. Feeney, starting the year with cancelled games do to cold weather, or having no cancellations and teams get road trips(primarily the nasty west coast trip) out of the way?   But that would be far too logical for MLB.

honestly, what's the percentage of games cancelled the past 20 years in april?  if it werent for this last strong cold snap no one would be whining about anything.  just like last year or the year before that or the year before that.  so its cold for a week, wfw.

if the teams up north never opened at home, they would just whine about never opening the season at home.

[DVauthrin]

honestly, what's the percentage of games cancelled the past 20 years in april?  if it werent for this last strong cold snap no one would be whining about anything.  just like last year or the year before that or the year before that.  so its cold for a week, wfw.

if the teams up north never opened at home, they would just whine about never opening the season at home.

They have made a team like pittsburgh start on the road for years now?  Why?  Do to the weather.    You get the same number of home/road games, so why does it matter when they come?   And to those northern teams who have issues, try building a retractable roof on your stadium so you would not have these dilemmas.   But also I don't see them whining that hard if they get a west coast trip out of the way earlier than other teams.

[Amy]

There are a lot of other idiotic things going on with the schedule besides the weather issue.  Personally, as far as the weather thing, I lean toward "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure".  Yes, the weather is unpredictable.  But I don't think that means they shouldn't make an effort to use common sense and try to keep games in domes or warmer markets for the first two weeks.

Have you noticed all the other squirrely stuff going on with the Astros' schedule in last three years?  "Coincidentally" since MLB took the scheduling contract away from the couple that had been doing it for about 25 years and gave it to some company.  Stuff like the Astros making an extra trip to NYC to play four extra games against the non-division opponent Mets.  Or the year we played interleague games against teams from all three AL divisions?  This year, the Astros play the Pirates, Cubs and Cardinals early in the season and then go three months before they see them again.  Also since 2005 (including this season), the 'Stros have played only 77 - 81 games against division opponents, down from 90 in 2004.  That has resulted in the number of home-road series against division opponents not being even.  This season the Cubs and Reds only come to Houston for six games, but the 'Stros play nine games against them on the road.  I could go on, but you get the idea.

I'm sure it isn't easy to put together the MLB schedule, but I still think it could be done better.

[tophfar]

There are a lot of other idiotic things going on with the schedule besides the weather issue.  Personally, as far as the weather thing, I lean toward "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure".  Yes, the weather is unpredictable.  But I don't think that means they shouldn't make an effort to use common sense and try to keep games in domes or warmer markets for the first two weeks.

Have you noticed all the other squirrely stuff going on with the Astros' schedule in last three years?  "Coincidentally" since MLB took the scheduling contract away from the couple that had been doing it for about 25 years and gave it to some company.  Stuff like the Astros making an extra trip to NYC to play four extra games against the non-division opponent Mets.  Or the year we played interleague games against teams from all three AL divisions?  This year, the Astros play the Pirates, Cubs and Cardinals early in the season and then go three months before they see them again.  Also since 2005 (including this season), the 'Stros have played only 77 - 81 games against division opponents, down from 90 in 2004.  That has resulted in the number of home-road series against division opponents not being even.  This season the Cubs and Reds only come to Houston for six games, but the 'Stros play nine games against them on the road.  I could go on, but you get the idea.

I'm sure it isn't easy to put together the MLB schedule, but I still think it could be done better.

yes.  see schedule, unbalanced.

[HurricaneDavid]

They have made a team like pittsburgh start on the road for years now?  Why?  Do to the weather.    You get the same number of home/road games, so why does it matter when they come?   And to those northern teams who have issues, try building a retractable roof on your stadium so you would not have these dilemmas.   But also I don't see them whining that hard if they get a west coast trip out of the way earlier than other teams.

Give me a fucking break.  Unless you're suggesting the northern teams start with like a month's worth of road games, this is a difference of what, 7 calendar days?  I doubt the likelihood of snow on 4/9 is dramatically different than it is on 4/2 in any of these cities.  MLB ran into bad luck this year with the snow.  MLB does a lot of things wrong, but I don't think this is one of them.  Fans in northern cities deserve the chance to see a real Opening Day every once in a while.

[Fredia]

but this cold spell even hit the southern cities that are usually not affected by the cold spells. atl.. and even houston was colder than normal to some extent. if mlb wants this thing fixed just require all stadiums to have roofs.. i mean they seem to want to control everything else in mlb. i bet they jump up and down and have fits when they can not control the weather

[Duke]

According to Selig on Rome yesterday, MLB owners in  "fair weather" cities don't want to over schedule home games in the spring and thus have fewer at the end of the year.  You already have the WS wrapping up in Nov. so you can't move the schedule to the right any.  Complicated issue.

[Bench]

One good thing to come out of Cleveland and Seattle's winterland adventures is that it monkeyed around with Seattle's rotation and produced tomorrow's nationally televised battle of phenoms: Felix v. Dice-K. If I can't watch Astros baseball in the evening, that's a pretty good substitute.

[Frobie]

My beef with the issue is not that they tried to give Cleveland a home opener before the weather gets nice (say, June).  It's that they scheduled the first two home series for Cleveland with west-coast teams that were making their only trips to Jacobs Field for 2007.  They didn't even schedule a day off in there so it might be possible make up a game or two if necessary (though that wouldn't have helped much in this case, obviously).  

I grew up an Indians fan in NE Ohio and remember that early April baseball was always dicey.  Wish they would have moved the upcoming series to Minute Maid as was apparently discussed rather than Miller Park.  The weather Oct-May sucks in Cleveland, that much is clear (and a big reason I'm a Houstonian now).  I just think they set themselves up to fail, and they did.

[Limey]

Give me a fucking break.  Unless you're suggesting the northern teams start with like a month's worth of road games, this is a difference of what, 7 calendar days?  I doubt the likelihood of snow on 4/9 is dramatically different than it is on 4/2 in any of these cities.  MLB ran into bad luck this year with the snow.  MLB does a lot of things wrong, but I don't think this is one of them.  Fans in northern cities deserve the chance to see a real Opening Day every once in a while.

The mistake is those northern teams who build new stadia without a retractable roof.  Or teams like the Rangers who build an open air stadium so that they can play in 100+ heat all summer, and yet still wonder why their challenge always wilts in August.  Or if the Marlins build one without a roof, then have a dozen (at least) rainouts each summer.

Basically, in this day and age, and major league team of any description who builds a lidless crib is dumb.

[Limey]

According to Selig on Rome yesterday, MLB owners in  "fair weather" cities don't want to over schedule home games in the spring and thus have fewer at the end of the year.  You already have the WS wrapping up in Nov. so you can't move the schedule to the right any.  Complicated issue.

Selig could always contract a couple of teams...

[homer]

There are a lot of other idiotic things going on with the schedule besides the weather issue.  Personally, as far as the weather thing, I lean toward "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure".  Yes, the weather is unpredictable.  But I don't think that means they shouldn't make an effort to use common sense and try to keep games in domes or warmer markets for the first two weeks.

Have you noticed all the other squirrely stuff going on with the Astros' schedule in last three years?  "Coincidentally" since MLB took the scheduling contract away from the couple that had been doing it for about 25 years and gave it to some company.  Stuff like the Astros making an extra trip to NYC to play four extra games against the non-division opponent Mets.  Or the year we played interleague games against teams from all three AL divisions?  This year, the Astros play the Pirates, Cubs and Cardinals early in the season and then go three months before they see them again.  Also since 2005 (including this season), the 'Stros have played only 77 - 81 games against division opponents, down from 90 in 2004.  That has resulted in the number of home-road series against division opponents not being even.  This season the Cubs and Reds only come to Houston for six games, but the 'Stros play nine games against them on the road.  I could go on, but you get the idea.

I'm sure it isn't easy to put together the MLB schedule, but I still think it could be done better.

The Astros 2005 schedule was thought to be very forgiving. Enough so that there was whining by others:

http://www.orangewhoopass.com/forums/index.php?topic=32489.0

There was also a quote that year by Garner that he had never seen a schedule that limited the length of road trips like that year.

[Gizzmonic]

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070409&content_id=1889680&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

Of course, the elephant in the room with regards to scheduling is Interleague Play.

Get rid of this, and your scheduling problems are significantly reduced.

The 'Stros can play the Rangers in an exhibition game every year for the "Silver Boot," as if anyone cared.

[BudGirl]

I'm probably in the minority but I like interleague play.

[Noe]

Basically, in this day and age, and major league team of any description who builds a lidless crib is dumb.

Yes, of course, you're talking common sense here too.  But then again, what good is a roof if the league will order you to pop the top off the stadium in late October if you were lucky enough to have gotten to the Fall Classic.   Gotta have those oh so wonderful blimp shots ya' know.

The MLB is about marketing a business, plain and simple.  They are not the baseball men per se, even though they have their fair share of them.  They, the MLB, is about the business of baseball.  Running tv contracts, running schedules for the gate reciepts, screwing up MLB Extra Innings, et. al.

Baseball, the game, is all about something else and that is where the line gets blurred for fans.  We care about the business side only when it thrust upon us in harsh contract negotiations between the MLB and MLBPA, the free agency signings free for all (and an added dash of Scott Boras somewhere in there) and when the price of duckets and beer go up.

[pravata]

There are a lot of other idiotic things going on with the schedule besides the weather issue.  Personally, as far as the weather thing, I lean toward "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure".  Yes, the weather is unpredictable.  But I don't think that means they shouldn't make an effort to use common sense and try to keep games in domes or warmer markets for the first two weeks.

Have you noticed all the other squirrely stuff going on with the Astros' schedule in last three years?  "Coincidentally" since MLB took the scheduling contract away from the couple that had been doing it for about 25 years and gave it to some company.  Stuff like the Astros making an extra trip to NYC to play four extra games against the non-division opponent Mets.  Or the year we played interleague games against teams from all three AL divisions?  This year, the Astros play the Pirates, Cubs and Cardinals early in the season and then go three months before they see them again.  Also since 2005 (including this season), the 'Stros have played only 77 - 81 games against division opponents, down from 90 in 2004.  That has resulted in the number of home-road series against division opponents not being even.  This season the Cubs and Reds only come to Houston for six games, but the 'Stros play nine games against them on the road.  I could go on, but you get the idea.

I'm sure it isn't easy to put together the MLB schedule, but I still think it could be done better.

Weather is unpredictable, climate is not.  The chart I linked to shows that the minimum temperature in early April is likely to be just north of 28 degrees in Cleveland.  Every year.

[HurricaneDavid]

Weather is unpredictable, climate is not.  The chart I linked to shows that the minimum temperature in early April is likely to be just north of 28 degrees in Cleveland.  Every year.

The chart shows that the average min in March is 28.  The average min on 4/9 is 38.

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KBKL/2007/4/9/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

Anyway, what is your solution?  No home games for Cleveland until 5/1 when the average min is 46?

[pravata]

The chart shows that the average min in March is 28.  The average min on 4/9 is 38.

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KBKL/2007/4/9/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

Anyway, what is your solution?  No home games for Cleveland until 5/1 when the average min is 46?

My solution is to not let Kate Feeney make public statements.  Because meteorologists can make pretty good predictions about what the temperature at a certain location will be like in 18 months. 

[headhunter]

I'm a Texan who has been living in Cleveland (Ohio, not Texas) for almost four years and Frobie's right. April is crueler in Cleveland. Last Tuesday it was 80 degrees, on Thursday there was snow. It would have made more sense to schedule the west coast teams visting games later in the season, but you can even get hit with snow in early may. Nothing to do but see what happens and adjust. And it is just wrong to have snow on Easter.

My beef with the issue is not that they tried to give Cleveland a home opener before the weather gets nice (say, June).  It's that they scheduled the first two home series for Cleveland with west-coast teams that were making their only trips to Jacobs Field for 2007.  They didn't even schedule a day off in there so it might be possible make up a game or two if necessary (though that wouldn't have helped much in this case, obviously).  

I grew up an Indians fan in NE Ohio and remember that early April baseball was always dicey.  Wish they would have moved the upcoming series to Minute Maid as was apparently discussed rather than Miller Park.  The weather Oct-May sucks in Cleveland, that much is clear (and a big reason I'm a Houstonian now).  I just think they set themselves up to fail, and they did.

[DVauthrin]

Give me a fucking break.  Unless you're suggesting the northern teams start with like a month's worth of road games, this is a difference of what, 7 calendar days?  I doubt the likelihood of snow on 4/9 is dramatically different than it is on 4/2 in any of these cities.  MLB ran into bad luck this year with the snow.  MLB does a lot of things wrong, but I don't think this is one of them.  Fans in northern cities deserve the chance to see a real Opening Day every once in a while.

Then tell their owners to build retractable roofs.    Not that difficult really.    And again, I was not saying a month of road games.   Usually it's the first week, maybe two that are in jeopardy.     And again I don't see the northern teams getting all worked up if they can get one of their long annoying west coast trips out of the way in its place.   

[HurricaneDavid]

Then tell their owners to build retractable roofs.    Not that difficult really.

If you honestly believe that building a retractable roof for an existing stadium is "not that difficult," I suggest you stop talking entirely.

[DVauthrin]

If you honestly believe that building a retractable roof for an existing stadium is "not that difficult," I suggest you stop talking entirely.

After it's been built, sure it's pain, but I wasn't saying it in that matter.    I was suggesting if you don't have one(roof), then you have no ground to complain when you can't host as many early season games as you like for weather concerns. Comerica, PNC, Jacobs Field, Camden Yards, Citizens Bank, Great American, are all recent ballparks in northern cities, none of which was built with any sort of roof.    They made their bed by choosing not to build a roof, now they have to accept the consequences.  They should have thought about that before building their nice shiny stadiums.

And if those teams want that to change, then they need to add a roof to their stadiums regardless how difficult, in the future.

[strosrays]

Really, everybody should just calm down and wait a few years.  According to the Nat'l Geographic Channel, by then it'll be warm everywhere, all the time.  Beaumont will be on the beachfront.  Either that, or the next ice age will have begun, and snow skiing in Fredericksburg and LaGrange will be all the rage.  The Gulf Stream will move somewhere else, other than where it is now, and they'll be speaking with French accents in Great Britain.

None of this matters, of course, because by then a meteor the size of the Pennzoil Tower will have struck the earth (preferably somewhere near Katy Feeney's office), causing the dinosaurs to come back.  Shortly after that, our sun will burn out, at which point I presume it will get really cold.  And then MLB will consider scheduling early April games somewhere south of the Mason-Dixon Line.

Like Ecuador.

[mihoba]

Really, everybody should just calm down and wait a few years. 

A few years? What are you nuts! We'll all be toast by then, unless you order this remedy.

Make sure to notice the acronym of the "institute."

[Bench]

Then tell their owners to build retractable roofs.    Not that difficult really.    And again, I was not saying a month of road games.   Usually it's the first week, maybe two that are in jeopardy.     And again I don't see the northern teams getting all worked up if they can get one of their long annoying west coast trips out of the way in its place.   

Carl Pohlad thinks yer nutz.

http://www.startribune.com/10136/gallery/1116544.html

Apparantly a retractable roof would add $100 million to the already $522m stadium. Carl Pohlad derisevely laughs at snow-outs.

[strosrays]

Carl Pohlad thinks yer nutz.

http://www.startribune.com/10136/gallery/1116544.html

Apparantly a retractable roof would add $100 million to the already $522m stadium. Carl Pohlad derisevely laughs at snow-outs.

I would gladly ship them the one from MMPUS, if I thought UPS could get it on one of their planes.

[austro]

I would gladly ship them the one from MMPUS, if I thought UPS could get it on one of their planes.

"That's not stadium design; that's stadium design with UPS. Better draw a roof on that one; looks like it might snow today."