Author Topic: TO, good riddance?  (Read 6438 times)

sporadic

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TO, good riddance?
« on: March 05, 2009, 11:27:38 am »
I choose to look at removing the cancer that was TO as a positive thing.  He is undeniably one of the top 5 receivers in the NFL, a matchup nightmare of DC's, and more than likely not "replaceable"...but here is what I see as positive:

Removes the possiblity of the locker room becoming divided into the for and against TO sects.

This gives the stage to Roy Williams, who at this point in his career has shown flashes of his ability to "be the man" but never has done so on a regular basis.  He has arguably the best WR skill set in the NFL...maybe the removal of TO is just what the Dr. odered.

It also allows Miles Austin to get more PT (who I think is a legit vertical threat) and for the continued development of Sam Hurd, who I think has the highest ceiling of all Cowboy receivers not named Roy Williams.

And lastly, I think this will force the use of more 2 TE sets.  I never imagined Martellus Bennett would be pro-ready so quickly.  His combination of size and speed proved to be a real mismatch for LB's and his blocking ability was much better than what I expected from him at the pro level (I think if anything he was the one under-utilized last year, although he may not have been very reliable with his route running yet, keeping his role in the offense a little more limited - will defer that the coaching staff knew what the hell they were doing in that regard).  The multiple TE set will make Barber more effective, which in turn will make the vertical pasing game more effective, which in turn will make Felix Jones more of a nightmare once The Barbarian wears down the D. 

Would like to see what everyone else who gives a damn thinks...

BudGirl

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2009, 11:48:55 am »
If true, last I heard it was not confirmed.

$9 million is a lot to pay someone not to play.

I don't think TO was utilized to his advantage, which would help the team.

TO is not the first head case to be in the Cowboys locker room.

Romo needs to find some balls because I think he is a weak head case.

I don't like getting rid of him.
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sporadic

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2009, 12:11:51 pm »
If true, last I heard it was not confirmed.

$9 million is a lot to pay someone not to play.

I don't think TO was utilized to his advantage, which would help the team.

TO is not the first head case to be in the Cowboys locker room.

Romo needs to find some balls because I think he is a weak head case.

I don't like getting rid of him.

The $9 mil shows just how much of an ass he had become, IMO

Most of Dallas' offensive weapons were not utilized...thanks a lot for that, wonderboy.  Garrett is proving to be nothing more than a flash in the pan...should have bolted for Baltimore when his stock was up

Jessica has Tony's balls locked away in her purse...

I don't like it either from the standpoint of taking away a guy that defenses flat out fear, but I have to think this was addition by subtraction.  NFL personnel people have found out that the talent level is so good that there is something to be said for a cohesive locker room.  As far as the locker room goes...Michael Irvin could be pain in the ass, but he was all about winning, and never divided a locker room - moreso he kicked people in the as when they were not doing what it took to win.  The core group of Emmitt, Troy, Darren Woodson and Michael Irvin took care of the locker room then...this team does not seem to have any outspoken leadership.  That crew would have never dealt with the shit that Adam Jones or TO pulled.  You think Troy would have allowed some of the weak-ass route running we saw out of TO?  If he was not the number one option he was half assing it all over the place.  The more I think about it the happier I become, although it could be the rose colored glasses I have on.

juliogotay

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2009, 12:22:12 pm »
The $9 mil shows just how much of an ass he had become, IMO

Most of Dallas' offensive weapons were not utilized...thanks a lot for that, wonderboy.  Garrett is proving to be nothing more than a flash in the pan...should have bolted for Baltimore when his stock was up

Jessica has Tony's balls locked away in her purse...

I don't like it either from the standpoint of taking away a guy that defenses flat out fear, but I have to think this was addition by subtraction.  NFL personnel people have found out that the talent level is so good that there is something to be said for a cohesive locker room.  As far as the locker room goes...Michael Irvin could be pain in the ass, but he was all about winning, and never divided a locker room - moreso he kicked people in the as when they were not doing what it took to win.  The core group of Emmitt, Troy, Darren Woodson and Michael Irvin took care of the locker room then...this team does not seem to have any outspoken leadership.  That crew would have never dealt with the shit that Adam Jones or TO pulled.  You think Troy would have allowed some of the weak-ass route running we saw out of TO?  If he was not the number one option he was half assing it all over the place.  The more I think about it the happier I become, although it could be the rose colored glasses I have on.






I don't believe that $9million is the price of dumping this jerk. He was NOT one of the 5 best receivers in the NFL last year, either. Good riddance.

Col. Sphinx Drummond

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2009, 12:46:55 pm »
TO's narcissism has always exceeded his talent. But the former continues to grow even as the latter withers.
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MRaup

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2009, 12:48:26 pm »
You're not a top 5 anything when you lead the league in drops. I don't care how many amazing catches you make, when you drop that many you're just a big a problem as you are a weapon.
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HudsonHawk

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2009, 12:49:18 pm »
He is undeniably one of the top 5 receivers in the NFL,


Let's not get carried away here.  He's likely in the top 10, but probably not in the top 5, certainly not "undeniably" so.
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sporadic

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2009, 12:52:34 pm »


Really?  I'm not saying who you would want TO on your team, but the only guys I would take ahead of him are:

Andre Johnson, Randy Moss, Larry Fitzgerald, Steve Smith

I do not want to get into defending TO, as it is a silly practice, but even with down numbers last year he was an elite receiver.  The great thing that comes with this transaction is I can now go back to despising him.


austro

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2009, 12:54:58 pm »
I hate the Cowboys, but I was kind of looking forward to a TO/Ray Lewis showdown. Alas, it won't happen now unless the Ravens pick up TO.

In the meantime, I eagerly await Dallas' next head-smacking move.
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sporadic

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2009, 12:57:03 pm »
You're not a top 5 anything when you lead the league in drops. I don't care how many amazing catches you make, when you drop that many you're just a big a problem as you are a weapon.

Point well taken.  But I would like to see where DC's would rank him as far as receivers they would rather not game plan for.  Steve Young was on the disney sports channel this AM (busted, I know...but I grow weary of FOX news) stating just how hard he was to account for on the field...coming from him that cannot be taken with a grain of salt.

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2009, 12:59:00 pm »
wasn't young throwing to TO and Rice? 
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HudsonHawk

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2009, 01:02:39 pm »
Really?  I'm not saying who you would want TO on your team, but the only guys I would take ahead of him are:

Andre Johnson, Randy Moss, Larry Fitzgerald, Steve Smith

I would take Reggie Wayne and Hines Ward ahead of him too, attitude or not.

The rules of distinction were thrown out with the baseball cap.  It does not lend itself to protocol.  It is found today on youth in homes, classrooms, even in fine restaurants.  Regardless of its other consequences, this is a breach against civility.  A civilized man should avoid this mania.

BudGirl

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2009, 01:03:47 pm »
I would take Reggie Wayne and Hines Ward ahead of him too, attitude or not.



what about marshall from Denver?
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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2009, 01:04:49 pm »
He was 28th in catches
13th in yards
15th in average yards per game
tied for 5th in touchdowns
tied for 5th (with 5 others) with 40+ yard catches
41st in 1st down catches

That doesn't sound top 5 to me. Not sure it's top 10
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sporadic

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2009, 01:09:08 pm »
I would take Reggie Wayne and Hines Ward ahead of him too, attitude or not.



Hines Ward is a great teammate I'm sure...and I would LOVE to have him, but his presence does not break your passing game open.  He sure as hell has to be accounted for if you are a linebacker, though - keep your head on a swivel!  An argument sure as hell could be made for Reggie Wayne, though.  Pittsburgh's passing offense is heavily reliant on the run.  Even when they do not run well, they do not quit trying to do so...keeps linebackers honest which allows space in the secondary for guys like Ward (who is great at finding soft spots in zones and uses his body well in traffic, but is not going to be the kind of vertical threat the way TO is)

HudsonHawk

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #15 on: March 05, 2009, 01:10:14 pm »
what about marshall from Denver?

I'd probably take TO over Marshall.  TO is probably in the top 10, but he's not top 5. 

I am reminded of Chad Johnson's claims that he's the best receiver of all time.  I'm thinking "dude, you're not one of the 10 best playing this week..."
The rules of distinction were thrown out with the baseball cap.  It does not lend itself to protocol.  It is found today on youth in homes, classrooms, even in fine restaurants.  Regardless of its other consequences, this is a breach against civility.  A civilized man should avoid this mania.

sporadic

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #16 on: March 05, 2009, 01:10:22 pm »
what about marshall from Denver?

Too early to tell, and he is every bit as much a headcase as TO

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2009, 01:13:54 pm »
Hines Ward is a great teammate I'm sure...and I would LOVE to have him, but his presence does not break your passing game open.  He sure as hell has to be accounted for if you are a linebacker, though - keep your head on a swivel!  An argument sure as hell could be made for Reggie Wayne, though.  Pittsburgh's passing offense is heavily reliant on the run.  Even when they do not run well, they do not quit trying to do so...keeps linebackers honest which allows space in the secondary for guys like Ward (who is great at finding soft spots in zones and uses his body well in traffic, but is not going to be the kind of vertical threat the way TO is)

Ward is a personal choice for me.  I like Hines Ward a lot.  I think he brings a lot to the table, more than TO does.  I definitely take Wayne over TO.  TO does not change the way opponents think of your offense, despite what Cowboy fans think.  Perhaps that's partly Tony Romo.  I've never understood the awe expressed for Romo either.  Yes, he's better than Quincy Carter, but he ain't all that and a bag of chips like Cowboy fans think, either.
The rules of distinction were thrown out with the baseball cap.  It does not lend itself to protocol.  It is found today on youth in homes, classrooms, even in fine restaurants.  Regardless of its other consequences, this is a breach against civility.  A civilized man should avoid this mania.

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2009, 01:18:27 pm »
Ward is a personal choice for me.  I like Hines Ward a lot.  I think he brings a lot to the table, more than TO does.  I definitely take Wayne over TO.  TO does not change the way opponents think of your offense, despite what Cowboy fans think.  Perhaps that's partly Tony Romo.  I've never understood the awe expressed for Romo either.  Yes, he's better than Quincy Carter, but he ain't all that and a bag of chips like Cowboy fans think, either.

At least one Cowboys fan thinks he is a bag of chips.  Probably potato chips since they usually break pretty easy.
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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2009, 01:29:12 pm »
About time, no one knows the difference anymore anyway, to, too, two, it's confusing.  I think the kids are just using "2" nowdays.

sporadic

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #20 on: March 05, 2009, 01:40:14 pm »
Ward is a personal choice for me.  I like Hines Ward a lot.  I think he brings a lot to the table, more than TO does.  I definitely take Wayne over TO.  TO does not change the way opponents think of your offense, despite what Cowboy fans think.  Perhaps that's partly Tony Romo.  I've never understood the awe expressed for Romo either.  Yes, he's better than Quincy Carter, but he ain't all that and a bag of chips like Cowboy fans think, either.

He does bring a hell of a lot to the table...I like him too. Tough little MF'er.  Watching the games and the amount of attention that is given to TO leads me to disagree about the view of the offense.  I was perplexed how Garrett could not get guys like Crayton, Austin (who D's rarely put a saftey over the top of him when he was on the field with TO, despite his speed) and Bennett more involved when they were constantly facing rolled zones and soft man coverages - even after Williams arrived D's did not pay that much attention to him as they knew  Dallas had no idea how to utilize he and TO at the same time.  I like Wayne too, but he also has the benefit of the good Manning throwing to him.  Romo can be good, but his Favre-type decisions without Favre-type talent are going to make his shelf life very short if he continues down that road.  I do not view him as a Troy Aikman, more like a Danny White (way underrated in my book, although not able to win the big one, like Romo).  As far as the offense, they were hampered by an inexperienced OC that abandoned the running game too early and became pretty damned predictable.  The Cowboys chances of doing anything last year probably went down with Felix Jones...he and Barber made for one damn scary backfield.  Even when Chioice emerged as a quality back they had no home run threat to compliment him.

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #21 on: March 05, 2009, 01:59:48 pm »
He does bring a hell of a lot to the table...I like him too. Tough little MF'er.  Watching the games and the amount of attention that is given to TO leads me to disagree about the view of the offense.  I was perplexed how Garrett could not get guys like Crayton, Austin (who D's rarely put a saftey over the top of him when he was on the field with TO, despite his speed) and Bennett more involved when they were constantly facing rolled zones and soft man coverages - even after Williams arrived D's did not pay that much attention to him as they knew  Dallas had no idea how to utilize he and TO at the same time.  I like Wayne too, but he also has the benefit of the good Manning throwing to him.  Romo can be good, but his Favre-type decisions without Favre-type talent are going to make his shelf life very short if he continues down that road.  I do not view him as a Troy Aikman, more like a Danny White (way underrated in my book, although not able to win the big one, like Romo).  As far as the offense, they were hampered by an inexperienced OC that abandoned the running game too early and became pretty damned predictable.  The Cowboys chances of doing anything last year probably went down with Felix Jones...he and Barber made for one damn scary backfield.  Even when Chioice emerged as a quality back they had no home run threat to compliment him.





As a former, long-time Cowboy fan (I lost interest with the hiring of the jackass from OU), I take exception with the slighting of Danny White. I'm not accusing you of that Sporadic because you do refer to him as underrated. But you write that he did not win the big one which we all know is the SuperBowl. White could have, and would have, won at least one SB if the Cowboys had a dominant defense in his day as they did when Roger played. Danny may not have been Roger but he was damn good and plenty good enough to win a SB. The offense was not the problem during the Danny White years. 

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #22 on: March 05, 2009, 02:27:13 pm »
As a former, long-time Cowboy fan (I lost interest with the hiring of the jackass from OU), I take exception with the slighting of Danny White. I'm not accusing you of that Sporadic because you do refer to him as underrated. But you write that he did not win the big one which we all know is the SuperBowl. White could have, and would have, won at least one SB if the Cowboys had a dominant defense in his day as they did when Roger played. Danny may not have been Roger but he was damn good and plenty good enough to win a SB. The offense was not the problem during the Danny White years. 


A lot of guys are good enough to win with a dominant defense.  Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson are proof that you only have to be good enough not to step on your dick to win a Super Bowl, provided your defense is good enough to crush your opponent's spleen.
The rules of distinction were thrown out with the baseball cap.  It does not lend itself to protocol.  It is found today on youth in homes, classrooms, even in fine restaurants.  Regardless of its other consequences, this is a breach against civility.  A civilized man should avoid this mania.

juliogotay

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #23 on: March 05, 2009, 02:40:47 pm »

A lot of guys are good enough to win with a dominant defense.  Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson are proof that you only have to be good enough not to step on your dick to win a Super Bowl, provided your defense is good enough to crush your opponent's spleen.


Yes, that's proven. So the fuck what? Are you saying Dilfer and Johnson were in Danny White's class? If you are then you are sadly mistaken.

HudsonHawk

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #24 on: March 05, 2009, 03:27:40 pm »

Yes, that's proven. So the fuck what? Are you saying Dilfer and Johnson were in Danny White's class? If you are then you are sadly mistaken.

No, I'm saying that saying "he could have won a Super Bowl with a dominant defense" means exactly squat.
The rules of distinction were thrown out with the baseball cap.  It does not lend itself to protocol.  It is found today on youth in homes, classrooms, even in fine restaurants.  Regardless of its other consequences, this is a breach against civility.  A civilized man should avoid this mania.

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #25 on: March 05, 2009, 03:31:28 pm »
You're not a top 5 anything when you lead the league in drops. I don't care how many amazing catches you make, when you drop that many you're just a big a problem as you are a weapon.

Actually he didn't lead the league in drops. That dishonor goes to Braylon Edwards. In fact, Bowe and Marshall had more drops than TO, and even stud wideout Calvin Johnson had only one fewer dropped pass than Owens. On the other hand, all of those guys except Edwards had a much better reception percentage. Elite receivers are expected to catch more than 48.5% of their targets. Bad news for Cowboys fans (and Romo fantasy owners) is that Roy Williams was even worse last year (46%).

juliogotay

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #26 on: March 05, 2009, 05:20:15 pm »
No, I'm saying that saying "he could have won a Super Bowl with a dominant defense" means exactly squat.



The point I had hoped to make is that White was a pretty damn good QB...one of the best in the NFL during his peak years. His QB rating was 81 for his career compared to 83 for Staubach. His defense, while still full of big names, was aging and giving up alot more points than during the Doomsday II years of Staubach's career. I shouldn't have used "dominant defense" as a criterion. If White had simply had the same defensive performance that Staubach enjoyed, I am confident he would have had a championship.

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2009, 05:22:17 pm »


The point I had hoped to make is that White was a pretty damn good QB...one of the best in the NFL during his peak years. His QB rating was 81 for his career compared to 83 for Staubach. His defense, while still full of big names, was aging and giving up alot more points than during the Doomsday II years of Staubach's career. I shouldn't have used "dominant defense" as a criterion. If White had simply had the same defensive performance that Staubach enjoyed, I am confident he would have had a championship.

I used to love Danny White.
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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2009, 06:45:27 pm »
Actually he didn't lead the league in drops. That dishonor goes to Braylon Edwards. In fact, Bowe and Marshall had more drops than TO, and even stud wideout Calvin Johnson had only one fewer dropped pass than Owens. On the other hand, all of those guys except Edwards had a much better reception percentage. Elite receivers are expected to catch more than 48.5% of their targets. Bad news for Cowboys fans (and Romo fantasy owners) is that Roy Williams was even worse last year (46%).

2006 - 17, led the league.
2007 - 10, tied for 3rd.
2008 - 10, 4th.


Sorry that I exaggerated slightly. That is still fucking horrible though.
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SaltyParker

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2009, 09:00:44 pm »
White just didn't have it.  You could see it in his eyes behind the center when he was intimidated. He could rack up stats except when it really mattered.

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #30 on: March 06, 2009, 09:55:52 am »
White just didn't have it.  You could see it in his eyes behind the center when he was intimidated. He could rack up stats except when it really mattered.



White always had that crazy, wide-eyed look about him. Even when he had a microphone in his face doing a post-game interview he looked excited. Was he intimidated by the interviewer? I don't think so.All good QB's rack up stats against mediocre teams....that's what good QB's do against bad teams.  In the 1981 NFC championship game played in San Francisco (The "catch" game) White had led the Cowboys to a lead when the 49er's drove from their own 11 yard-line with four minutes to play before Montana hit Clark with the catch. In the last minute, White had the 'boys coming back and hit Drew Pearson on a post and he was only caught by the shirttail by the defender Wright or he may have scored then and we would have forgotten about the catch. Unfortunately on the next play White was sacked and fumbled and SF recovered. Intimadated? A choker? I don't think so. That game was the passing of the torch from the Cowboys to the 49ers being the dominant NFC team for the next decade. White's biggest flaw was not being Roger Staubach.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2009, 09:57:23 am by juliogotay »

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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #31 on: March 07, 2009, 08:03:58 am »
For all his faults, TO doesn't deserve to be lumped in with Brandon Marshall.  TO has never been arrested while Marshall is working on a nice rap sheet and is close to being suspended for a year.
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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #32 on: March 07, 2009, 12:49:15 pm »
Owens is a player of great talent, both on the field and for calling attention to himself. He's in the twilight of his career, and the Cowboys obviously decided that his talent for the former is now exceeded by his talent for the latter.
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Re: TO, good riddance?
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2009, 08:08:01 pm »
Well, TO does sometimes get the stone hands and seems like he's punching the ball instead of trying to catch it, but I think his high number of drops is also due to the fact he's targeted a lot.  But he was still one of the best offensive weapons the Cowboys have ever had.  I think he has lost a step though.  Still can warrant a double team, but can't necessarily get open when he does get one.

All in all, people probably won't have much beef with the move since he was potentially going to finally explode and verbally vomit on one of his teammates.  Kind of have to feel bad for the guy though.. Buffalo?  Damn, that sucks.  He did get a good payday though, hard to feel too sorry for him.
Today seems like a good day to burn a bridge or two