Purpura makes free-agent offers

[Browneye]

GM won't name two targets, denies talk about relievers

Purpura did make the club's first two contract offers to free agents Wednesday night; he declined to identify the players. He also stayed active on the trade front, where center fielder Willy Taveras and utility man Chris Burke are coveted by several teams.

The Link

Any guess on who the two are?
 
Lee and Soriano
Lee and Williams
Lee and JimR (has a ranch near Houston)

[Bench]

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GM won't name two targets, denies talk about relievers

Purpura did make the club's first two contract offers to free agents Wednesday night; he declined to identify the players. He also stayed active on the trade front, where center fielder Willy Taveras and utility man Chris Burke are coveted by several teams.

The Link

Any guess on who the two are?
 
Lee and Soriano
Lee and Williams
Lee and JimR (has a ranch near Houston)

On KTRH this morning the sports reporter (Ted DeLuca?) said an offer had been made to Woody Williams.

[MRaup]

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JimR (has a ranch near Houston)

You know... I actually AM left handed. I'm feeling left out in these pitching discussions.

[Arky Vaughan]

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You know... I actually AM left handed. I'm feeling left out in these pitching discussions.

Is your current employer soliciting bids for the right to negotiate for your services?

[austro]

Taking bids?  His current employer might pay other people to negotiate for his services.  But he's a first baseman; everybody knows they're rag-arms.

[Browneye]

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GM won't name two targets, denies talk about relievers

Purpura did make the club's first two contract offers to free agents Wednesday night; he declined to identify the players. He also stayed active on the trade front, where center fielder Willy Taveras and utility man Chris Burke are coveted by several teams.

The Link

Any guess on who the two are?
 
Lee and Soriano
Lee and Williams
Lee and JimR (has a ranch near Houston)

On KTRH this morning the sports reporter (Ted DeLuca?) said an offer had been made to Woody Williams.

I would really like that move. If Clemens and Pettitte return, that would make it one outstanding rotation.

[MRaup]

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Taking bids?  His current employer might pay other people to negotiate for his services.  But he's a first baseman; everybody knows they're rag-arms.

Once upon a time, I had a big-league curveball. And I'm pretty sure I can throw 50 miles an hour, just like Wandy.

[Browneye]

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Taking bids?  His current employer might pay other people to negotiate for his services.  But he's a first baseman; everybody knows they're rag-arms.

Once upon a time, I had a big-league curveball. And I'm pretty sure I can throw 50 miles an hour, just like Wandy.

Well heck, that has to be worth a couple of mill in todays big league market.

[BudGirl]

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Taking bids?  His current employer might pay other people to negotiate for his services.  But he's a first baseman; everybody knows they're rag-arms.

Once upon a time, I had a big-league curveball. And I'm pretty sure I can throw 50 miles an hour, just like Wandy.

How well do you hit for power?

[Arky Vaughan]

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How well do you hit for power?

And how does he look in a bikini?

[MRaup]

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How well do you hit for power?

And how does he look in a bikini?

Well, in our slowpitch softball game Tuesday I hit a triple and 2 doubles, but I'd say I have more pop than power.

And I need some warning before the bikini answer... Its not bikini season yet!

[JaneDoe]

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How well do you hit for power?

And how does he look in a bikini?

Well, in our slowpitch softball game Tuesday I hit a triple and 2 doubles, but I'd say I have more pop than power.

And I need some warning before the bikini answer... Its not bikini season yet!

Ok, how about a thong? They are always in season.

[Ty in Tampa]

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Ok, how about a thong? They are always in season.

MY BRRAAAAAAIIIIN!!!!,  MYYYYY BRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIN!!!!!!!!

[BudGirl]

There is never too much information on this board.  Never.

[Arky Vaughan]

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Ok, how about a thong? They are always in season.

Or never in season.

[Phil_in_CS]

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Ok, how about a thong? They are always in season.

Or never in season.

some pieces of clothing should only be made in certain sizes. Maximum for these should be say, a 5.

[homer]

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GM won't name two targets, denies talk about relievers

Purpura did make the club's first two contract offers to free agents Wednesday night; he declined to identify the players. He also stayed active on the trade front, where center fielder Willy Taveras and utility man Chris Burke are coveted by several teams.

The Link

Any guess on who the two are?
 
Lee and Soriano
Lee and Williams
Lee and JimR (has a ranch near Houston)

Astros belived to have and Purp doesn't deny making offers to both Lee and Soriano.

The Link

[Tralfaz]

In an interview this afternoon on 1300 The Zone. The BB insider from Baseball Perspectus (don't know) said the word today at the winter meetings is that the Cubs have offered Soriano "Beltran" type money.

[Alkie]

And again, there's ZERO correlation between having one of "those" type of players and getting a fucking ring.

Of the 25 highest salaried players in MLB this season (2006), a total of 3 of them have a ring with the team that signed them to the current contract (or contract that has been extended).  

In fact, only 7 of those 25 players has a ring, period.  

This isn't about rings-make-you-better, it's about do-these-type-players-bring-rings.  

So, of the 25 best paid players as of this season, only 3 helped bring a ring to the current team/contract and of the 25 highest salaried players as of this year, only 7 of them helped their team get a ring at ANY point in their career.

That doesn't sound any more helpful than, say, signing Jeff Conine or Craig Counsell.

I don't think this is news: high paid players don't equal rings.

That being said, you have to spend SOME money, but I feel uneasy reading about the offers we're making to Soriano and Lee.  When all is said and done and Andy 'n' Roger's Ragtime Band decides to hang it up, we're going to be the Texas Fucking Rangers.  

This just brings me back to my original point: we need pitchers a hell of a lot more than we need some outrageously overpaid position players that no one was really all that high on anyway until they realized how crappy this year's FA season is.

I'll give you that Zito would be great, but not at what he's asking, but we've GOT to address the pitching before we even think about what the offense is doing.  This team ain't going anywhere with Wandy and Mark Raup starting every 4th and 5th day.

[JimR]

absolutely.

[Alkie]

To which point?  Are you being sarcastic?  Am I being stalked?

ETA: By the way, I've totally come around on Huff.  We MUST re-sign him.  He is likely to put up about 90-95% of Lee's number (just based on the last 4 seasons) at half the price, allowing us to spend more on pitching.

Plus it takes care of the 3B situation.  

If we sign Lee or Soriano, it should be partly because it means we can add Luke Scott's name to the list of people we can trade for a real starting pitcher.

There's nothing wrong with a team that has Lee OR Soriano, Huff, and Berkman hitting 3/4/5 in any order (I don't care who the fuck is hitting 7th or 8th, so if you bring that up, expect to be ignored) AS LONG AS we trade for/sign 3 truly solid pitchers.  Jeff Weaver doesn't count.  Jeff Suppan does.

[JimR]

pitching uber alles

[Limey]

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pitching uber alles

Even the MTV generation, with their short...ummm...what?

Anyway, the recent Astros seasons have shown that pitching is the key.  Even with horrendous offensive struggles in 2006, they came within a game of chasing down the Champs.

Contrast 2000, when the club could mash but couldn't pitch, they were done by the ASB.

[Alkie]

Right.  But I know I've already brought this up a few times and we've all agreed pitching, pitching, pitching, but the whole deals-to-Lee-and-Soriano last night really scare me.

If we sign one of them, Huff should be the only other starting position player we discuss the rest of the offseason.  

I think some of you guys need to get used to the idea of Pence, Patton, Hirsh, and the rest of the top prospects being shipped off for top of the rotation starters who can play now in the majors.

I still just can't shake the fact that Lee and Soriano aren't the answer.  No matter what Schlum says.

[Trey]

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Right.  But I know I've already brought this up a few times and we've all agreed pitching, pitching, pitching, but the whole deals-to-Lee-and-Soriano last night really scare me.

If we sign one of them, Huff should be the only other starting position player we discuss the rest of the offseason.  

I think some of you guys need to get used to the idea of Pence, Patton, Hirsh, and the rest of the top prospects being shipped off for top of the rotation starters who can play now in the majors.

I still just can't shake the fact that Lee and Soriano aren't the answer.  No matter what Schlum says.

If Roger and Andy don't come back, like you said, the Astros are pretty much screwed for 07.  Barring us signing Zito and Schmidt, Ensberg returning to odd year form, and Luke Scott maintaining Hobbsian level for a whole year, that is.

Who's available next year?  What if you use this year to see what you got.  Which Buchholz (why can I STILL not spell his name?) is going to show up?  How good of a MLB pitcher is Hirsh?  Is Burke the future at 2B?

ETA: The whole division sucks balls, anyway, so you might just win it without going crazy.  If so, you pick up someone(s) midseason.

[Taras Bulba]

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Right.  But I know I've already brought this up a few times and we've all agreed pitching, pitching, pitching, but the whole deals-to-Lee-and-Soriano last night really scare me.

If we sign one of them, Huff should be the only other starting position player we discuss the rest of the offseason.  

I think some of you guys need to get used to the idea of Pence, Patton, Hirsh, and the rest of the top prospects being shipped off for top of the rotation starters who can play now in the majors.

I still just can't shake the fact that Lee and Soriano aren't the answer.  No matter what Schlum says.

I would be surprised if Houston forgets the primacy of pitching.  Having said that, it is apparent that they do not want to have a repeat of last season's punchless lineup and are going to do something about it.

[Limey]

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I still just can't shake the fact that Lee and Soriano aren't the answer.  No matter what Schlum says.

Lee's reported weight issues really concern me.  If's he prepared to let himself go in a walk year, then what's he going to do once he's made countless generations of Lees to come financially secure?

Soriano strikes me as a prima donna, and I worry that there is no longer a strong positive presence in the Astros' clubhouse to cure him of his prickitude, or at least suppress it while he's here (a bit like Dexter: have him channel his evil tendencies for good).

Meanwhile, the pitching needs some cash to fill in some rather large holes.  I know where I'd spend mine.

[Alkie]

No, that IS obvious (about not being punchless), the problem is we just lost 40% of our rotation, in fact 2 of the 3 GREAT pitchers we had.  

Not-being-punchless will be irrelevant.

I'll be honest, I'd rather lose 1-0 every night than lose 10-8 every night.  Boooooooooooooring.

I'm up for taking a flyer on Mulder.  What about Glavine?  Money talks, get Schmidt (I don't care where his ranch is).  What do the Padres really want for Peavy?  What do the Rox really want for Jennings?  This can be done.

[Trey]

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No, that IS obvious (about not being punchless), the problem is we just lost 40% of our rotation, in fact 2 of the 3 GREAT pitchers we had.  

Not-being-punchless will be irrelevant.

I'll be honest, I'd rather lose 1-0 every night than lose 10-8 every night.  Boooooooooooooring.

I'm up for taking a flyer on Mulder.  What about Glavine?  Money talks, get Schmidt (I don't care where his ranch is).  What do the Padres really want for Peavy?  What do the Rox really want for Jennings?  This can be done.

40%, while factually accurate, is an understatement.  We lost about 60% of our rotation.  This was after losing Backe already.

[pravata]

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... By the way, I've totally come around on Huff.  We MUST re-sign him. ...

Huff might be getting a little nervous.  Teams that need a 3b, Phillies signed Helms, very reasonably, Tampa Bay won the bid to negotiate with a Japanese 3b, Padres traded a very good 2b for a rookie that they are seriously saying they'll play at 3d.  Doesnt appear that anyone was impressed with Huff at 3d for their team.  

As for Buchholz, Hirsh, and Patton, those kinds of guys have to work out.  One or two of them anyway.  I can't think of many teams, not in NY or Boston, who buy their entire rotation.

[HPFRic]

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No, that IS obvious (about not being punchless), the problem is we just lost 40% of our rotation, in fact 2 of the 3 GREAT pitchers we had.

by that same token, you could bring pettitte and clemens back and have... well, the 2006 astros. they HAVE to add a significant stick.

besides, the 04 astros came within a game of the world series with munro, redding, miller and duckworth+hernandez all getting at least the same # of starts as pettitte did that year.

i'm not saying pitching isn't important, just that hirsh and woody williams, while not clemens and pettitte, obviously, should be OK if we add the stick and the pen bounces back.

[Alkie]

Oh, I agree.  I'd love to see Hirsh, Patton, and Buchholz live up to expectation, but the odds are no more that they will than they won't.  I mean, really, how many Grade A Pitching Prospects actually become #1s or #2s?  Not that many.  

Buchholz has shown he has great stuff but no goddamn idea how to use it in a MLB game yet.  Hirsh started to look much better as the year wore on, but obviously, he needs time.  We can't count on Hirsh and Buchholz to be quality solid starters this year.  It's just not reasonable.  

It would be my preference to trade Burke and Scott (say we sign Lee) to someone for a true #2 or #3 (not Jennings).  Scott and Ensberg for Peavy?  Is that enough?  Too much?

How much does Glavine want, by the way?

[Arky Vaughan]

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As for Buchholz, Hirsh, and Patton, those kinds of guys have to work out.  One or two of them anyway.  I can't think of many teams, not in NY or Boston, who buy their entire rotation.

This is key. In addition to the other things discussed here, an ingredient for successful teams is getting contributions from new faces. In 2005 it was Backe and the guys in the bullpen. The 2007 Astros are going to need some of the blue chips to step up even if Clemens and Pettitte return and they sign a veteran starter.

[Arky Vaughan]

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by that same token, you could bring pettitte and clemens back and have... well, the 2006 astros. they HAVE to add a significant stick.

besides, the 04 astros came within a game of the world series with munro, redding, miller and duckworth+hernandez all getting at least the same # of starts as pettitte did that year.

i'm not saying pitching isn't important, just that hirsh and woody williams, while not clemens and pettitte, obviously, should be OK if we add the stick and the pen bounces back.

A rotation of Oswalt, Pettitte, Clemens, Williams and [insert name here] would be very nice.

[Arky Vaughan]

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Scott and Ensberg for Peavy?  Is that enough?  Too much?

I can't see the Padres going for that.

[Alkie]

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A rotation of Oswalt, Pettitte, Clemens, Williams and [insert name here] would be very nice.

Oh, that would be great.  But I think you're assuming a lot there.

If Andy and Roger would get off their fucking asses and stop playing this game and just re-sign, sure, go ahead and spend the cash on Caballo and Soriano if you got it.

I'll go to war with RoyAndyRogerWoodyRaup.

[HPFRic]

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Hirsh started to look much better as the year wore on, but obviously, he needs time.

this has been hirsh's MO; slow starts before going batshit great on a new league. i don't think expecting him to be a solid #3, at the very least, is outlandish.

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It would be my preference to trade Burke and Scott (say we sign Lee) to someone for a true #2 or #3 (not Jennings).  Scott and Ensberg for Peavy?  Is that enough?  Too much?

i would very nearly put burke in the untouchable camp. i sure as hell wouldn't advocate trading (based on '06) two productive bats for a pitcher.

ensberg's fair game; too widly inconsistent to be counted on. if he finds it elsewhere, so be it. i think adding/resigning lee, huff and williams would be a great offseason.

[BudGirl]

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Scott and Ensberg for Peavy?  Is that enough?  Too much?

I don't think that is enough.  I think they would want at least one pitcher included with those two you mentioned.

[HPFRic]

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How much does Glavine want, by the way?

footer said in her latest column that glavine prefers NY or a return to ATL very nearly exclusively.

i don't like the idea of chasing 40+ year olds with the idea of them being #2 starters. i'd rather see hirsh, et al, get their shot. the exception is williams (and clemens, of course). woddy likely won't command top of the rotation money and would be a solid (and likely content) 3-4 starter.

[S.P. Rodriguez]

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Right.  But I know I've already brought this up a few times and we've all agreed pitching, pitching, pitching, but the whole deals-to-Lee-and-Soriano last night really scare me.

If we sign one of them, Huff should be the only other starting position player we discuss the rest of the offseason.  

I think some of you guys need to get used to the idea of Pence, Patton, Hirsh, and the rest of the top prospects being shipped off for top of the rotation starters who can play now in the majors.

I still just can't shake the fact that Lee and Soriano aren't the answer.  No matter what Schlum says.

I would be surprised if Houston forgets the primacy of pitching.  Having said that, it is apparent that they do not want to have a repeat of last season's punchless lineup and are going to do something about it.

It's not a matter of forgetting the primacy of pitching.  Purpura is quoted as recognizing that very issue.  However, point to one pitcher on this market who's worth the money numbers being thrown around?  Schmidt - 4 yrs at 12-14mil/yr, Zito 7yrs at 15milyr, Padilla 4 yrs at 10mil/yr, and the list doesn't improve.  The better FA market, from a buyer's perspective, is for position players.  If there were better pitching FA candidates, I'd be all for going after more than the fringe options, i.e. Woody Williams and Kim Wells.

As of now, I'm good with Houston going after Lee, re-signing Huff, and trying to land Williams and/or Wells.  Both Williams and Wells are insurance policies if Clemens and Pettitte decide to not pitch next season.  Do I think that happens?  No, I think Houston signs Lee, Huff, and Williams and Pettitte and Clemens decide to be magnanimous and grace us with one, maybe 2 in Pettitte's case, more season.  Houston will make "special exceptions", a la Clemens, for both Pettitte and Clemens because, gosh darnit, they mean so much to the city (in other words: ticket sales).  The Grocer wasn't born yesterday.  You don't hit 3million in attendance with a rotation of Oswalt and 4 rookie/young'uns.  You don't retain Clemens and Oswalt with a lineup that touts Maybeline  with no protection other than Sybil and a 28 yr old with less than a full yr's worth of experience (Scott).

[BudGirl]

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Hirsh started to look much better as the year wore on, but obviously, he needs time.

this has been hirsh's MO; slow starts before going batshit great on a new league. i don't think expecting him to be a solid #3, at the very least, is outlandish.

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It would be my preference to trade Burke and Scott (say we sign Lee) to someone for a true #2 or #3 (not Jennings).  Scott and Ensberg for Peavy?  Is that enough?  Too much?

i would very nearly put burke in the untouchable camp. i sure as hell wouldn't advocate trading (based on '06) two productive bats for a pitcher.

ensberg's fair game; too widly inconsistent to be counted on. if he finds it elsewhere, so be it. i think adding/resigning lee, huff and williams would be a great offseason.

Burke in the untouchable camp?  No way.

[Arky Vaughan]

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Burke in the untouchable camp?  No way.

What would Bradley think of you saying this?

[BudGirl]

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Burke in the untouchable camp?  No way.

What would Bradley think of you saying this?

He wouldn't care.  Bradley loves me, he just doesn't know it.

[VirtualBob]

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Ok, how about a thong? They are always in season.

Or never in season.

some pieces of clothing should only be made in certain sizes. Maximum for these should be say, a 5.

I agree.  Even roads are load-zoned.

[Froback]

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It would be my preference to trade Burke and Scott (say we sign Lee) to someone for a true #2 or #3 (not Jennings).  Scott and Ensberg for Peavy?  Is that enough?  Too much?

How much does Glavine want, by the way?

I would agree strongly with this, but I would look to trade Scott and Ensberg for either part of the Vernon Wells package (I really like what he brings). If a deal can be made to get Wells, I would be for trading away Taveras too, but only in the right deal.  I would look to either trade for Peavy or sign Schmidt.  If Taveras is traded away I would look for acquiring a decent Corner OFer, with Wells manning CF and planning on Pence playing one of the Corner OF spots.

Hypothetical: Trade Scott, Buchholz, Wandy (it could happen), Josh Anderson for Wells.  Trade Ensberg, Burke, Albers for Peavy.

Then I would re-sign Pettitte and get Clemens at mid-season.  Oddly enough I see Clemens return more likely than Pettitte.

So you then have a staff of:
Roy
Schmidt/Peavy
Pettitte
Clemens
Hirsh (Albers standing in for Roger till mid-season)

Then the line-up would be:

C: Ausmus, Gimenez
1B: Berkman
2B: Biggio
3B: Huff (I forgot to mention re-signing him)
SS: Everett
LF: Pence/FA/Trade
CF: Wells
RF: Taveras/FA/Trade/Pence

That looks like a good team to me.  Killer pitching, and you don't lose any in the bullpen.  And a vastly improved offense.  BTW, I would have Wells batting #2 and Berkman #3 in this line-up with either Taveras(if around)/Biggio/FA/Everett leading off.

But this is very wild ass and who knows what will happen, but this is what I would like to see go down.  Re-sign Huff, Pettitte, Clemens. Trade for Wells. Try to trade for Peavy or sign Schmidt (one of a must).  Then either trade for an OFer if Taveras had to move one, or stick with the team you have then.

[Arky Vaughan]

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I would agree strongly with this, but I would look to trade Scott and Ensberg for either part of the Vernon Wells package (I really like what he brings). If a deal can be made to get Wells, I would be for trading away Taveras too, but only in the right deal.  I would look to either trade for Peavy or sign Schmidt.  If Taveras is traded away I would look for acquiring a decent Corner OFer, with Wells manning CF and planning on Pence playing one of the Corner OF spots.

Hypothetical: Trade Scott, Buchholz, Wandy (it could happen), Josh Anderson for Wells.  Trade Ensberg, Burke, Albers for Peavy.

Then I would re-sign Pettitte and get Clemens at mid-season.  Oddly enough I see Clemens return more likely than Pettitte.

So you then have a staff of:
Roy
Schmidt/Peavy
Pettitte
Clemens
Hirsh (Albers standing in for Roger till mid-season)

Then the line-up would be:

C: Ausmus, Gimenez
1B: Berkman
2B: Biggio
3B: Huff (I forgot to mention re-signing him)
SS: Everett
LF: Pence/FA/Trade
CF: Wells
RF: Taveras/FA/Trade/Pence

That looks like a good team to me.  Killer pitching, and you don't lose any in the bullpen.  And a vastly improved offense.  BTW, I would have Wells batting #2 and Berkman #3 in this line-up with either Taveras(if around)/Biggio/FA/Everett leading off.

But this is very wild ass and who knows what will happen, but this is what I would like to see go down.  Re-sign Huff, Pettitte, Clemens. Trade for Wells. Try to trade for Peavy or sign Schmidt (one of a must).  Then either trade for an OFer if Taveras had to move one, or stick with the team you have then.

Hypothetically, I wonder if Babe Ruth is available via time machine, and whether there is an elixir that will bring Walter Johnson back to life. I think there would be a lot of potential for the 2007 Astros with Ruth in the outfield and Johnson in the rotation.

[Golden Sombrero]

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Hypothetically, I wonder if Babe Ruth is available via time machine, and whether there is an elixir that will bring Walter Johnson back to life. I think there would be a lot of potential for the 2007 Astros with Ruth in the outfield and Johnson in the rotation.

I'd like to use the time machine to go into the future and bring back the stars who are yet to be.  Just think--getting the catcher Zarathustra Perkins from the year 2011, or the pitcher Trajan Holmes from 2022, and maybe even the coveted short stop Parsifal F. Rosenkavalier from the Mars City Warlords from 2368.

[HPFRic]

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Trade... Wandy (it could happen)

fans having to temporarily shelve their disappointment/hatred for a player's performance long enough to try and pass them off as still viable commodities in order to propose outlandishly impossible trade scenarios has become one of the most enjoyable aspects of any ML offseason...

[Arky Vaughan]

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Hypothetical: Trade Scott, Buchholz, Wandy (it could happen), Josh Anderson for Wells.  Trade Ensberg, Burke, Albers for Peavy.

I think the time travel is more likely than these outlandish suggestions. Question: if they were possible, do you think Purpura might have done them by now?

[Browneye]

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Hypothetically, I wonder if Babe Ruth is available via time machine, and whether there is an elixir that will bring Walter Johnson back to life. I think there would be a lot of potential for the 2007 Astros with Ruth in the outfield and Johnson in the rotation.

I'd like to use the time machine to go into the future and bring back the stars who are yet to be.  Just think--getting the catcher Zarathustra Perkins from the year 2011, or the pitcher Trajan Holmes from 2022, and maybe even the coveted short stop Parsifal F. Rosenkavalier from the Mars City Warlords from 2368.

What about the stud closer from The Island of Misfit Toys. Doesnt he buy a ranch near Houston after arbitration?

[Golden Sombrero]

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Hypothetically, I wonder if Babe Ruth is available via time machine, and whether there is an elixir that will bring Walter Johnson back to life. I think there would be a lot of potential for the 2007 Astros with Ruth in the outfield and Johnson in the rotation.

I'd like to use the time machine to go into the future and bring back the stars who are yet to be.  Just think--getting the catcher Zarathustra Perkins from the year 2011, or the pitcher Trajan Holmes from 2022, and maybe even the coveted short stop Parsifal F. Rosenkavalier from the Mars City Warlords from 2368.

What about the stud closer from The Island of Misfit Toys. Doesnt he buy a ranch near Houston after arbitration?

I believe so--the only problem is, being a misfit, he leaned his mechanics from watching Lidge pitch in 2006.

[JimR]

i want some of whatever you're drinking. you have outdone todd.

[Gizzmonic]

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Hypothetical: Trade Scott, Buchholz, Wandy (it could happen), Josh Anderson for Wells.  Trade Ensberg, Burke, Albers for Peavy.

Then I would re-sign Pettitte and get Clemens at mid-season.  Oddly enough I see Clemens return more likely than Pettitte.

So you then have a staff of:
Roy
Schmidt/Peavy
Pettitte
Clemens
Hirsh (Albers standing in for Roger till mid-season)

Tough for Albers to stand in if he's wearing a Padres uniform.  But whatever, it's not like Peavy is going anywhere, except to CVS to stock up on more Icy Hot.

[Jose Cruz III]

If I was gonna throw away money, I would throw it at Lee/Soriano and Schmidt. I would do it quick and then bring in Huff, Pettitte, and Rajah for a sitdown to take care of my own. If I did anything else I would go after Woody.

We then would have a staff of :
Oswalt
Schmidt
Pettitte
Woody
Bucholz/Albers/Hirsh

Clemens could come in at the mid year if he wanted and take a spot in the rotation. I could live with that.

Our lineup would be:

C - BG'sF
1b - Berkman
2b - Biggio/Burke
SS - Everett
3b - Lamb
LF - Lee/Soriano
CF - Willy
Rf - Huff

That would leave Scott, Willy, and a pitcher or two to pursue the whole Vernon Wells thing. But there is no way I give Toronto anything until Wells name is on at least a 4 year contract. But the reports are that Toronto wants a shortstop included in the package for Wells.

[Arky Vaughan]

Quote:
If I was gonna throw away money, I would throw it at Lee/Soriano and Schmidt. I would do it quick and then bring in Huff, Pettitte, and Rajah for a sitdown to take care of my own. If I did anything else I would go after Woody.

We then would have a staff of :
Oswalt
Schmidt
Pettitte
Woody
Bucholz/Albers/Hirsh

Clemens could come in at the mid year if he wanted and take a spot in the rotation. I could live with that.

Our lineup would be:

C - BG'sF
1b - Berkman
2b - Biggio/Burke
SS - Everett
3b - Lamb
LF - Lee/Soriano
CF - Willy
Rf - Huff

That would leave Scott, Willy, and a pitcher or two to pursue the whole Vernon Wells thing. But there is no way I give Toronto anything until Wells name is on at least a 4 year contract. But the reports are that Toronto wants a shortstop included in the package for Wells.

While they're at it, why don't they just get Jeff Bagwell's shoulder patched up using special alien medical technology and put him at third base?

[Jose Cruz III]

Quote:

Quote:
If I was gonna throw away money, I would throw it at Lee/Soriano and Schmidt. I would do it quick and then bring in Huff, Pettitte, and Rajah for a sitdown to take care of my own. If I did anything else I would go after Woody.

We then would have a staff of :
Oswalt
Schmidt
Pettitte
Woody
Bucholz/Albers/Hirsh

Clemens could come in at the mid year if he wanted and take a spot in the rotation. I could live with that.

Our lineup would be:

C - BG'sF
1b - Berkman
2b - Biggio/Burke
SS - Everett
3b - Lamb
LF - Lee/Soriano
CF - Willy
Rf - Huff

That would leave Scott, Willy, and a pitcher or two to pursue the whole Vernon Wells thing. But there is no way I give Toronto anything until Wells name is on at least a 4 year contract. But the reports are that Toronto wants a shortstop included in the package for Wells.

While they're at it, why don't they just get Jeff Bagwell's shoulder patched up using special alien medical technology and put him at third base?

I'm not sure what I said that was so outlandish as you suggest. The management has made it clear they intend to spend some money with all of the reported offers they have made. So why would it be out of the question to re-sign their own and add a couple of pitchers, one who has reportedly said he wanted to play here, and a hitter who reportedly wants to play here also? The pieces would then be in place to explore the trade market. If you can make a trade, fine. If not, the bench is even deeper.

If you are referring to Lamb playing 3rd, I don't think he is all that bad there. Granted he is not Brooks Robinson, but he is not gonna commit 25 errors over there either. I have seen him play well at 3rd.

[Arky Vaughan]

Quote:
I'm not sure what I said that was so outlandish as you suggest. The management has made it clear they intend to spend some money with all of the reported offers they have made. So why would it be out of the question to re-sign their own and add a couple of pitchers, one who has reportedly said he wanted to play here, and a hitter who reportedly wants to play here also? The pieces would then be in place to explore the trade market. If you can make a trade, fine. If not, the bench is even deeper.

If you are referring to Lamb playing 3rd, I don't think he is all that bad there. Granted he is not Brooks Robinson, but he is not gonna commit 25 errors over there either. I have seen him play well at 3rd.

I wasn't referring to Lamb at third. You're taking me much too literally. I was trying to think of something as outlandish as your suggestions collectively are. Just because they've made multiple offers does not mean they expect all those offers to be accepted. To the contrary, the purpose is to put several lines in the water and see which ones bite.

You've got a series of events that, although a few may come to pass, are extremely unlikely all to occur.

1) Sign Schmidt
2) Sign Williams
3) Sign Lee or Soriano
4) Re-sign Pettitte
5) Re-sign Clemens
6) Re-sign Huff
7) Acquire Wells

It's as if the Astros are operating in a universe where there are no other teams to compete with for these players and no payroll constraints. If they sign Lee or Soriano, how are they going to afford to sign Schmidt? And then re-sign Pettitte and Clemens? And don't you think that if they're fortunate enough to land one of the best hitters on the market, it's not all that probable that they'll also be able to land one of the best pitchers on the market, by sheer circumstances of there being a dozen or more other teams trying to sign them too? What would the Blue Jays have to be smoking to trade Wells for Taveras and Scott plus prospect pitching? For a team that just opened the vault for Frank Thomas? Scott may not be in as great a demand as you believe.


Again, it's not that I think a few of those things might occur. But all or most of them? In order of likelihood I'd rank them as follows:

1) Re-sign Huff
2) Sign Williams
3) Re-sign Pettitte
4) Re-sign Clemens
5) Sign Lee or Soriano
6) Sign Schmidt
7) Acquire Wells

At most I can see four or those seven happening together. Maybe five if virtually everything breaks their way. Reading rumors in the newspaper does not increase the chances of fairy tales coming true.

[CarolinaStro]

Quote:

Quote:
I'm not sure what I said that was so outlandish as you suggest. The management has made it clear they intend to spend some money with all of the reported offers they have made. So why would it be out of the question to re-sign their own and add a couple of pitchers, one who has reportedly said he wanted to play here, and a hitter who reportedly wants to play here also? The pieces would then be in place to explore the trade market. If you can make a trade, fine. If not, the bench is even deeper.

If you are referring to Lamb playing 3rd, I don't think he is all that bad there. Granted he is not Brooks Robinson, but he is not gonna commit 25 errors over there either. I have seen him play well at 3rd.

I wasn't referring to Lamb at third. You're taking me much too literally. I was trying to think of something as outlandish as your suggestions collectively are. Just because they've made multiple offers does not mean they expect all those offers to be accepted. To the contrary, the purpose is to put several lines in the water and see which ones bite.

You've got a series of events that, although a few may come to pass, are extremely unlikely all to occur.

1) Sign Schmidt
2) Sign Williams
3) Sign Lee or Soriano
4) Re-sign Pettitte
5) Re-sign Clemens
6) Re-sign Huff
7) Acquire Wells

It's as if the Astros are operating in a universe where there are no other teams to compete with for these players and no payroll constraints. If they sign Lee or Soriano, how are they going to afford to sign Schmidt? And then re-sign Pettitte and Clemens? And don't you think that if they're fortunate enough to land one of the best hitters on the market, it's not all that probable that they'll also be able to land one of the best pitchers on the market, by sheer circumstances of there being a dozen or more other teams trying to sign them too? What would the Blue Jays have to be smoking to trade Wells for Taveras and Scott plus prospect pitching? For a team that just opened the vault for Frank Thomas? Scott may not be in as great a demand as you believe.


Again, it's not that I think a few of those things might occur. But all or most of them? In order of likelihood I'd rank them as follows:

1) Re-sign Huff
2) Sign Williams
3) Re-sign Pettitte
4) Re-sign Clemens
5) Sign Lee or Soriano
6) Sign Schmidt
7) Acquire Wells

At most I can see four or those seven happening together. Maybe five if virtually everything breaks their way. Reading rumors in the newspaper does not increase the chances of fairy tales coming true.

It seems to me the offseason hinges on two things:

1) For the offense, it starts with Lee (I think we have an almost zero chance with Soriano).  If Lee is an Astro by the first week in December, then I do NOT think Huff is resigned and they will go with Mo at 3B and Scotty at the other corner OF spot.  I think they love what they saw from Taveras in the 2nd half and will keep him.  Now if they fail to sign Lee, then it is wide open and they will probably go the trade route or mix & match lower tier FAs like Huff.

2) Pitching is obviously a bit trickier.  Pettitte is the key and hence the problem since he may delay his decision until February.  Purpura may have a better sense of Andy's final decision which will help him decide who and how many of the Woody/Wells/et al group to bring in to the fold.  A Roy/Andy/Hirsch/Woody or Wells/Albers or Sampson rotation would be competitive with a strong year from the bullpen.  Of course, the Rajah factor is always there.

[Arky Vaughan]

Quote:
It seems to me the offseason hinges on two things:

1) For the offense, it starts with Lee (I think we have an almost zero chance with Soriano).  If Lee is an Astro by the first week in December, then I do NOT think Huff is resigned and they will go with Mo at 3B and Scotty at the other corner OF spot.  I think they love what they saw from Taveras in the 2nd half and will keep him.  Now if they fail to sign Lee, then it is wide open and they will probably go the trade route or mix & match lower tier FAs like Huff.

2) Pitching is obviously a bit trickier.  Pettitte is the key and hence the problem since he may delay his decision until February.  Purpura may have a better sense of Andy's final decision which will help him decide who and how many of the Woody/Wells/et al group to bring in to the fold.  A Roy/Andy/Hirsch/Woody or Wells/Albers or Sampson rotation would be competitive with a strong year from the bullpen.  Of course, the Rajah factor is always there.

I think a best-case scenario, and one that is not terribly likely, is that they sign Lee, re-sign Huff, sign Williams and re-sign Pettitte and Clemens. That would leave them with:

C Ausmus
1B Berkman
2B Biggio
3B Huff
SS Everett
LF Lee
CF Taveras
RF Scott

SP Oswalt
SP Pettitte
SP Clemens
SP Williams
SP [Insert Name Here]

I doubt all those come to pass, though. I certainly think bringing in Schmidt and trading for Wells on top of all that is a pipe dream.

[Reuben]

I'm not so sure Bud Selig would approve Clemens starting for the Astros in between closing games for the Red Sox, but I suppose you can dream, buddy...

[Toe]

Factoring in the potential salaries, wouldn't this best-case type scenario still have a lower payroll than the 121 million at the end of '06? If Lee, Clemens, Pettitte, W.Williams, Huff, Ensberg all signed, the difference (Lee and Williams) would still not equal Bagwell's 19 million.

I guess what I'm wondering is, are there any indications that McLane will actually lower the payroll? If the early signings are indicative of current profits in baseball, then business is booming and the Astros are relatively as much a part of that as any other team.

[Arky Vaughan]

Quote:
Factoring in the potential salaries, wouldn't this best-case type scenario still have a lower payroll than the 121 million at the end of '06? If Lee, Clemens, Pettitte, W.Williams, Huff, Ensberg all signed, the difference (Lee and Williams) would still not equal Bagwell's 19 million.

I guess what I'm wondering is, are there any indications that McLane will actually lower the payroll? If the early signings are indicative of current profits in baseball, then business is booming and the Astros are relatively as much a part of that as any other team.

It depends on how much last year's payroll stretched over the budget McLane otherwise would have preferred. Recall that payroll grew in the late '90s in anticipation of the new ballpark, then the BUS opened, then everyone expected more but McLane said they'd already gotten the more over the previous couple of years. I could see payroll coming down if they're comfortable with the team they've put together and uncomfortable with the price tags of the shiny free agents left in the market. Also, bear in mind that it's still in play whether Bagwell's salary last year is ultimately on the books of the Astros or the insurance company, or more likely somewhere in between.