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General Discussion => Archive => Game Zone 2015 Archive => Topic started by: Mr. Happy on July 01, 2015, 03:21:34 pm
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Your lineups for tonight's tilt:
Royals
SSAlcides Escobar (R)
3BMike Moustakas (L)
DHLorenzo Cain (R)
1BKendrys Morales (S)
CSalvador Perez (R)
LFAlex Gordon (L)
RFAlex Rios (R)
2BOmar Infante (R)
CFJarrod Dyson (L)
KC: Edinson Volquez (R) (8-4, 3.18)
Astros
CF George Springer (R)
2B Jose Altuve (R)
LF Evan Gattis (R)
3B Luis Valbuena (L)
DH Chris Carter (R)
1B J. Singleton (L)
RF Preston Tucker (L)
SS Marwin Gonzalez (S)
C Jason Castro (L)
HOU: Vincent Velasquez (R) (0-0, 3.72)
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Tucker in right and Gattis in left. Springer better loosen up those legs.
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If the Astros can somehow pull off a win tonight, both the Royals and Astros will be 13 games over .500. The Astros will be 47-34 .580 and the Royals, who will still have the better record, would be at 44-31 .586.
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I wonder if any team has ever lead the league in both Home Runs and Stolen Bases at the end of a year. The Astros of course currently lead in both categories. I wish I knew how to look that stuff up.
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I wonder if any team has ever lead the league in both Home Runs and Stolen Bases at the end of a year. The Astros of course currently lead in both categories. I wish I knew how to look that stuff up.
Jason Stark beat you to the question (and has the answers...). A weird trifecta for those one-of-a-kind Astros (05/16/15) (http://espn.go.com/blog/jayson-stark/post/_/id/1231/a-weird-trifecta-for-those-one-of-a-kind-astros)
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God I hate MLB blackout rules. KC is 8 hours from me but I'm in their territory... so can't watch either team's feed on MLB.tv
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T1:
Two quick outs then Cain triples against the shift. Next pitch Morales homers to make it 2-0 Royals after one half.
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God I hate MLB blackout rules. KC is 8 hours from me but I'm in their territory... so can't watch either team's feed on MLB.tv
You realize broadcast territories in MLB are not based on distance from the stadium, right?
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You realize broadcast territories in MLB are not based on distance from the stadium, right?
We've been over it so much that I'm sure that everybody realizes it by now. It still doesn't make the territories rational, and it still doesn't mean that it's a good business decision.
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Jason Stark beat you to the question (and has the answers...). A weird trifecta for those one-of-a-kind Astros (05/16/15) (http://espn.go.com/blog/jayson-stark/post/_/id/1231/a-weird-trifecta-for-those-one-of-a-kind-astros)
Neat. Thanks.
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B2:
Springer singles off of Escobar's glove.
Altuve singles off of Escobar's glove.
Gattis strikes out in a pitch that bounces.
Double steal as Springer takes 3B and Altuve nabs 2B
Valbuena strikes out looking
Carter flies out to deep center
Astros strand two RISP as neither the 3 or 4 hitter can make contact.
2-0 Royals.
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We've been over it so much that I'm sure that everybody realizes it by now. It still doesn't make the territories rational, and it still doesn't mean that it's a good business decision.
1. I fail to see how it's not rational.
2. I doubt clubs would keep selling their broadcast rights if weren't a huge money maker.
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God I hate MLB blackout rules. KC is 8 hours from me but I'm in their territory... so can't watch either team's feed on MLB.tv
I thought you lived in Iowa? I've driven from Debuque to Kansas City in 6 hours, I didn't think you could get any further away and still be in Iowa.
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T2:
Single, wild pitch, single make it 3-0, nobody out b
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Anybody else find this All-Star ballot-box stuffing bush league?
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Anybody else find this All-Star ballot-box stuffing bush league?
Yes.
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Yes.
Thank you. I was sure it was just me.
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Holy shit. That strike three to Slngleton ran a foot over the plate. Unhittable.
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Thank you. I was sure it was just me.
This "1 man, 36 votes" is ridiculous. The Astros' pimping of Altuve is embarrassing.
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Nice pic by Singleton.
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This "1 man, 36 votes" is ridiculous. The Astros' pimping of Altuve is embarrassing.
I guess I'm not as easily embarrassed. Not that I agree with the process but I understand dealing with the nature of it.
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I guess I'm not as easily embarrassed. Not that I agree with the process but I understand dealing with the nature of it.
The system sucks. I wish the fan vote counted like 1/3rd of the final determination along with the players/coaches and maybe even the press. I think it used to be like that.
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That's two 400-ft outs now.
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That's two 400-ft outs now.
Ouch.
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That's two 400-ft outs now.
KC outfield is covering a lot of ground out there.
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That's two 400-ft outs now.
Place is a fucking bandbox.
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Place is a fucking bandbox.
It will be next year. Both of them would have been homers under the new configuration. I'm really not looking forward to them moving the fences in.
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Astros are not executing good field management with their flyballs.
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My wife says that Mexican pinata companies have started making Donald Trump pinatas. I wonder if anything comes out when you crack them open.
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My wife says that Mexican pinata companies have started making Donald Trump pinatas. I wonder if anything comes out when you crack them open.
Hot air?
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Ausmus for the win.
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It's really too bad that we can't just simulate the Gattis and Carter at bats and forgo the experience of ever having to watch them. That is basically how the front office determined that they are worth acquiring in the first place, so it would be apropos in a sense.
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Gee, I wonder how many Jewish players from Dartmouth the Astros have had?
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How do you not run his ass?
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Carter! Makes sure not to leave that one on the warning track
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I really hate Trump but in someways he continues to amaze me--mostly for being one of the hugest asses on the planet but also for all the shit he stirs and for some of his business ventures, so I don't hate him as much as people who I hate and don't find amazing. I believe he is a bit delusional and a total narcissist, however, there has probably never been a presidential candidate that wasn't, but the Donald is on a different level. He's a lunatic.
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All hail the King!
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Marwin!!
Makes it 3-2 to leadoff the 5th.
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I wish Zappa hadn't died. I'd love to vote for him again.
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Looks like the dreaded hamate
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Ouch!
Springer nailed on the wrist. Stays in the game, but my guess is he'll miss time over that.
Two on, nobody out for Altuve.
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Really hope that he is ok
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Fuck. Springer hit one inside of his right palm/wrist area. Staying in the game.
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Really hope that he is ok
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Yeah, you want a nightmare? "Now playing centerfield...Domingo Santana"
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Altuve! Finally some action with RISP. Springer looks like he's guarding/favoring the wrist going into 3b head first
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Runners on second and third no outs. We're toast.
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Altuve with a single...Castro scores to tie the game! Springer to 3B, Altuve to 2B. Still no outs for Gattis.
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Yeah, you want a nightmare? "Now playing centerfield...Domingo Santana"
His CF futility would most certainly not be as gritty as Biggio's was.
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Gattis singles to RF, Springer scores, Altuve scores. Gattis TOOTBLANed at 2B.
But Astros take a 5-3 lead.
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El Oso Blanco, the Lumberjack!
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Rasmus is back tonight. Don't know if he is ready to play yet. I would not be surprised to see Springer not go back to the field. He looked very pained sliding into third.
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Volquez looks shell-shocked.
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Can you TOOTBLAN out of the batter's box? If so, Valbuena may be eligible
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Volquez looks shell-shocked.
If by shell shocked you mean "make the next two guys look silly", yes he does.
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Those two ladies were playing Words with Friends, probably against my wife.
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Valbuena blew that one by twirling around like a ballerina on the third strike that got away from the catcher.
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If by shell shocked you mean "make the next two guys look silly", yes he does.
The shell-shocked sure didn't last long.
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Some guys when they first become shell shocked become reckless and fearless, then they succumb. One can hope next inning he succumbs.
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I hate it when people bring brooms. That is just asking for BBG ire.
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A Singleton Single!
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Where's Julia?
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I think the only thing worse would be to swing at one that hits you in the nuts.
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Yep. Springer out. I expect some time on the DL.
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I think Julia is in Nashville.
I got hit on the hip by a pitch I swung at once, it was painful and mortifying.
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I think Julia is in Nashville.
I got hit on the hip by a pitch I swung at once, it was painful and mortifying.
I once got hit in the nuts by a pitch I didn't swing at. Only time I ever coughed up blood.
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I don't know. I thought it caught more meat than bone. I also doubt he would have stayed in the field with a broken wrist or hand bone. It would have been apparent in warmups.
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If Santana has to stay in the big leagues, this team is fucked.
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If Santana has to stay in the big leagues, this team is fucked.
Should have pinch hit with Correa and moved Marwin to center.
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I once got hit in the nuts by a pitch I didn't swing at. Only time I ever coughed up blood.
Ouch.
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Should have pinch hit with Correa and moved Marwin to center.
Rasmus is at the yard. Don't know if he's an option to actually play or not though.
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Oh shit...Velasquez leaving with a lead. We all know what that means.
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Rasmus is at the yard. Don't know if he's an option to actually play or not though.
The use of Santana here should tell you.
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Fields in.
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Oh shit...Velasquez leaving with a lead. We all know what that means.
That he was laboring?
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That he was laboring?
Looked sharp on the last batter.
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The use of Santana here should tell you.
Well, it was a lefty on the mound. No surprise they went with a right handed PHer.
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That sucks.
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Yep...right on cue...2-out, 2-run triple with Yahoo in CF and another blown save for a Velasquez start.
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Well, it was a lefty on the mound. No surprise they went with a right handed PHer.
A single at bat versus lead protection late. What would you have done?
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Velasquez has now tied a Major League record for no-decisions to start a career, 5. Four of them he left with a lead the bullpen blew it.
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Vince with the ironic grin.
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A single at bat versus lead protection late. What would you have done?
I would have used Rasmus, if he's available. I don't want Santana anywhere near the field, if I have another option. But I can't speak for Hinch.
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At least Santana took a great route.
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I would have used Rasmus, if he's available. I don't want Santana anywhere near the field, if I have another option. But I can't speak for Hinch.
Me too. I'd bet Rasmus isn't available.
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I can only assume Rasmus is not ready.
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Santana's play had nothing to do with two runs scoring. They would have scored with anyone out there, but others might have held him to a double.
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So why pull Velasquez? 88 pitches (he's thrown more) and not laboring.
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Now Altuve drilled on the forearm.
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So why pull Velasquez? 88 pitches (he's thrown more) and not laboring.
Don't know. Manager's decision.
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Okay now that is too much shit from Royals pitching.
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So why pull Velasquez? 88 pitches (he's thrown more) and not laboring.
Got me. He did walk the leadoff hitter, but came back real nice against Gordon.
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Don't know. Manager's decision.
I'm not watching. Wondering if the reason had been said.
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Why is getting hit by a pitch not a perfect outcome?
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Altuve steals 2B. In scoring position with nobody out.
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I'm not watching. Wondering if the reason had been said.
No, other than it was now four times through the order, and Fields was ready.
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Gattis lines one off of Herrera. Bounces to Infante for an out and saved a run for now, but Altuve to 3B with one out.
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Is this the worst guy to have up in this situation?
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Is this the worst guy to have up in this situation?
He wanted no part of Valbuena. The ol' unintentional intentional walk. Double play in order.
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Is this the worst guy to have up in this situation?
Not if the ball runs into his bat.
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Carter with a chopper to 3B, Altuve beats the throw!
Astros retake the lead.
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Wow, that's bang bang.
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Challenge coming...doesn't look like enough to overturn
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You realize broadcast territories in MLB are not based on distance from the stadium, right?
Yes, I am aware... Doesn't mean I have to like it.
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Challenge coming...doesn't look like enough to overturn
Hasn't stopped them before.
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If it takes this long, you shouldn't touch the ruling.
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Call confirmed. Astros lead 6-5
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I can only assume Rasmus is not ready.
Brown said he spent time in the hospital today. Doesn't have his strength. Marisnick is 0-3 today with 2 Ks.
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Taking way too long.
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I thought you lived in Iowa? I've driven from Debuque to Kansas City in 6 hours, I didn't think you could get any further away and still be in Iowa.
Haven't driven it personally so it was a WAG... Far enough away to be a pain in the rump.. I'm in Cedar Rapids.
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Haven't driven it personally so it was a WAG... Far enough away to be a pain in the rump.. I'm in Cedar Rapids.
Get DirecTV.
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Singleton strikes out
Tucker grounds into FC to end the inning
But the Astros take the lead without getting a hit.
6-5, headed to the 8th.
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Get DirecTV.
Wife complains about it so no deal for now.. Too expensive for her tastes I guess..
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Wife complains about it so no deal for now.. Too expensive for her tastes I guess..
What do you have? It doesn't get FoxKC?
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Thatcher in to liven things up.
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Good job Thatcher.
I had absolutely no faith after the first three balls.
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Thatcher in to liven things up.
He may look ugly doing it but he gets his job done, again.
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Another great route by Santana.
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What do you have? It doesn't get FoxKC?
Free cable as part of a business internet package. For the vast majority of time MLB.tv suffices. And I hate to say it but it's a lot better in the AL.
I had DirecTV with the Sports Pak and life was grand. Then I got married.
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Another great route by Santana.
Yep. Hope he can find his way back to his position.
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Bullshit. Stupid ump.
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Neshek drills Morales. Both sides warned.
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Free cable as part of a business internet package. For the vast majority of time MLB.tv suffices. And I hate to say it but it's a lot better in the AL.
I had DirecTV with the Sports Pak and life was grand. Then I got married.
Wait a second...you let your wife tell you you have to give up DirecTV?
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Now he gives out a warning?
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Bullshit. Stupid ump.
Naw. It was bullshit, but I thought the ump calmed things down, so it was effective bullshit.
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Now he gives out a warning?
If he had given it out earlier Neshek would have been run.
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Wait a second...you let your wife tell you you have to give up DirecTV?
Hell, I was a vegetarian for four years. I think back and can hardly believe it my self.
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You're a good man.
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What a nice at bat.
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Ugh. Marisnick can't get back soon enough.
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Ugh. Marisnick can't get back soon enough.
Or Sptinger. Or Rasmus.
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Hell, I was a vegetarian for four years. I think back and can hardly believe it my self.
A friend of mine's wife wanted him to go to the jewelry show with him. He said no. She came home with a $5,000 bracelet. The next year, she asked again, and he again said "no, but don't buy a $5,000 bracelet this year." She came home with a $12,000 Rolex. The next year he went with her.
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Ugh. Marisnick can't get back soon enough.
Well, he's 0-4 wearing a golden sombrero tonight. But for only his D alone, yes.
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Tonight's the halfway point, isn't it?
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Tonight's the halfway point, isn't it?
Game #81. Let's hope they play more than that before it's over.
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Gregerson in for the save try
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1-2-3 9th, and the Astros come from behind to complete the sweep!!
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SWEEP!
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WE WIN! Great win against their vaunted pen.
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Gregerson in for the save try
FIELDS gets the Vulture Victory from Vince Velasquez. That is a VV ^ VV.
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Now to sweat out the Springer ding
er...
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FIELDS gets the Vulture Victory from Vince Velasquez. That is a VV ^ VV.
Why did they give the win to Gregerson rather than FIELDS?
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Why did they give the win to Gregerson rather than FIELDS?
Fields should get the win.
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Fields gets the win.
It was awarded to Gregerson in the box scores I'm seeing. Astros took the lead in the bottom of the seventh with Fields on the mound. Thatcher and Neshek pitched the 8th (Neshek with the last two outs). Then Gregerson in the 9th.
Fields should have the win, Thatcher and Neshek holds and Gregerson the save. But that's not what I'm seeing.
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It was awarded to Gregerson in the box scores I'm seeing. Astros took the lead in the bottom of the seventh with Fields on the mound. Thatcher and Neshek pitched the 8th (Neshek with the last two outs). Then Gregerson in the 9th.
Fields should have the win, Thatcher and Neshek holds and Gregerson the save. But that's not what I'm seeing.
You are correct. Fields was the pitcher of record when the Astros took the lead they never relinquished.
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Neshek should get the win.
I agree with that. There's discretion involved and Neshek nailed it down.
But it makes no sense to me that Gregerson gets the win and not a save.
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I agree with that. There's discretion involved and Neshek nailed it down.
But it makes no sense to me that Gregerson gets the win and not a save.
I was thinking the Astros took the lead in the 8th, but it was the 7th. Fields is the pitcher of record. There is no discretion.
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I agree with that. There's discretion involved and Neshek nailed it down.
But it makes no sense to me that Gregerson gets the win and not a save.
VV should get the victory by rule. I think the box is in error, a typo, or misprint.
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I was thinking the Astros took the lead in the 8th, but it was the 7th. Fields is the pitcher of record. There is no discretion.
If the reliever who should get the win based on the above rules was “ineffective in a brief appearance”, then the scorer has the right to award the win to the most effective subsequent relief pitcher.
Rule 10.17(c) (http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/official_scorer_10.jsp)
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According to the current box score (http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/gameday/index.jsp?gid=2015_07_01_kcamlb_houmlb_1#game=2015_07_01_kcamlb_houmlb_1,game_state=Wrapup,game_tab=box) Fields got a blown save, Thatcher and Neshek got holds and Gregerson got the win. That defies logic (not the blown save part).
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I mean FIELDS not VV.
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If the reliever who should get the win based on the above rules was “ineffective in a brief appearance”, then the scorer has the right to award the win to the most effective subsequent relief pitcher.
Rule 10.17(c) (http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/official_scorer_10.jsp)
I thought that only applies to when the starting pitcher doesn't qualify.
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VV should get the victory by rule. I think the box is in error, a typo, or misprint.
VV cannot get the win, by rule.
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I thought that only applies to when the starting pitcher doesn't qualify.
That was my understanding too.
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I thought that only applies to when the starting pitcher doesn't qualify.
The rule doesn't read that way to me. It's all about the pitcher of record when the team takes its final lead. There are exceptions that define how many innings it takes for a starter to qualify, but the winning pitcher is married to the unrelinquished lead.
Here's a fun bit:
Rule 10.17(b) Comment: It is the intent of Rule 10.17(b) that a relief pitcher pitch at least one complete inning or pitch when a crucial out is made, within the context of the game (including the score), in order to be credited as the winning pitcher. If the first relief pitcher pitches effectively, the official scorer should not presumptively credit that pitcher with the win, because the rule requires that the win be credited to the pitcher who was the most effective, and a subsequent relief pitcher may have been most effective. The official scorer, in determining which relief pitcher was the most effective, should consider the number of runs, earned runs and base runners given up by each relief pitcher and the context of the game at the time of each relief pitcher’s appearance. If two or more relief pitchers were similarly effective, the official scorer should give the presumption to the earlier pitcher as the winning pitcher.
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The rule doesn't read that way to me. It's all about the pitcher of record when the team takes its final lead. There are exceptions that define how many innings it takes for a starter to qualify, but the winning pitcher is married to the unrelinquished lead.
That's the way I understand it too. I thought Rule 10(b) and (c) were about how to award a win when the starter leaves with a lead, but doesn't qualify. But 10(c) may be read to mean you can't vulture a win without pitching at least one inning.
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That's the way I understand it too. I thought Rule 10(b) and (c) were about how to award a win when the starter leaves with a lead, but doesn't qualify. But 10(c) may be read to mean you can't vulture a win without pitching at least one inning.
I guess the one inning thing is what prevents Neshek from being awarded the win and Gregerson the save. That's a new one for me as well. Seems counter-intuitive.
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No win for Sphinx but a great recap. (http://www.orangewhoopass.com/?p=12781)
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10.17 Winning And Losing Pitcher
(a) The official scorer shall credit as the winning pitcher that pitcher whose team assumes a lead while such pitcher is in the game, or during the inning on offense in which such pitcher is removed from the game, and does not relinquish such lead, unless
(1) such pitcher is a starting pitcher and Rule 10.17(b) applies; or
(2) Rule 10.17(c) applies.
10.17(c) The official scorer shall not credit as the winning pitcher a relief pitcher who is ineffective in a brief appearance, when at least one succeeding relief pitcher pitches effectively in helping his team maintain its lead. In such a case, the official scorer shall credit as the winning pitcher the succeeding relief pitcher who was most effective, in the judgment of the official scorer.
Rule 10.17(c) Comment: The official scorer generally should, but is not required to, consider the appearance of a relief pitcher to be ineffective and brief if such relief pitcher pitches less than one inning and allows two or more earned runs to score (even if such runs are charged to a previous pitcher).
My reading of this and that first "OR" is that 10.17c can come into play any time not just when the starter doesn't qualify. It also looks like a scorer could ignore it. There is a "shall not" statement but then also "generally should, but not required to" that probably gives the scorer some leeway to not make that call.
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It's not just us. (https://twitter.com/brianmctaggart/status/616670477763899392)
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Based on this part of the Rule: "It is the intent of Rule 10.17(b) that a relief pitcher pitch at least one complete inning or pitch when a crucial out is made," it looks to me that Neshek should not be disqualified due to only pitching 2/3 of an inning.
Also "If two or more relief pitchers were similarly effective, the official scorer should give the presumption to the earlier pitcher as the winning pitcher." Gregerson and Neshek were very similarly effective. I suppose you could argue that Thatcher deserves the W, because he began the 8th inning (after the Astros re-took the lead) and retired the first batter, whereas Neshek did hit a batter while pitching 2/3 of an inning.
There is virtually no basis for giving it to Gregerson, unless you believe retiring the 2, 3, and 5-hitters in a 1-run game in the 8th inning don't qualify as "crucial outs".