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General Discussion => Talk Zone => Topic started by: ASTROCREEP on March 23, 2007, 10:55:47 am
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Kind of petty no?...
The Link
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No good deed goes unpunished. They seem to be 20 years too late in asking. This kind of thing just make me mad.
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What the fuck is going on in the league office? They have time to worry about this ridiculously petty offense?
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The Link
So this is the type of player speech that MLB needs to supress?
I'm glad Mr. Biggio is making noise about this. MLB should apologize.
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The Rockets coach wore a Sunshine Kids pin during a game, no word on whether the ghouls at the NBA (and they are there) were allowed to harass him about it. The Link
Biggio "If somebody wants to sit in an office and feel good about themselves, they should feel real bad about this one. They didn't think about all the cancer kids that get enjoyment out of it."
The Link
so far the story has been picked up by the San Jose, Phoenix, and Philadelphia papers.
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The Rockets coach wore a Sunshine Kids pin during a game, no word on whether the ghouls at the NBA (and they are there) were allowed to harass him about it. The Link
Biggio "If somebody wants to sit in an office and feel good about themselves, they should feel real bad about this one. They didn't think about all the cancer kids that get enjoyment out of it."
The Link
so far the story has been picked up by the San Jose, Phoenix, and Philadelphia papers.
I'm guessing that Rick Reilly will be all over this.
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So this is the type of player speech that MLB needs to supress?
I think the point is that they want to supress ALL individual decorations so that they don't have to review them on a case by case basis. For all we know, MLB could have told another player not to wear a pin, and he could have said "well why can't I wear mine if Biggio is wearing one?"
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So this is the type of player speech that MLB needs to supress?
I think the point is that they want to supress ALL individual decorations so that they don't have to review them on a case by case basis. For all we know, MLB could have told another player not to wear a pin, and he could have said "well why can't I wear mine if Biggio is wearing one?"
Perfect, the expected whiny child defense. Yes, why isn't it allowed? MLB has time to print bullshit certificates to molify teams that want to be co-division champions, they can sit Kate Feeney down and have her review every request from a player to wear a pin that supports his charity for young kids with terminal diseases. That shouldn't be too hard. One stamp that says "approved" should do it.
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So this is the type of player speech that MLB needs to supress?
I think the point is that they want to supress ALL individual decorations so that they don't have to review them on a case by case basis. For all we know, MLB could have told another player not to wear a pin, and he could have said "well why can't I wear mine if Biggio is wearing one?"
Perfect, the expected whiny child defense. Yes, why isn't it allowed? MLB has time to print bullshit certificates to molify teams that want to be co-division champions, they can sit Kate Feeney down and have her review every request from a player to wear a pin that supports his charity for young kids with terminal diseases. That shouldn't be too hard. One stamp that says "approved" should do it.
Couldn't take much longer than whatever paperwork and manhours were spent to coordinate blue bands and whatnot for prostate cancer awareness league-wide. And honestly, during Spring Training? Geesh. I hope whoever tattled is feeling slimy pretty soon.
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They want to keep the uniforms uniform. I don't have a problem with that.
That said, I think the perfect response from Biggio would be to carry around a Sunshine Kids sticker in his back pocket all year and slap it on his helmet right after he hits 3,000 when all the cameras are snapping.
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So this is the type of player speech that MLB needs to supress?
I think the point is that they want to supress ALL individual decorations so that they don't have to review them on a case by case basis. For all we know, MLB could have told another player not to wear a pin, and he could have said "well why can't I wear mine if Biggio is wearing one?"
Perfect, the expected whiny child defense. Yes, why isn't it allowed? MLB has time to print bullshit certificates to molify teams that want to be co-division champions, they can sit Kate Feeney down and have her review every request from a player to wear a pin that supports his charity for young kids with terminal diseases. That shouldn't be too hard. One stamp that says "approved" should do it.
... and San Diego can wear CAMO shirts in the REGULAR SEASON to honer the military, but Biggio can't wear a tiny star on his hat in SPRING TRAINING to promote cancer awareness in Children.
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They want to keep the uniforms uniform. I don't have a problem with that....
You don't have a problem with MLB stopping Craig Biggio wearing a pin in spring training that advertises a charity for kids with cancer? Just so they can keep the uniforms uniform?
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That shouldn't be too hard. One stamp that says "approved" should do it.
You expect Bud Selig to make a good, firm decision on anything? I am not quite that confident.
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You don't have a problem with MLB stopping Craig Biggio wearing a pin in spring training that advertises a charity for kids with cancer? Just so they can keep the uniforms uniform?
Can it be perceived as petty and slimy? Of course. But I see where MLB is coming from, they don't want everyone in the league wearing a different pin for whatever reason on their hat.
The camouflage jerseys and blue wrist bands are different because they ARE uniform and are worn by entire teams.
To answer your question, if I thought that removing the pin would result in one more kid getting cancer, of course I would be against it. But I hardly think that's the case.
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... But I see where MLB is coming from, they don't want everyone in the league wearing a different pin for whatever reason on their hat....
Why not?
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Read the article on the Astros site regarding Biggio's reaction. Biggio clearly knows what the rules are regarding his personal speech supporting a charity that he has a very long relationship with. He's not looking for special treatment, and hasn't for the last twenty years. More likely, Biggio's angry because one of the kids with cancer who knows why he wears the symbol on his hat every time he can might wonder why its not there.
I also got the impression that because of the way they covered the story on the site the team is behind Biggio on this one, if so, good for them.
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hat.
What the hell is a hat? There's no hats in baseball! It a freakin' cap.
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The camouflage jerseys and blue wrist bands are different because they ARE uniform and are worn by entire teams.
The blue breast cancer awareness bands are required? Source?
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Why not?
Because team uniforms shouldn't be used as billboards. It's one small reason why sports are better in the US than other countries.
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Why not?
Because team uniforms shouldn't be used as billboards. It's one small reason why sports are better in the US than other countries.
Wearing the pin and equating it with a billboard is a bit much.
With only a week left of Spring Training why didn't the commissioners office just tell the complaintant they were reviewing the issue and then continue to review it until the end of Spring Training instead of bringing up the issue?
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To answer your question, if I thought that removing the pin would result in one more kid getting cancer, of course I would be against it. But I hardly think that's the case.
There's a pretty reliable link between a person's emotional state and the course of their illness. There's also a reliable link between a person's emotional outlook and the emotions of the people around them. If wearing that pin helps 1 kid be happier, in turn helping his/her family be happier, in turn helping said kid fight cancer better...
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so far the story has been picked up by the San Jose, Phoenix, and Philadelphia papers.
To absolutely NOBODY's surprise, which paper is missing from this list?
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What the hell is a hat? There's no hats in baseball! It a freakin' cap.
Well I see you've found the fatal flaw in my point.
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The blue breast cancer awareness bands are required? Source?
They blue prostate cancer wristbands may not be required, but they are worn during a league-sponsored event.
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Why not?
Because team uniforms shouldn't be used as billboards. It's one small reason why sports are better in the US than other countries.
Are you unwilling to take the time to differentiate between a charity and a corporation? It's spring training, it's a small pin, it's on his cap.
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... and San Diego can wear CAMO shirts in the REGULAR SEASON to honer the military, but Biggio can't wear a tiny star on his hat in SPRING TRAINING to promote cancer awareness in Children.
I don't disagree with you, but the nit to pick here is that the entire team wore the same uniform. Biggio's pin is worn by him only.
The way to get around this is to have the entire team wear the pin.
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I can see where the league is coming from on this one. That being said, shame on them. Every organization with more than three people always has the one jackass that sets aside all common sense in order to enforce "the rules".
Is this not the same league that wanted pink bats to promote breast cancer awareness and Spider Man bases to promote a movie for chrissakes?
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To answer your question, if I thought that removing the pin would result in one more kid getting cancer, of course I would be against it. But I hardly think that's the case.
I think you are missing the point of the charity. Its not to find a cure or prevent the disease--its to support and encourage children who are living with cancer. I doubt you are against this either.
But the point isn't whether you are for or against the message, it's about Biggio's legitimate expectation that he had a right to wear it, in light of twenty years of practice.
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Yes. I don't like grey areas. My opinion. This doesn't mean I'm pro cancer, hate kids with cancer, want to see kids with cancer cry, or anything of the sort.
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The way to get around this is to have the entire team wear the pin.
Or better yet, have the entire team wear CAPS with just that Sunshine Kids logo for a day, like they did last year with the Space Shuttle CAPS.
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They blue prostate cancer wristbands may not be required, but they are worn during a league-sponsored event.
Here's were this issue jumps the shark. Anyone who's anyone should realise that any rings worn about the body to increase awareness of prostate cancer...should be brown.
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Or better yet, have the entire team wear CAPS with just that Sunshine Kids logo for a day, like they did last year with the Space Shuttle CAPS.
My work is done.
Right or wrong, it's still chickenshit to force him to remove it during spring training games. Didn't he wear it for pre-All Star game festivities in past years?
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Yes. I don't like grey areas. My opinion. This doesn't mean I'm pro cancer, hate kids with cancer, want to see kids with cancer cry, or anything of the sort.
I see where you're coming from, saves a lot of time having to think about stuff.
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I bet you don't watch a lot of nascar.
and just what is that little "swoosh" thing?
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To absolutely NOBODY's surprise, which paper is missing from this list?
You been outed, MM. It doesn't surprise me that Richard Justice does not read his own paper. Chron Link
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... and San Diego can wear CAMO shirts in the REGULAR SEASON to honer the military, but Biggio can't wear a tiny star on his hat in SPRING TRAINING to promote cancer awareness in Children.
I don't disagree with you, but the nit to pick here is that the entire team wore the same uniform. Biggio's pin is worn by him only.
The way to get around this is to have the entire team wear the pin.
The key to my post was to emphasize SPRING TRAINNG vs.REGULAR SEASON
and secondly, some would find controversy in honering the military as a whole, on the contrary there is NO controversy in the fight against kids with cancer.
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So I take a break from writing a paper on Biggio's involvement with the sunshine kids, and....
I read this?
Stupid.
The only good thing is the controversy may bring some more attention to the charity.
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So...how do players, during regular and post season games, get to wear necklaces and earrings?
Maybe Biggio should just wear the pin in his ear?
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Because they are affixed to the body (of which MLB cannot control) rather than the uniform (of which MLB can control).
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Then he needs a big sun head tat ala. Tyson.
Limey, I am still laughing about the brown rings. Great idea.
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And instead of U2 for his "up at bat" music, they should play "Here comes the Sun".
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Or how about a J Jackson sun nipple ring? Okay I am done.
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Why not?
Because team uniforms shouldn't be used as billboards. It's one small reason why sports are better in the US than other countries.
The obvious problem with this is that it should be a decision made on a case by case basis. If that were the position of the MLB, they would be years ahead of any sports entertainment league in terms of "getting it"! Unilateral, zero tolerance rules tend to bite one in the arse in some cases.
This is such a case.
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Maybe he could put the sun on his elbow pad?
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How about on his bat?
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Because they are affixed to the body (of which MLB cannot control) rather than the uniform (of which MLB can control).
You mean like Barry Bonds's wristbands?
eta: Ehhh...now that I think about it, I guess those could be, or are, considered part of the uniform.
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Yes. I don't like grey areas. My opinion. This doesn't mean I'm pro cancer, hate kids with cancer, want to see kids with cancer cry, or anything of the sort.
Friendly advice, if you have young children. Be careful when you are throwing out the bath water.
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Wouldn't the fact that Biggio has been wearing the pin in spring training for many years and no wave of copycatting has occurred to date undermine this premise? In fact, since so few of the games in ST are televised and attendance is much lower at the games, I would think that only a small pool of people know about it.
And you would think it would enter their mind this violation will go away after Biggio chooses to retire, which is certainly in the near future.
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Wouldn't the fact that Biggio has been wearing the pin in spring training for many years and no wave of copycatting has occurred to date undermine this premise? In fact, since so few of the games in ST are televised and attendance is much lower at the games, I would think that only a small pool of people know about it.
And you would think it would enter their mind this violation will go away after Biggio chooses to retire, which is certainly in the near future.
EGGSZACTLY! There is a place for common sense and case by case evaluation by the MLB before they open their mouths (or at least one person opens said mouth) and sticks the entire foot, ankle and knee joint. Had someone, anyone just spent a moment or two to *evaluate* the situation, they would've just let it go.
Instead, they reacted to a rule and that will sometimes lead to the wrong... very wrong... opinion. If we lose the ability to evaluate and judge correctly, we lose the ability to just flat out think for ourselves. If I were walking past a burning office building and the only path left for me to try and rescue a person trapped inside were to run through the manicured lawn, I'd do it.
Even if there were a sign stating I should "Keep Off The Lawn... NO EXCEPTIONS!". Silly of me to even entertain beyond a half a nano-second the validity of the rule over the situation at hand.
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On the sunny side:
How many of us were aware of the pin or the foundation before today? How many people are more aware because of the controversy? This may have done more good for the foundation itself than being worn in two more weeks of meaningless games where Biggio will get token playing time.
Another take:
Maybe the reason they had to enforce was someone else said "Well, Craig does it". Many policy enforcements come with someone points out an inconsistency.
Last thought:
Biggio should have the logo Tattoed on his arm. He gets alot of close ups due to all the HBP he takes and ground balls he fields. The foundation would get more exposure that way.
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Maybe MLB should remove these items from the shelves, after all, I see a sunshine pin...
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On the sunny side:
How many of us were aware of the pin or the foundation before today?
*hand raised*
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How many people are more aware because of the controversy? This may have done more good for the foundation itself than being worn in two more weeks of meaningless games where Biggio will get token playing time.
But awareness wasn't the reason to do it, as far as I know. He does it to let the Sunshine Kids know he's thinking of them. Sort of the same difference as the free throw gesture the Utah Jazz player came up with prior to shooting a free throw to let his kids know he was thinking of them.
The MLB is just way out on a limb on this one. IMHO of course.
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Another take:
Maybe the reason they had to enforce was someone else said "Well, Craig does it". Many policy enforcements come with someone points out an inconsistency.
Frankly, if another *player* were to use Biggio's spring training gesture as a ploy to get his own way on a uniform violation, then said player is the problem, not Biggio nor his gesture. Application is not the issue, the issue is that it is not as harmful as it can be when some players will make personal statements out of this sort of allowance. It is akin to players policing themselves on the field. You hit my batter, I hit yours, we're done.
If another player dared to take Biggio's gesture and apply to a casino sponsorship... I'd be in line with other players ready to kick his arse behind the clubhouse at spring training. Is *this* what the MLB is worried about? If so, they have absolutely no worries whatsoever.
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Last thought:
Biggio should have the logo Tattoed on his arm. He gets alot of close ups due to all the HBP he takes and ground balls he fields. The foundation would get more exposure that way.
It's not about exposure, it's about a goodwill gesture to a handful of kids.
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gaining momentum The Link
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On the sunny side:
How many of us were aware of the pin or the foundation before today?
At the risk of sounding like a jackass... anyone who's watched Biggio play for more than 10 minutes.
His stock mugshot on FSN shows him in the pin. And broadcaster bring up the topic all of the time. I would think even the most casual of fans know about Biggio's involvement with the Sunshine Kids.
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Wouldn't the fact that Biggio has been wearing the pin in spring training for many years and no wave of copycatting has occurred to date undermine this premise? In fact, since so few of the games in ST are televised and attendance is much lower at the games, I would think that only a small pool of people know about it.
And you would think it would enter their mind this violation will go away after Biggio chooses to retire, which is certainly in the near future.
EGGSZACTLY! There is a place for common sense and case by case evaluation by the MLB before they open their mouths (or at least one person opens said mouth) and sticks the entire foot, ankle and knee joint. Had someone, anyone just spent a moment or two to *evaluate* the situation, they would've just let it go.
Instead, they reacted to a rule and that will sometimes lead to the wrong... very wrong... opinion. If we lose the ability to evaluate and judge correctly, we lose the ability to just flat out think for ourselves. If I were walking past a burning office building and the only path left for me to try and rescue a person trapped inside were to run through the manicured lawn, I'd do it.
Even if there were a sign stating I should "Keep Off The Lawn... NO EXCEPTIONS!". Silly of me to even entertain beyond a half a nano-second the validity of the rule over the situation at hand.
Common sense is not all that common anymore. Especially in the MLB front office.
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Tomorrow they're going to suspend Tiny Tim for using corked crutches...
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To answer your question, if I thought that removing the pin would result in one more kid getting cancer, of course I would be against it. But I hardly think that's the case.
There's a pretty reliable link between a person's emotional state and the course of their illness. There's also a reliable link between a person's emotional outlook and the emotions of the people around them. If wearing that pin helps 1 kid be happier, in turn helping his/her family be happier, in turn helping said kid fight cancer better...
Bingo!
Several years ago one of my lymphoma patients used to wear a Mario Lemieux hockey jersey around the hospital. Lemieux beat the disease himself and was a constant source of inspiration to a young lady who otherwise had little reason to feel inspired. Often children and young people with serious or chronic illnesses, who have yet to develop their own identity or self-image, come to be defined by their disease. Essentially their identity becomes 'kid with cancer'. They become different from everyone else, or special in a negative way, because of their disease. When Biggio wears his pin he also makes them feel special but in this case being special is a positive thing. This isn't just a lovey-dovey feel-good theory. This type of thing really does matter to these kids and it really does have an impact.
MLB seems very petty and small-minded right now.
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Anyone who's anyone should realise that any rings worn about the body to increase awareness of prostate cancer...should be brown.
I'm thinking white would be a more appropriate color for prostate awareness. Now on the other hand if you are refering to colon cancer, then brown would be an outstanding choice.
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Several years ago one of my lymphoma patients used to wear a Mario Lemieux hockey jersey around the hospital. Lemieux beat the disease himself ...
That's the "good Hodgkins," right? Charlie, the orphan son on the TV show "Party of Five," had "good Hodgkins."
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Several years ago one of my lymphoma patients used to wear a Mario Lemieux hockey jersey around the hospital. Lemieux beat the disease himself ...
That's the "good Hodgkins," right? Charlie, the orphan son on the TV show "Party of Five," had "good Hodgkins."
Umm... no. "good lymphoma" is referred to as Hodgkins Disease while regular old nasty lymphoma is referred to as lymphoma.
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Several years ago one of my lymphoma patients used to wear a Mario Lemieux hockey jersey around the hospital. Lemieux beat the disease himself ...
That's the "good Hodgkins," right? Charlie, the orphan son on the TV show "Party of Five," had "good Hodgkins."
Umm... no. "good lymphoma" is referred to as Hodgkins Disease while regular old nasty lymphoma is referred to as lymphoma.
Eggzactly! Mario Lemieux had the "good Hodgkins," not non-Hodgkins.
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Vinnie, who works in the MLB Public Relations department, gives a royal rats ass what you think, The Link
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The thing that really stinks is that MLB could have made this right and correct their fuck up, by immediately issuing a press release with a formal apology admitting that someone (they don't need to make it a headhunt and publicly name anyone) used poor judgement, are retracting their decision, and possibly make a donation to the foundation. That would have went a long way, and not only would it have been the right thing, it would have allowed MLB turn negative into a positive.
Instead, they choose to publicly "decline commenting" on the issue and that is just the biggest pile horse shit that I've heard in a long long time. Their hope is to sweep it all under the mat and hope that the entire issue will just go away.
I would bet that if this happened to the Yankees organization it would have made the front page headlines on every media across the nation, and the PR machine at MLB would have been dealing with this matter rather than burying their heads in the sand.
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Biggio's pin approved by MLB (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4676830.html)
Biggio, who has been wearing the pin during spring training games his entire career, adorned the pin for the second consecutive game Friday night after the Astros received word from the commissioner's office Wednesday it would be allowed.
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Biggio's pin approved by MLB (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4676830.html)
MLB approved it...yea, like he cared. He had it on at the Astros/Express game. Probably some newby brown nosing do-gooder bucking for a promotion at MLB rasing the stink. Now they're incharge of replacing the unrinal cakes.