Feliz up, Marisnick down

[MusicMan]

Per Tags tweet.

Wtf?


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[BudGirl]

I get it they need pitching and Jake has options.  I still think it would have been good to have Gomez sit for a bit to cool himself off.

[MusicMan]

I get it they need pitching and Jake has options. 

Giles has options too.

[BudGirl]

Giles has options too.

I don't know, I was just guessing.  But why not send Jake down, he'll probably get to play.

[HudsonHawk]

I don't know, I was just guessing.  But why not send Jake down, he'll probably get to play.

Why not send Giles down, he can't get out big league hitters.

[BudGirl]

Again, I don't know.  I have been wanting Marisnick to play for a while now and do not know why that hasn't happened either.  Sounds like you all need to tweet Luhnow and ask him.

[Fredia]

strange hope there is some kind of explanation

[das]

Why not send Giles down, he can't get out big league hitters.

This. 

Watching the game last night, I got the distinct sense that Giles was the last resort that Hinch was going to go to and my preemptive cringing started as soon as Gregerson had delivered the last pitch of his two solid innings.

[Mr. Happy]

Why not send Giles down, he can't get out big league hitters.

I watched Giles pitch last night.He had little command, so I agree with you. He needs to go down and work on things.

[jbm]

Y'all are probably right about Giles (I've seen very little of him), but sending him down is unlikely at this point.  The optics would be terrible.

[Mr. Happy]

Y'all are probably right about Giles (I've seen very little of him), but sending him down is unlikely at this point.  The optics would be terrible.

You're probably right.

[das]

Y'all are probably right about Giles (I've seen very little of him), but sending him down is unlikely at this point.  The optics would be terrible.

How so?  It's not uncommon for people to bounce between the Bigs and AAA as they transition.  Heck, he started last year in AA and pitched in 13 games there before even moving to AAA and pitching there for another 11 before moving up to an awful Philly team.

Never been a big fan of "optics".  Do what's right for the person and for the team that helps win in the short and long term.  He's doing nothing to help the team win now and ironing things out in lower-pressure AAA will potentially help them win in the long term.

[juliogotay]

Jake needs to play somewhere and get some ABs. Maybe they want him sharp to replace Gomez if he doesn't get it going?

[HudsonHawk]

Again, I don't know.  I have been wanting Marisnick to play for a while now and do not know why that hasn't happened either.  Sounds like you all need to tweet Luhnow and ask him.

I agree.  There is nothing that Gomez does that Marisnick doesn't do as well or better.  I don't know why Marisnick is in Hinch's dog house, but at least this gets him some PT. 

[BudGirl]

So, I was checking out the Astros payroll and realized there could be a very different team next season if some players don't start improving.

last year in FA contract:  Gomez, Feldman, Fister, Valbuena, Castro, and Rasmus

I wouldn't put Rasmus with those others, but I could definitely see five of those guys on a block.

[HudsonHawk]

Y'all are probably right about Giles (I've seen very little of him), but sending him down is unlikely at this point.  The optics would be terrible.

I'll tell you what would look terrible...a record of 51-111, which is where the Astros are headed if they don't put more thought into winning than stroking egos. 

[HudsonHawk]

So, I was checking out the Astros payroll and realized there could be a very different team next season if some players don't start improving.

last year in contract:  Gomez, Feldman, Fister, Valbuena, Castro, and Rasmus

I wouldn't put Rasmus with those others, but I could definitely see five of those guys on a block.

I'd want to keep Rasmus.  But there is absolutely no reason to keep any of those other four. 

[Navin R Johnson]

They gave up a bunch for Gomez, they appear to have decided they are going to just keep playing him and crossing their fingers hoping he will figure it out, despite Gomez hindering the teams chances to win.

[jbm]

I'll tell you what would look terrible...a record of 51-111, which is where the Astros are headed if they don't put more thought into winning than stroking egos.

I'm not saying he deserves to be on the team, but when a GM gives up a ton of shit for a closer (who then becomes a setup man), the GM isn't likely to say "Hey, I'm giving up on this guy, and my plan for the back of the bullpen, on 19 games of performance."  This is just a reality, not a value judgement.

[HudsonHawk]

I'm not saying he deserves to be on the team, but when a GM gives up a ton of shit for a closer (who then becomes a setup man), the GM isn't likely to say "Hey, I'm giving up on this guy, and my plan for the back of the bullpen, on 19 games of performance."  This is just a reality, not a value judgement.

I don't recall anyone suggesting Giles be released. But to continue to run him out to get his ass kicked in and the team lose simply because "well, we paid a lot for him" isn't a winning strategy either.

[Mr. Happy]

I don't recall anyone suggesting Giles be released. But to continue to run him out to get his ass kicked in and the team lose simply because "well, we paid a lot for him" isn't a winning strategy either.

Exactly. Giles is not helping at all right now.

[MusicMan]

Exactly. Giles is not helping at all right now.

The problem is that very few guys on the roster ARE helping right now.

[Mr. Happy]

The problem is that very few guys on the roster ARE helping right now.

I understand, but Giles has allowed runs in more than half of his performances, which is awful. I haven't seen triple digit heat yet either. His fastball looks pretty straight right now, and he can't locate it.

[HudsonHawk]

The problem is that very few guys on the roster ARE helping right now.

Aside from Giles and Fields, the bullpen has been very good.  Devenski, Gregerson, and Harris have been terrific.  Sipp and Neshek have been fine.  Yes there are many holes on this team, but the holes are consistent and clear.  Giles has been a big one. 

Couple that with Gattis and Gomez with OPSs of .462 and .471, respectively, with 0 HRs and 2 RBIs combined.  I know it appears that the whole team is a wreck, but it's really just a handful of guys who are simply dead weight.  Unfortunately, it's the few guys who are absolute "must deliver". 

[hostros7]

I would have tried to convince Gomez that he's suffered a mild injury (non-neurological, although that may be the worst of it), let him rest for several days, think about adding him to the DL retroactive, and get Jake some ABs and playing time while Gomez hopefully benefits from the time off. The team needs Gomez to figure it out if it is to be a contender. Whatever the fuck you call what he does at the plate three to five teams a night doesn't seem to be helping.

[Jacksonian]

Aside from Giles and Fields, the bullpen has been very good.  Devenski, Gregerson, and Harris have been terrific.  Sipp and Neshek have been fine.  Yes there are many holes on this team, but the holes are consistent and clear.  Giles has been a big one. 

Couple that with Gattis and Gomez with OPSs of .462 and .471, respectively, with 0 HRs and 2 RBIs combined.  I know it appears that the whole team is a wreck, but it's really just a handful of guys who are simply dead weight.  Unfortunately, it's the few guys who are absolute "must deliver".

Though I agree with your assessment of the bullpen I'll disagree to a certain extent with the rest.  The offense, even with its holes, is 5th in the league in runs scored and been fairly consistent at putting up 4-5 runs a night.  The starting rotation with the exception of Kuechel (pitching like a #3 rather than ace is only bad right now because the other have been horrible) is putrid.  The starters are third worst in the AL in ERA.

[Arky Vaughan]

Gomez played better with an intercostal strain than he's playing healthy right now.

Something is screwed up with Giles. It may be an injury, it may just be mechanics and location, but whatever it is, the experiment of letting him pitch through it against live big-league hitting isn't working. If it takes a few weeks in Fresno to fix it, so be it.

I'm a huge fan of Chris Devinski, and not just because he's pitching great. The guy was the friendliest I've ever seen to kids at spring training. Of course, most big-leaguers who aren't pricks treat kids well, but Devinski really seemed to be enjoying being there and interacting. A real class act, in my book.

[HudsonHawk]

Though I agree with your assessment of the bullpen I'll disagree to a certain extent with the rest.  The offense, even with its holes, is 5th in the league in runs scored and been fairly consistent at putting up 4-5 runs a night.  The starting rotation with the exception of Kuechel (pitching like a #3 rather than ace is only bad right now because the other have been horrible) is putrid.  The starters are third worst in the AL in ERA.

Starting pitching has certainly been an issue.  I was focused mainly on the perceived issues with the bullpen and hitting, but obviously SP has got to get better.  That said, there have been a number of games where some guys didn't pitch great, but pitched well enough to win, and got nothing to show for it. 

As for runs scored, that's one of the more misleading stats out there, especially in a small sample size.  You've gotten very little from almost half of the lineup and absolutely nothing from Gattis and Gomez, two guys who absolutely *must* be run producers if this team is to go anywhere.  The league has figured out White, and he's been awful for about 10 games now.  I don't expect he'll stay in the big leagues through May.   

[Navin R Johnson]

I would have tried to convince Gomez that he's suffered a mild injury (non-neurological, although that may be the worst of it), let him rest for several days, think about adding him to the DL retroactive, and get Jake some ABs and playing time while Gomez hopefully benefits from the time off. The team needs Gomez to figure it out if it is to be a contender. Whatever the fuck you call what he does at the plate three to five teams a night doesn't seem to be helping.

And if Gomez doesn't want to do that, then Marwin and Preston should start alternating at LF and Rasmus playing CF.   Gomez is completely lost. 

[Jose Cruz III]

The problem is that very few guys on the roster ARE helping right now.

Astro players have won AL Player of the Week 3 times. But they seem to be having problems all doing it together. When you get past the 5 spot in the lineup it gets ugly. And the last week or so it's been when you get past the 4 hole. And the 3 hole hasn't been very good either. Add in not very good starting pitching and Giles and you have the makings of losing as many games as we won last year. Giles needs to go down. Period. I wonder who loses their spot in the rotation when McCullers gets back.

[moriartp]

I wonder who loses their spot in the rotation when McCullers gets back.

It's a pretty tight race. They're all fighting hard for it right now.

[HudsonHawk]

Astro players have won AL Player of the Week 3 times. But they seem to be having problems all doing it together. When you get past the 5 spot in the lineup it gets ugly. And the last week or so it's been when you get past the 4 hole. And the 3 hole hasn't been very good either.

With RISP, Correa is hitting .136, Gomez .133, Valbuena .154, Castro .083 and Gattis .080.  They have struck out 78 times and left 52 runners on base in the last week alone, with 0 HRs between the five of them. 

Add in the supernova of suck that White has become, hitting .040 with 10 strikeouts and 18 LOB in the last 8 games, and that's 2/3rds of your lineup a complete disaster. 

[Jacksonian]

Devinski to start Saturday for Feldman.

ETA: I could spell better.

[Navin R Johnson]

Jeff talking about Feldman pitching out of the pen on the radio right now.   "it is something he has never done, we will see how he does..."

[Navin R Johnson]

If you want to listen, he is on from 7-8 CST.

Can stream here

http://www.sports790.com/

[jbm]

Has Feldman been worse than the others, or do they just think he will adjust better to bullpen work?

[mrpink]

Jeff talking about Feldman pitching out of the pen on the radio right now.   "it is something he has never done, we will see how he does..."

Was he joking?

[Navin R Johnson]

2nd calls asks about Giles....

Jeff thinks Giles will be fine, has had some bad luck....

Also at the end of the Giles talk, says he has heard that a lot of people calling this an "analytic"  trade, says it had nothing to do with analytics, it was all about scouting....

[austro]

Jeff thinks Giles will be fine, has had some bad luck....

I imagine that's what he has to say, but there's been nothing "unlucky" about the swings people have been putting on his pitches.

[Jacksonian]

I imagine that's what he has to say, but there's been nothing "unlucky" about the swings people have been putting on his pitches.

At least 2 of the homers to lose games he's given up were hanging sliders. That's bad pitching.

[Navin R Johnson]

Couple more takeaways.   He raved about Moran, I wouldn't surprised to see him up soon.   Talked about Reed, said he started slow but is doing better now, said he always thought AJ need 3-4 months in AAA before he would be ready.

From his comments on Gomez, if you were hoping he would be given time off, you are out of look.  Luhnow still loves Gomez.

[Jacksonian]

Couple more takeaways.   He raved about Moran, I wouldn't surprised to see him up soon.   Talked about Reed, said he started slow but is doing better now, said he always thought AJ need 3-4 months in AAA before he would be ready.

From his comments on Gomez, if you were hoping he would be given time off, you are out of look.  Luhnow still loves Gomez.

Nothing surprising there.  Reed always seems to start slow at a new level.

[juliogotay]

Nothing surprising there.  Reed always seems to start slow at a new level.

And he's always loved Moran.

[juliogotay]

2nd calls asks about Giles....

Jeff thinks Giles will be fine, has had some bad luck....

Also at the end of the Giles talk, says he has heard that a lot of people calling this an "analytic"  trade, says it had nothing to do with analytics, it was all about scouting....

I fully believe that. If you read what Luhnow said about Giles after the deal was made it was his "stuff". 

[Jacksonian]

I fully believe that. If you read what Luhnow said about Giles after the deal was made it was his "stuff".

Kyle Farnsworth had stuff.  But he never had it upstairs to be a closer.

[Jacksonian]

I can't help but think at the moment that the Gomez and Giles trades may have nearly undone all the work Luhnow had done to build the majors and minor league system.  Combine that with missing on Appel and to a lesser extent Aiken and the volume of talent is thin enough that I'm a bit nervous they won't be able to fill the major league holes in less than 3 years.

[Arky Vaughan]

I can't help but think at the moment that the Gomez and Giles trades may have nearly undone all the work Luhnow had done to build the majors and minor league system.  Combine that with missing on Appel and to a lesser extent Aiken and the volume of talent is thin enough that I'm a bit nervous they won't be able to fill the major league holes in less than 3 years.

At the very least, particularly after Appel and Aiken, I'm skeptical that the system will produce the elite starting pitching necessary for this franchise to be a perennial contender. Assuming this team bounces back to something around .500, the priority this offseason should be to spend some of the money Crane has saved over the last few years to buy one or two top-shelf starters.

[JimR]

At least 2 of the homers to lose games he's given up were hanging sliders. That's bad pitching.

No, that is just pitching. You are going to hang some. The bad luck is every damn hanging slider winds up getting hit.

[Jacksonian]

At the very least, particularly after Appel and Aiken, I'm skeptical that the system will produce the elite starting pitching necessary for this franchise to be a perennial contender. Assuming this team bounces back to something around .500, the priority this offseason should be to spend some of the money Crane has saved over the last few years to buy one or two top-shelf starters.

As regards Appel, in hindsight, they weren't going to come away with elite starting pitching.  The only other starting pitcher they would have taken was Jon Gray.  He's been better than Appel (and therefore would have added more value to the organization than Appel) but hasn't been elite.  Aiken's value was utter projection.  The loss there was the loss in volume in that they also didn't get Nix and possibly Marshall.  They did get Bregman for the loss of Aiken.

[Navin R Johnson]

No, that is just pitching. You are going to hang some. The bad luck is every damn hanging slider winds up getting hit.

And he has had some shit defense behind him.  Valbuena or White (cant remember which one) dropped a lazy fly ball in the IF in his last outing.   

Watching Giles right now reminds me of Lidge in 2006.  Everything that could go wrong has for Giles.

[BudGirl]

And he has had some shit defense behind him.  Valbuena or White (cant remember which one) dropped a lazy fly ball in the IF in his last outing.   

Watching Giles right now reminds me of Lidge in 2006.  Everything that could go wrong has for Giles.

To me, they even favor each other in looks.

[BUWebguy]

I can't help but think at the moment that the Gomez and Giles trades may have nearly undone all the work Luhnow had done to build the majors and minor league system.  Combine that with missing on Appel and to a lesser extent Aiken and the volume of talent is thin enough that I'm a bit nervous they won't be able to fill the major league holes in less than 3 years.

Imagine if they had taken Buxton over Correa...

[Jacksonian]

Imagine if they had taken Buxton over Correa...

Credit where it's due.

[juliogotay]

To me, they even favor each other in looks.

Now that you mention it...

[Reuben]

Credit where it's due.

Imagine if Appel had accepted their reported offer, and they had taken Appel instead of Correa/McCullers...

I don't quite understand the gloom and doom about the overall state of the organization. Yeah, the talent given up in the Gomez/Fiers and Giles deals made me scratch my head a little, but they've still got lots of really interesting talent in the system. And the MLB roster is still loaded with talent, despite the month of April.

[astrosfan76]

As regards Appel, in hindsight, they weren't going to come away with elite starting pitching.  The only other starting pitcher they would have taken was Jon Gray.  He's been better than Appel (and therefore would have added more value to the organization than Appel) but hasn't been elite.  Aiken's value was utter projection.  The loss there was the loss in volume in that they also didn't get Nix and possibly Marshall.  They did get Bregman for the loss of Aiken.

I remember Kohl Stewart being a possibility in '13, as well.  He's still a couple of years away, but he's looked pretty good this far.  Probably not going to be an elite starter, but he's developing nicely in the Twins systems.  That said, I didn't feel that they had picked the wrong guy that day.  If you want to look back, it's pretty obvious whose made the biggest impact, so far, but it is what it is.  I'm pretty sure Bryant can't through 96 with a plus slider.     

[Texifornia]

Watching Giles right now reminds me of Lidge in 2006.

Not trusting his stuff?

[Navin R Johnson]

Tipping his pitches

[Russ99]

Can we dump Valbuena while we're at it and bring up Moran?

We're only 10 games below .500, but we need to turn it around now.

Ruffling feathers about bad trades and worrying about service time should be the least of our concerns.

[Nate Colbert]

After hitting a robust .185 for Fresno with 10 whiffs in 27 ABs, Marisnick being recalled and Feliz goes back down.

Marisnick will start in LF tomorrow, Twitter also tells me.

[Jacksonian]

After hitting a robust .185 for Fresno with 10 whiffs in 27 ABs, Marisnick being recalled and Feliz goes back down.

Marisnick will start in LF tomorrow, Twitter also tells me.

It's not exactly a time I would have thought they could do without the extra pitcher.

[jbm]

This is sort of a head scratcher.  Maybe it is to prepare Feliz for a rotation spot.  He's been good lately, but he might be better served by getting regular work.  Not the best explanation, but Marisnick centered explanations don't seem compelling.

[Fredia]

alien mind control. only rational explanation

[Nate Colbert]

Sipp placed on paternity list. Apparently that counts as an "injury" so that Feliz doesn't have to serve out his 10 days in the minors and can be recalled immediately.

[das]

For anyone that saw the game, I did not see Marisnick play last night, only his 0-fer in the box score today. How did he look in the batters box?  Any better?

[austro]

For anyone that saw the game, I did not see Marisnick play last night, only his 0-fer in the box score today. How did he look in the batters box?  Any better?

I think I remember him hitting one ball well, but it was a line out to center.